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“Members of the U.S. Armed Forces risk their lives to keep this nation safe and defend the fundamental constitutional right to vote,” the military groups said in in their request to intervene in the case.

You haven't done that since world war two. I very much doubt Joe Afghanni is threatening our vote. This article links the move to the Obama campaign in every other fething sentence but it doesn't say how they're actually involved. Does his campaign have gak to do with this, or should I take this pile of gak article about as seriously as I did the next political article it had about "Obamas secret second income"?

GT, google "voter purge". In Florida and Ohio (not coincidentally) in particular.

Voter fraud is also vanishingly rare. It's functionally a nonissue. The main reason the Rep party and its financial backers support voter ID laws is to make voting a little bit tougher for poor people, minorities, and college kids who are less likely to have the needed ID. It's a small percentage, but then, so are overseas voters. Every little bit helps.

http://www.justice.gov/crt/about/vot/misc/activ_uoc.php

If a county is late in mailing absentee ballots to soldiers, what can the Department of Justice do?

Under Section 105 of UOCAVA, the Attorney General is authorized to bring civil actions to enforce UOCAVA requirements. When states have failed to make sure that ballots are sent to qualified servicemembers in a timely manner, the Department of Justice has successfully obtained court orders and consent decrees. Many of these have required states to extend their deadlines for receiving these ballots and to count the late-mailed ballots, even when they arrived after Election Day. In some cases, the states were required to make permanent changes to their laws or procedures to make sure the problems are not repeated in future elections. Through these cases brought to enforce the federal law, the Department has ensured that qualified servicemembers were able to cast their ballots, and know that they were counted.

Ohio extended the deadline to the left instead of the right

Mannahnin wrote:GT, google "voter purge". In Florida and Ohio (not coincidentally) in particular.

So they're trying to remove people who legally can't vote from the list of voters. So what?

In some cases they are removing substantial numbers of legally eligible voters, "by mistake". Some of these folks don't find out that they've been purged from the rolls until they show up at the polls and find out they've been denied their right to vote. And these efforts are concentrated on districts which lean Dem.

Nobody said everyone involved was completely honest. At the very least this is a legitimate operation that some dishonest people have decided the use to swing things their way. Can't always be said of for the other side.

Are you arguing that one of the major parties is deliberately attempting to suppress the other's likely voters, but the other side is not doing the same?

Grey Templar wrote:Nobody said everyone involved was completely honest. At the very least this is a legitimate operation that some dishonest people have decided the use to swing things their way. Can't always be said of for the other side.

The lawsuit in question is also a legitimate challenge, even if you don't agree with the premise legal procedure is being followed. The attempts by some conservatives to pass voter ID requirements are also legitimate for the same reason. The point I was trying make vis a vis Phanatik's statement is that is itself hypocritical consider the legitimate tactics employed by one side objectionable, while engaging in similar tactics in favor of the side you support; at least per the standard of hypocrisy he seemed to be using.

Phanatik wrote:I think it's the Pandora's box of disparate special interest groups on the left that must give democrat politicians campaign nightmares.

The Right seems has sold to 'special' interest groups as the left. Lobbying is an intrinsic part of democracies.

dogma wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:Nobody said everyone involved was completely honest. At the very least this is a legitimate operation that some dishonest people have decided the use to swing things their way. Can't always be said of for the other side.

The lawsuit in question is also a legitimate challenge, even if you don't agree with the premise legal procedure is being followed. The attempts by some conservatives to pass voter ID requirements are also legitimate for the same reason. The point I was trying make vis a vis Phanatik's statement is that is itself hypocritical consider the legitimate tactics employed by one side objectionable, while engaging in similar tactics in favor of the side you support; at least per the standard of hypocrisy he seemed to be using.

Personally I find voter suppression pretty objectionable, and I wish no one engaged in it.

I'm still not seeing where this is Obama's fault, though I am seeing people who claim to love the military actively trying to undermine the military's fidelity to the Commander-in-Chief based on political party leanings.

Mannahnin wrote:
Personally I find voter suppression pretty objectionable, and I wish no one engaged in it.

I agree, but I also think that its inevitable (and in some cases arguably beneficial, for example denying the franchise to felons), and that so long as we're stopping short of "losing" ballots or outright intimidation it isn't all that horrible. I think that ID requirements and this particular lawsuit both fall well short of being offensive, though I would say that this suit is rather petty and that ID requirements are treated with more gravity than their likely effectiveness (or necessity) deserves.

Actions by the Obama campaign and Democrats, DeWine said, are contrary to American tradition and “quite shocking.”

He adds: “I’m just outraged by this. I can’t believe that the Obama campaign [and] the state Democratic party, are actually saying there’s no rational basis for a distinction between someone who is in the military voting, and somebody not in the military. Our whole history in this country, we’ve made a distinction between the two, recognizing the difficulties, and the unique situation that people in the military are in.”

I like how DeWine didn't mention that the exception also applies to civilians living abroad. It also isn't actually clear from the article if the exception applies to all Ohio citizens serving in the military, or just those serving abroad. Or even if it applies to the families of military members residing in the United States while the military member is deployed abroad.

I hear you (although personally I'm not sure I like felons permanently losing the right to vote; if they still had a say maybe that could help contribute to rehabilitation).

How about voter roll purges targeted at minority-heavy districts?

I thought we had problems when the queues were too long at the poll stations during our elections...
Also i don't know if it's because it's early morning but that article is kinda hard to interpret...
People in Ohio can vote for family members that are overseas or in active military service a few weeks beforehand? And they just want to change it to the regular schedule?
That doesn't seem so shockingly bad..

Mannahnin wrote:
How about voter roll purges targeted at minority-heavy districts?

I think its highly open to abuse, but that minority heavy districts are also the most likely places to feature large numbers of illegitimate voters due to the primary sources of illegal immigration being Latin America and the Caribbean.

So long as the people being told to provide proof of citizenship are informed promptly and repeatedly, and given sufficient time to procure and provide such proof, I see no issue. Of course I also suspect that what I consider prompt, repeated, and with sufficient time is likely much more generous to the subject of the inquiry than is actually being done.

I would say 3 notices over a month, 1 every 10 days, and 30 days from the last notice (by postmark, not receipt) is fair.

dogma wrote:

Mannahnin wrote:
How about voter roll purges targeted at minority-heavy districts?

I think its highly open to abuse, but that minority heavy districts are also the most likely places to feature large numbers of illegitimate voters due to the primary sources of illegal immigration being Latin America and the Caribbean.

So long as the people being told to provide proof of citizenship are informed promptly and repeatedly, and given sufficient time to procure and provide such proof, I see no issue. Of course I also suspect that what I consider prompt, repeated, and with sufficient time is likely much more generous to the subject of the inquiry than is actually being done.

I would say 3 notices over a month, 1 every 10 days, and 30 days from the last notice (by postmark, not receipt) is fair.

I just got here mate, I dont usually bother with Phanatiks posts, I just presume it is claptrap out of hand and this one reeks of nonsense.

Is it worth me going back to page 1 or what?

Jihadin wrote:I remember that. (Gore) Talk about PO a bunch of people off

I had family in the military when Gore tried to disallow the military votes from overseas, which were 2 to 1 against him. He lost a lot of supporters and pissed off a really good chunk of the military. I'm thinking if Obama doesn't learn from history he might burn himself really well.

mattyrm wrote:
I just got here mate, I dont usually bother with Phanatiks posts, I just presume it is claptrap out of hand and this one reeks of nonsense.

Is it worth me going back to page 1 or what?

Probably not, I wouldn't bother either except my job has me in front of a computer 10-12 hours a day, so I need some distractions.

dogma wrote:

mattyrm wrote:
I just got here mate, I dont usually bother with Phanatiks posts, I just presume it is claptrap out of hand and this one reeks of nonsense.

Is it worth me going back to page 1 or what?

Probably not, I wouldn't bother either except my job has me in front of a computer 10-12 hours a day, so I need some distractions.

TV tropes, for when you want to lose five hours

youbedead wrote:
TV tropes, for when you want to lose five hours

I've exhausted that website. Probably put about 100 hours into it over the last year. What really needs to happen is more good PS3 games coming out.

dogma wrote:

mattyrm wrote:
I just got here mate, I dont usually bother with Phanatiks posts, I just presume it is claptrap out of hand and this one reeks of nonsense.

Is it worth me going back to page 1 or what?

Probably not, I wouldn't bother either except my job has me in front of a computer 10-12 hours a day, so I need some distractions.

You have to feel like a zombie after a day like that. My hat is off to you for stamina.

Relapse wrote:
You have to feel like a zombie after a day like that. My hat is off to you for stamina.

Well, a lot of it is dead time (I have to compile, and correct, from a team of 4), and I have 4 computers. Unless the data set is huge and I need to use my main (this one is at 200k entries) I can play games on it. Otherwise I go to the gym, or go running, but I did both earlier today so my body is shot till tomorrow.

Keep in mind, 10-12 hours days are what I get 5-6 days a week.

dogma wrote:

Keep in mind, 10-12 hours days are what I get 5-6 days a week.

Shriek!

I noticed you guys work longer hours in the states, Its probably the number one reason we fethed off back over here!

Although, I haven't got as much money, so swings and roundabouts I suppose.

purplefood wrote:People in Ohio can vote for family members that are overseas or in active military service a few weeks beforehand? And they just want to change it to the regular schedule?
That doesn't seem so shockingly bad..

From what I understood (I could be wrong), everybody in Ohio can vote a few weeks beforehand. It's just that this pre-election voting period ends on a Friday for civilians, and on a Monday for military folks, meaning they have an additional three days to do so. Which has been proposed to be changed so that everybody only has until that Friday, because those additional three days are apparently a big deal and unequal treatment.

Lynata wrote:

purplefood wrote:People in Ohio can vote for family members that are overseas or in active military service a few weeks beforehand? And they just want to change it to the regular schedule?
That doesn't seem so shockingly bad..

From what I understood (I could be wrong), everybody in Ohio can vote a few weeks beforehand. It's just that this pre-election voting period ends on a Friday for civilians, and on a Monday for military folks, meaning they have an additional three days to do so. Which has been proposed to be changed so that everybody only has until that Friday, because those additional three days are apparently a big deal and unequal treatment.

This is so trivial it's not even worth this thread...
3 days? If they took it away who cares? If they leave it who cares?
It's only 3 days...

mattyrm wrote:
Shriek!

I noticed you guys work longer hours in the states, Its probably the number one reason we fethed off back over here!

Although, I haven't got as much money, so swings and roundabouts I suppose.

Well, both my real jobs are telecommute, so its all from my apartment aside from a couple monthly exceptions. I generally go from bed to home office most days, and then reverse the trend when my eyes start burning. You'll see me post at like 5-6 A.M. CST for this reason.

Though it should be emphasized that I work so long because I have 2.5 jobs, and have always been a night person. Most Americans don't, and can't, do that.

Mannahnin wrote:

dogma wrote:

Grey Templar wrote:Nobody said everyone involved was completely honest. At the very least this is a legitimate operation that some dishonest people have decided the use to swing things their way. Can't always be said of for the other side.

The lawsuit in question is also a legitimate challenge, even if you don't agree with the premise legal procedure is being followed. The attempts by some conservatives to pass voter ID requirements are also legitimate for the same reason. The point I was trying make vis a vis Phanatik's statement is that is itself hypocritical consider the legitimate tactics employed by one side objectionable, while engaging in similar tactics in favor of the side you support; at least per the standard of hypocrisy he seemed to be using.

Personally I find voter suppression pretty objectionable, and I wish no one engaged in it.

Same. Texas and many other states engage in it in a more subtle form via gerrymandering, and I really wish we could get rid of gerrymandering and instead have electorates divided up amongst statistical, non-partisan grounds.

mattyrm wrote: I just got here mate, I dont usually bother with Phanatiks posts, I just presume it is claptrap out of hand and this one reeks of nonsense.

If you don't read my stuff, I'll just die!

Actually, I was surprised to read your post. I thought I already had you on ignore.

Ciao babe.

Phanatik wrote:
Ciao babe.

feth me, I didn't know Danny Zuko used dakkadakka!

I like how the deliberately confrontational person ignores all other confrontational people.

There's a word for that.