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The internet is used for two things: arguing with people you don't know and porn. Anything else is just a way to find the next argument. Check out Twitter and look up Chick-Fil-A and see the droning about how chicken sandwiches will start the next civil war in the US. I would go on and be more sarcastic but i'm sure I would violate one if not more dakka rules because someone would deem it hate speech and get their panties in a wad when i'm doing nothing but being sarcastic. If you wasn't to see a classic troll, look up Adam Smith and Chick-Fil-A and read the comments and other video responses. You'll see why America its going downhill rather quickly.

boyd wrote:The internet is used for two things: arguing with people you don't know and porn. Anything else is just a way to find the next argument. Check out Twitter and look up Chick-Fil-A and see the droning about how chicken sandwiches will start the next civil war in the US. I would go on and be more sarcastic but i'm sure I would violate one if not more dakka rules because someone would deem it hate speech and get their panties in a wad when i'm doing nothing but being sarcastic. If you wasn't to see a classic troll, look up Adam Smith and Chick-Fil-A and read the comments and other video responses. You'll see why America its going downhill rather quickly.

I do not believe that USA is going down hill, rather the whole world is going down hill. These are bad times my friends for everyone trying to earn an honest living.

Ratius wrote:Been on every forum since the dawn of da webz.
Make a contribution to a thread, enjoy it if it educates you, leave it if it dosent.
And simply ignore the flotsum.

I'm off to hug a big tree

Okay that is funny and yet very true +1 from me

Not just the internet.

I think dakka posts reflect upon the game of warhammer quite nicely actually.

By the third turn in a game the nerds get all bitchy and argumentative. My guess is they have been twinkie-deficient for too long.

Dakka threads are no different. And eventually, inevitably the neckbeards will rage, spittle will fly, and so much man flesh will be exposed from under superman t-shirts.

The whole thing makes me laugh. This game is not capable of being competetive. It's supposed to be for fun.

Since this is second page:
(Hijackattempt)

Did anyone notice, the only pair of boobs in the dakka gallery belong to a dood?

Ha...haha....figgers....

Big'Uns wrote:so much man flesh will be exposed from under superman t-shirts.

MetalOxide wrote:

Big'Uns wrote:so much man flesh will be exposed from under superman t-shirts.

LMAO! That wins this tread, now we know why all neckbeards stink to high heaven. They are Uruks in disguise

Big'Uns wrote:

Did anyone notice, the only pair of boobs in the dakka gallery belong to a dood?

These belong to a girl, you should get out more.

I love the irony that on page one of this thread there was an emerging flame war, and that it's actually gone massively off-topic already.

A lot of people seem to make the mistake of assuming being better than someone else is the same as actually being good. And so we get status games designed for people to reassure themselves that "Well, maybe I'm geeky / in poor physical condition / don't have much success with women, but I'm nowhere near as bad as that guy!"

Indeed, the most vocal condemnations of excessive nerdiness I see on the internet usually come from other nerds. A comparison that comes to mind is communities based around romance novel readers and authors, another subculture that tends to have a lot of unflattering stereotypes and sniggering directed at them from the outside, but their ire is usually directed at their critics rather than one of their own who's a little bit "worse" in some highly subjective way.

MeanGreenStompa wrote:

Big'Uns wrote:

Did anyone notice, the only pair of boobs in the dakka gallery belong to a dood?

These belong to a girl, you should get out more.

That's gotta be a photoshop

I know. Dat Falcon...

In order to reduce the gumbling, moaning and bellyaching of a few vocal and uninteresting dakka members i just engaged the ignore setting. By removing the posting of just a few of these individuals I have greatly enhanced my dakka experience.

If the groaners and whiners are getting you down i would suggest doing the same.

Saying we play with 'little plastic men' has always sounded sad to me...

It's like saying that those into football like to watch a bunch of sweaty guys kick a leather sack between some posts in the ground...

Unfortunately, one of those would probably get you laid more often.

Which brings us to... self loathing on forums, followed closely by open tabs with online porn.

I like to think mini-wargaming as any other strategy games you can get on the PC/console, but with a lot more freedom, customization and randomness. I see my self as an arm-chair general; sitting in a chair whilst in control of a mighty army on some war-torn world.

I don't play with little plastic men... Uh, they're PEWTER thank you very much.
Feel free to insert the obligatory Finecast is worse than metal comment here if you like.

snowman40k wrote:Saying we play with 'little plastic men' has always sounded sad to me...

Agreed, so instead I now say "I'm in to Warhammer. It's a multi dimensional board game in which the only restrictions are your own imagination and the roll of a die, and how that plays out against a series of charts and rules. It combines the strategic elements of chess, with the freedom of art, the narrative of a damn good book and the friendly rivalry of a sports game". Makes it sound more interesting to the uninitiated.

And that's part of the self loathing / self defecating thing, it's attitude to ones own person (I know, obvious). We all know the stigma with our hobby, as it's associated with mostly being for kids, when I think factually there's more adults in to it. But we always feel a little stupid for being involved in this supposed kids-only game, and pull up the piss take as a sarcasm shield with a toughness of about 7 (maybe 8) with the view that, if we say it first, others will just laugh and move on. It doesn't hurt as much if we say it first. It may not be a concious thing but I think psychologically that's it - in everything. I'm a big guy and I take the piss out of myself for being fat day in and day out just so its numbs the eventual blow when someone else says it, then I can take the piss out of them for being deaf and dumb "What? I've being saying that round for you a fething wee, were you not listening?!" and put it back on them, again the shield comes in to play and deflects the blows back on the other person.

So that's the reason for it imho. Hope you enjoyed the sliver of insight in to Kitch102's grey matter too

Agreed, so instead I now say "I'm in to Warhammer. It's a multi dimensional board game in which the only restrictions are your own imagination and the roll of a die, and how that plays out against a series of charts and rules. It combines the strategic elements of chess, with the freedom of art, the narrative of a damn good book and the friendly rivalry of a sports game". Makes it sound more interesting to the uninitiated.

And that's part of the self loathing / self defecating thing, it's attitude to ones own person (I know, obvious). We all know the stigma with our hobby, as it's associated with mostly being for kids, when I think factually there's more adults in to it. But we always feel a little stupid for being involved in this supposed kids-only game, and pull up the piss take as a sarcasm shield with a toughness of about 7 (maybe 8) with the view that, if we say it first, others will just laugh and move on. It doesn't hurt as much if we say it first. It may not be a concious thing but I think psychologically that's it - in everything. I'm a big guy and I take the piss out of myself for being fat day in and day out just so its numbs the eventual blow when someone else says it, then I can take the piss out of them for being deaf and dumb "What? I've being saying that round for you a fething wee, were you not listening?!" and put it back on them, again the shield comes in to play and deflects the blows back on the other person.

I know A LOT of people who would take the piss out of what you just described as your definition of plastic toys.

HOWEVER, having said that, i myself have previously simply stated that i am an artist, and i paint (to hide my inherent nerd). This usually then brings up the obvious question 'what?'. Well, mainly 'scifi or fantasy pieces'. This is enough to deflect them off, or if they are intrigued then i'd judge them to be open enough to accept the above explanation.

The problem is not with other people though, but myself (and probably most of us here if we were honest). I agree wholeheartedly with you Kitch, and I'd also say that it takes balls to outright voice what you describe because of the social stigma it carries and cop any flak that may come of it (usually from the jocks who kick pig-skins in muddy fields).

What we should be doing is honestly telling others what we do (which i've done since leaving highschool many moons ago) and not give a damn what they think. The funny thing is, when i do this it actually allows the other person to admit they have hidden desires of geekdom and they profess their love of something nerdy as well, OR they respect me enough to leave me to my devices as another human being, as I do theirs. Anyone who gives a gamer (or anyone for that matter) crap for being a gamer is really only revealing the insecurities/vunerabilities of themselves. Likewise, a gamer who hides behind his 'joking' plastic dudesmen is revealing the same in themselves.

Considering the video game industry is a multi-million dollar market 3x bigger than movies, with an avg age of 21-30 (last time i checked anyway), we are rising up. The range of people into the hobby is so vast now that the typical nerd is now not the one who plays warhammer or video games, it's the one without the social skills, and these can be learned.

Any hobby can be spun to be socially awkward under the right circumstances, so who cares who knows and lets be proud of ours.

/end soapbox having stabbed bullet-ridden flag into hilltop with last gasp as drop pods rain from the apocalyptic skies full of nerds rallying to my cause... (you can imagine who the orks represent in that DoW intro )

I can see Tyrion Lannister reading this thread and go...

Tyrion: "Let me give you some advice, nerd: Never forget what you are. The rest of the world will not. Wear it like armor, and it can never be used to hurt you."

Dakka user: "The hell do you know about being a nerd?"

Tyrion: "All chemist students are nerds in their girlfriend's eyes."

kitch102 wrote: self defecating thing

You crossed it out, but I gotta say, I laughed my ass off.

Lmao, thanks Oddly enough, it still fits as an apt description of this particular subject lol

snowman40k wrote:

Agreed, so instead I now say "I'm in to Warhammer. It's a multi dimensional board game in which the only restrictions are your own imagination and the roll of a die, and how that plays out against a series of charts and rules. It combines the strategic elements of chess, with the freedom of art, the narrative of a damn good book and the friendly rivalry of a sports game". Makes it sound more interesting to the uninitiated.

And that's part of the self loathing / self defecating thing, it's attitude to ones own person (I know, obvious). We all know the stigma with our hobby, as it's associated with mostly being for kids, when I think factually there's more adults in to it. But we always feel a little stupid for being involved in this supposed kids-only game, and pull up the piss take as a sarcasm shield with a toughness of about 7 (maybe 8) with the view that, if we say it first, others will just laugh and move on. It doesn't hurt as much if we say it first. It may not be a concious thing but I think psychologically that's it - in everything. I'm a big guy and I take the piss out of myself for being fat day in and day out just so its numbs the eventual blow when someone else says it, then I can take the piss out of them for being deaf and dumb "What? I've being saying that round for you a fething wee, were you not listening?!" and put it back on them, again the shield comes in to play and deflects the blows back on the other person.

I know A LOT of people who would take the piss out of what you just described as your definition of plastic toys.

HOWEVER, having said that, i myself have previously simply stated that i am an artist, and i paint (to hide my inherent nerd). This usually then brings up the obvious question 'what?'. Well, mainly 'scifi or fantasy pieces'. This is enough to deflect them off, or if they are intrigued then i'd judge them to be open enough to accept the above explanation.

The problem is not with other people though, but myself (and probably most of us here if we were honest). I agree wholeheartedly with you Kitch, and I'd also say that it takes balls to outright voice what you describe because of the social stigma it carries and cop any flak that may come of it (usually from the jocks who kick pig-skins in muddy fields).

What we should be doing is honestly telling others what we do (which i've done since leaving highschool many moons ago) and not give a damn what they think. The funny thing is, when i do this it actually allows the other person to admit they have hidden desires of geekdom and they profess their love of something nerdy as well, OR they respect me enough to leave me to my devices as another human being, as I do theirs. Anyone who gives a gamer (or anyone for that matter) crap for being a gamer is really only revealing the insecurities/vunerabilities of themselves. Likewise, a gamer who hides behind his 'joking' plastic dudesmen is revealing the same in themselves.

Considering the video game industry is a multi-million dollar market 3x bigger than movies, with an avg age of 21-30 (last time i checked anyway), we are rising up. The range of people into the hobby is so vast now that the typical nerd is now not the one who plays warhammer or video games, it's the one without the social skills, and these can be learned.

Any hobby can be spun to be socially awkward under the right circumstances, so who cares who knows and lets be proud of ours.

/end soapbox having stabbed bullet-ridden flag into hilltop with last gasp as drop pods rain from the apocalyptic skies full of nerds rallying to my cause... (you can imagine who the orks represent in that DoW intro )

Both of you need a bit more pride and security in what you do. I'm never afraid to tell outright tell people I'm a grown man who plays with man-dollies. No need to invent more "acceptable" ways to obfuscate what I do because I'm afraid someone's going to judge me.

Not sure about self loathing as I'm handsome, funny, and extremely modest. You other fethers? Yeah, I loathe you all.

kronk wrote:Not sure about self loathing as I'm handsome, funny, and extremely modest. You other fethers? Yeah, I loathe you all.

/thread.

Some people have angst. Just hit the damn ignore button. Simples.

Everyone should be not-so modest with their modesty!

kitch102 wrote:We all know the stigma with our hobby, as it's associated with mostly being for kids, when I think factually there's more adults in to it.

From my experience, that stigma comes far more from the gamers themselves than from other people.

I don't hide what I do in my spare time. When I was doing commission conversion for a 'living' I made no secret of what I did. My miniatures are in a large cabinet in my lounge room. In the nearly 20 years that I've been playing 40K, there have been a bare handful of people who thought it was worth trying to poke fun at it in anything other than a light-hearted way. There's a generous amount who thought it was a little unusual, sure... but so are a lot of hobbies, when you get right down to it, and most people appreciate the artistic side of this one even if they don't quite understand the playing-with-toy-soldiers part.

So no, I don't feel 'a little stupid for being involved in this supposed kids-only game' ... just like I feel no embarrassment about buying Lego, or enjoying the hell out of Super Hero Squad. I like what I like, and if people have an issue with that, well, that's their problem, not mine.

There is no social stigma unless you allow there to be one. You're potentially as large a controlling influence on your social circle as everyone else in it. And if the other people in your social circle are poking fun at you for doing what you enjoy, you're far better off just getting new friends.

scarletsquig wrote:40k is deliberately unbalanced to make the game more cinematic.

The high prices also make the game more cinematic, just like going to the cinema!

Wow..... just.... exalted

I agree with insaniak. Today, a couple of my coworkers were just talking about how they were over at a friend's for a poker night, they just found out that he played, and that they wished they had the time and disposable income to get into it themselves.

If Warhammer is something that actually makes you a social pariah, then maybe you're the reason for it.

liquidjoshi wrote:

kronk wrote:Not sure about self loathing as I'm handsome, funny, and extremely modest. You other fethers? Yeah, I loathe you all.

/thread.

Some people have angst. Just hit the damn ignore button. Simples.

And if you feel the need to argue with someone, just refute their points in a calm, provable, non-sarcastic and non-hysterical manner, and then when you've said your piece, move on. You won't persuade the other person and even if you did, they won't admit to being wrong in public. You're persuading the lurkers who don't have a stake in either side. If both sides of an argument are steaming piles of snark and cheap points-scoring, you'll just look as bad as the guy you're arguing with, but make decent points in a sensible way and you'll persuade more people in the long run.

I always reserve the Man-dollies comments for those rare neckbeards that brag about how much more bad ass their little plastic soldiers are than mine. Especially when they have the new broke codex. THis is the most pathetic thing in the world to brag about. If all you have in the world left to you is to brag about how your draigo wing just pounded some tau into the ground, then you are a sad sad person.

heartserenade wrote:Everyone should be not-so modest with their modesty!

I think you misted the point of the thread. I don't really care that people fight and bitch/moan (that as many people have said is the internet) I'm interested in how they do it, particularly on dakka/wargaming sites. I frequent a video games sight where I'd expect to see the same Dubbed "self loathing." However, I see a lot arguments but no one ever says "we're playing games for kids give it a break."

They actually all seem to rally at even a hint that their hobby is in anyway childish and defend it like much less like a pike man waiting for a charge of Calvary but instead like they are the Calvary... but on bears... wielding chain axes.

You see my point? Wargamers will call their models man dolls, and toy solders, and each other/themselves fat guys while other communities (IMO similar in notoriety) will only insult the other person by calling out how ignorant/irrupted they are.

protonhunter wrote:
You see my point? Wargamers will call their models man dolls, and toy solders, and each other/themselves fat guys while other communities (IMO similar in notoriety) will only insult the other person by calling out how ignorant/irrupted they are.

To me, that almost implies a particular level of 'maturity' in the wargaming community; Talk about a statement I never thought I'd actually make.

It take a certain amount of maturity to be able to laugh at yourself. Having to delude yourself into pretending that something is 'ultra super serious' and 'grown up' is actually kind of juvenile. For example, we're mostly adults at the game store I go to anymore. We're all pretty mature. Even the kids are pretty mature. I've never really had one of the TFG stories that float around Dakka.