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 Tyriion wrote:
*CHANGES MADE IN THIS POST*

Starting Blood Angels and i'm fairly new to them, and have only been playing 40k for a month now. Here is my 2k general close-combat style Blood Angels army.

HQ:
Librarian, Shield and Sword Powers, JP = 125pts
Dante - 225


Elites:
Furioso Librarian Dreadnought (blood lance, wings of sanguinius) = 175 pts
2x Sanguinary Priest, JP = 75pts

Troops:
10x Assault Marines, PW, Meltagun x2 = 225
10x Assault Marines, PW, Meltagun x2 = 225
10x Death Company, 2x PF, all with bolters = 220 pts
Sanguinary Guard 4x Angelus Boltgun, 5x Glaive Encarmine, Infernus Pistol = 210 pts

Fast Attack:
Baal Predator, Assault Cannon, Heavy Flamers = 140 pts
Baal Predator, Assault Cannon = 115 points

Heavy Support:
Storm Raven MM, AC, Hurricane Bolters= 230 pts

Total = 2050 - Changes needed?

First off, I'm going on record to say that I hate the utility of Marine HQs in general. At 2K I would never take a special character AND a regular HQ. That's too many points for only 2 models, I think. Especially since neither are eternal warriors. Actually, we don't have eternal warriors, so my statement holds for all Blood Angel HQs. I think that in general you are making a mistake that many Blood Angel players are making in 6th edition. I think you just need a lot more weight of fire in the shooting phase. In my experience, having the only heavy support start in reserve is going to leave you horribly outgunned at the beginning of the game. I find multi meltas and lascannons to be invaluable in 6th edition.

Unfortunately, Death Company needs to assault to be cost effective. Even more unfortunately, the best way to accomplish this is to use the Land Raider or pay *15* pts a piece for jump packs. Drop pod might work, but then they are on foot and people have a turn to react while they are in "can't assault limbo". I don't know what else to say about these guys.

You don't want flamers on tanks in 6th anymore. Ever. That's getting way too close to krak grenades and meltabombs. God forbid haywire grenades. Stick with dakka Baals and auto/las preds. Blood Angels can't afford to give away points like that.

If you are bringing psykers, the core rule book powers make the blood angel powers look silly I think. Divination alone is just amazing. Case in point: I rolled up the 4++ psyker power last week vs dark eldar. I used it on my single assault squad and headed toward his skimmer of Incubi. He took the bait, got out and assaulted. The 4++ blessing cut his damage down severely and I easily won the combat and crushed that flank of his army. No Blood Angel powers can turn a combat like that. The 4++ power also made it cost ineffective to shoot dark lances and other low AP weapons at my assault team. And the default for that that branch is super guide? Yes, please.

Martel732 wrote:

 Tyriion wrote:
*CHANGES MADE IN THIS POST*

Starting Blood Angels and i'm fairly new to them, and have only been playing 40k for a month now. Here is my 2k general close-combat style Blood Angels army.

HQ:
Librarian, Shield and Sword Powers, JP = 125pts
Dante - 225


Elites:
Furioso Librarian Dreadnought (blood lance, wings of sanguinius) = 175 pts
2x Sanguinary Priest, JP = 75pts

Troops:
10x Assault Marines, PW, Meltagun x2 = 225
10x Assault Marines, PW, Meltagun x2 = 225
10x Death Company, 2x PF, all with bolters = 220 pts
Sanguinary Guard 4x Angelus Boltgun, 5x Glaive Encarmine, Infernus Pistol = 210 pts

Fast Attack:
Baal Predator, Assault Cannon, Heavy Flamers = 140 pts
Baal Predator, Assault Cannon = 115 points

Heavy Support:
Storm Raven MM, AC, Hurricane Bolters= 230 pts

Total = 2050 - Changes needed?

First off, I'm going on record to say that I hate the utility of Marine HQs in general. At 2K I would never take a special character AND a regular HQ. That's too many points for only 2 models, I think. Especially since neither are eternal warriors. Actually, we don't have eternal warriors, so my statement holds for all Blood Angel HQs. I think that in general you are making a mistake that many Blood Angel players are making in 6th edition. I think you just need a lot more weight of fire in the shooting phase. In my experience, having the only heavy support start in reserve is going to leave you horribly outgunned at the beginning of the game. I find multi meltas and lascannons to be invaluable in 6th edition.

Unfortunately, Death Company needs to assault to be cost effective. Even more unfortunately, the best way to accomplish this is to use the Land Raider or pay *15* pts a piece for jump packs. Drop pod might work, but then they are on foot and people have a turn to react while they are in "can't assault limbo". I don't know what else to say about these guys.

You don't want flamers on tanks in 6th anymore. Ever. That's getting way too close to krak grenades and meltabombs. God forbid haywire grenades. Stick with dakka Baals and auto/las preds. Blood Angels can't afford to give away points like that.

If you are bringing psykers, the core rule book powers make the blood angel powers look silly I think. Divination alone is just amazing. Case in point: I rolled up the 4++ psyker power last week vs dark eldar. I used it on my single assault squad and headed toward his skimmer of Incubi. He took the bait, got out and assaulted. The 4++ blessing cut his damage down severely and I easily won the combat and crushed that flank of his army. No Blood Angel powers can turn a combat like that. The 4++ power also made it cost ineffective to shoot dark lances and other low AP weapons at my assault team. And the default for that that branch is super guide? Yes, please.

I'll make a few changes in a minute, but before i do, what do you recommend I change? Should i spend the extra points to give the DC jump packs (i completely forgot that they were not already in the wargear)? And should i add more vehicles?

 Tyriion wrote:

Martel732 wrote:

 Tyriion wrote:
*CHANGES MADE IN THIS POST*

Starting Blood Angels and i'm fairly new to them, and have only been playing 40k for a month now. Here is my 2k general close-combat style Blood Angels army.

HQ:
Librarian, Shield and Sword Powers, JP = 125pts
Dante - 225


Elites:
Furioso Librarian Dreadnought (blood lance, wings of sanguinius) = 175 pts
2x Sanguinary Priest, JP = 75pts

Troops:
10x Assault Marines, PW, Meltagun x2 = 225
10x Assault Marines, PW, Meltagun x2 = 225
10x Death Company, 2x PF, all with bolters = 220 pts
Sanguinary Guard 4x Angelus Boltgun, 5x Glaive Encarmine, Infernus Pistol = 210 pts

Fast Attack:
Baal Predator, Assault Cannon, Heavy Flamers = 140 pts
Baal Predator, Assault Cannon = 115 points

Heavy Support:
Storm Raven MM, AC, Hurricane Bolters= 230 pts

Total = 2050 - Changes needed?

First off, I'm going on record to say that I hate the utility of Marine HQs in general. At 2K I would never take a special character AND a regular HQ. That's too many points for only 2 models, I think. Especially since neither are eternal warriors. Actually, we don't have eternal warriors, so my statement holds for all Blood Angel HQs. I think that in general you are making a mistake that many Blood Angel players are making in 6th edition. I think you just need a lot more weight of fire in the shooting phase. In my experience, having the only heavy support start in reserve is going to leave you horribly outgunned at the beginning of the game. I find multi meltas and lascannons to be invaluable in 6th edition.

Unfortunately, Death Company needs to assault to be cost effective. Even more unfortunately, the best way to accomplish this is to use the Land Raider or pay *15* pts a piece for jump packs. Drop pod might work, but then they are on foot and people have a turn to react while they are in "can't assault limbo". I don't know what else to say about these guys.

You don't want flamers on tanks in 6th anymore. Ever. That's getting way too close to krak grenades and meltabombs. God forbid haywire grenades. Stick with dakka Baals and auto/las preds. Blood Angels can't afford to give away points like that.

If you are bringing psykers, the core rule book powers make the blood angel powers look silly I think. Divination alone is just amazing. Case in point: I rolled up the 4++ psyker power last week vs dark eldar. I used it on my single assault squad and headed toward his skimmer of Incubi. He took the bait, got out and assaulted. The 4++ blessing cut his damage down severely and I easily won the combat and crushed that flank of his army. No Blood Angel powers can turn a combat like that. The 4++ power also made it cost ineffective to shoot dark lances and other low AP weapons at my assault team. And the default for that that branch is super guide? Yes, please.

I'll make a few changes in a minute, but before i do, what do you recommend I change? Should i spend the extra points to give the DC jump packs (i completely forgot that they were not already in the wargear)? And should i add more vehicles?

There is no simple answer to this. It just depends on what you want your list to do. But consider that death company are 35 pts a model with jump packs. They are no harder to kill than an 18 pt assault marine with a sanguinary priest buddy. AND they don't score. Personally, I see death company as a "death star" unit that rides in a land raider. That makes is a 500 pt investment. It's literally something I would tack on to go from 2K to 2.5K when I'm feeling lazy. Yes, it's gruesome when it hits, but the raider has bad firepower for the cost, and death company are very vulnerable to counter attack. So ask yourself, is there anything in the game I really *need* to charge with 50 ST 5 attacks? I feel the answer is usually no.

Keep in mind that at 2K, the imperial guard can legitimately field 10+ chimera hulls. Also, at 2K tyranids can bring 5 or 6 tervigons. How are units like the libby dreadnought helping you fight a mech army or a heavy monster army? I feel that ranged firepower is quite useful and desirable in 6th edition. The primary recommendation I suppose would be to say that the death company, the spare HQ libby and libby dreadnought look very expendable for more dakka. This leaves three tough scoring units, which is still a bit light for 2K I feel. Unfortunately, from my empirical experience, close combat style blood angel lists aren't competitive because too many other units in the game have more close combat efficiency. That leaves us in the position of shooting to soften a target and then assaulting or counterattacking. It kinda sucks fluff wise, but that's what 6th edition means to me.

death company are to good not to play at 2k points. i play 5 with jp in a 1850 army AND give them all power weapons. The mobility alone to me is worth it.

I guess my only question is why is that good? They can't score, and now they are 50 point models that are T4, 1W. That's going to be a pretty easy 250 points to take off the table with the amount of fire you can see at a 2K table.

Yeah, it's fluff accurate, but I want way more durability on a 50 point model.