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 sfshilo wrote:
Hammer of wrath is a highly underrated attribute of jump pack troops....

Not really, since it's only for units in b2b, and their manoeuvrability is generally better than using a 6" move to risk hammer of wrath.

 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

 sfshilo wrote:
Hammer of wrath is a highly underrated attribute of jump pack troops....

Not really, since it's only for units in b2b, and their manoeuvrability is generally better than using a 6" move to risk hammer of wrath.

Indeed, or like I posted earlier if you take a bike squad you can get both without having to sacrfice the other to do it.

I run my Raven Guard with Korvydae because assault marine become troop choice and I can fill up my "fast" section with land speeders and stormtalons (I didnt read the BA codex but must be better with the BA). The best way to use an "Assault army" is when you have a lot of obstacles that block the line of sight. Used them to delay movements of you opponent when you move your troops around the objectives. Vanilla Assautl Marine worh it if you know how to play it.

Hammer of wrath is much better for bikers. For assault troops, its only reliable for a pure counterattack against enemies locked in CC already.

Martel732 wrote:
Bikers are much better

There, fixed that for you.

In 6 ed iirc they can have 2 flamers so you ave 2 flamers paint em green make um 2 link whith hestan boom auto hit re role to woond sarge has th master craft the rest have chainswords and pistols ye can kill most units

There ok i take a 105pt. squad and they almost always kill a tank worth more than there points and on occasion they pop a landraider with the Sgt. melta bombs. So there ok just NEVER depend on them to win you a game.

85 points for a squad of them for DA, not bad at 17 points per model. Free DP or Rhino if you dump their packs.

Its 100 for Blood Angels but they are troops.

Keep in mind that the DA sarge has basic marine stats unless you pay 10 additional points to get the extra attack and leadership point.

Still holds up in BA quite well IMO, whether you keep their jump pack or mech up.
You are just not going to be as successful without other units supporting them as last edition.
Against things like Orks or Berserkers, Assault Marine's mobility is key, you are more likely to get the charge and you can choose when and where the fight happens with your speed.
Against termies and such you are better off shooting them down with Plasma HG or Devs.

derito wrote:
Keep in mind that the DA sarge has basic marine stats unless you pay 10 additional points to get the extra attack and leadership point.

Why would you take Assault Marines on DA anyway when you can take Deathwing or Ravenwing?

You like playing greenwing?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
You like playing greenwing?

Personally, I'll be playing a mix Dark Angels army, instead of focusing on Ravenwing or Deathwing.

The stock answer, which I'm surprised hasn't appeared here, is that vanilla assault marines (and I suppose DA/SW too) are only really worth it with a Chaplain attached, to re-roll misses on the charge. As already pointed out though, you really need the rest of the list to fit around their use - out on their own they'll quickly get eaten up.

 Super Ready wrote:
The stock answer, which I'm surprised hasn't appeared here, is that vanilla assault marines (and I suppose DA/SW too) are only really worth it with a Chaplain attached, to re-roll misses on the charge. As already pointed out though, you really need the rest of the list to fit around their use - out on their own they'll quickly get eaten up.

Or a Divination Librarian, which is also used by BA.
Probably better than the chaplain since it works every turn, you can re-roll range attacks too and you might get another cool power.

For those of you that are sceptic to ASM in BA armies. Would you prefer Tacticals instead?

 Jackster wrote:

 Super Ready wrote:
The stock answer, which I'm surprised hasn't appeared here, is that vanilla assault marines (and I suppose DA/SW too) are only really worth it with a Chaplain attached, to re-roll misses on the charge. As already pointed out though, you really need the rest of the list to fit around their use - out on their own they'll quickly get eaten up.

Or a Divination Librarian, which is also used by BA.
Probably better than the chaplain since it works every turn, you can re-roll range attacks too and you might get another cool power.

While it's usually safe to assume that a librarian will get his powers off when he needs them, it is often not the case. Particularly when facing eldar or tyrannids. The perk of the chaplain is that he is reliable. He will always work the way you expect him to. Librarians can do some awesome stuff, which sometimes includes having their brains explode.

This does bring up the point of characters in the unit though. Assault marines make very good bodyguards for HQs.

z3bb3 wrote:
For those of you that are sceptic to ASM in BA armies. Would you prefer Tacticals instead?

Depends. My generic 1500 pt BA list has one squad of 10 jump ASM, one squad of 5 foot assault marines, and a full tactical squad, because some enemies just need to be shot. That being said, for larger games, I'll be using vanilla tac marines as allies.

Against a gunliner or any kind of static backline ASM can do work and turn the tie of a battle. Throwing them against a brutal CC unit or exchanging bolter fire with a unit of equal size is not going to end well for them.

Martel732 wrote:

z3bb3 wrote:
For those of you that are sceptic to ASM in BA armies. Would you prefer Tacticals instead?

Depends. My generic 1500 pt BA list has one squad of 10 jump ASM, one squad of 5 foot assault marines, and a full tactical squad, because some enemies just need to be shot. That being said, for larger games, I'll be using vanilla tac marines as allies.

Thank you for the reply Martel.

Do you really need marines for the firepower that the ASM lack?
My idea of an army is to bring 10man ASM, 5man ASM and then support them with 2 stormraven gunship and a landraider crusader.
(That is in a 1750pts though)

Yes, because in 6th edition there are too many other troops even, much less elites, that ASM just can't handle anymore. Losing init 5 was a blow that many BA players still haven't adjusted to.

At 1750, I would be very wary of reserving 400+ points without a comm link aegis line. But that costs 60 or so. So now your turn 1 firepower/model count is down 460 pts.

I am not saying that I have found a magic formula. There are some opponents that jumpers will just eat alive. But I'm trying for all comers here and I can't honestly call a jumper list the best choice for all comers. There are no easy answers for BA or ASM in 6th edition.

I haven't done a complete comparison yet, however since I know own a DA codex, I was able to do a brief points comparison.

The Dark Angels assault marines are cheaper than Vanilla ones (not sure about SW, BT or BA).

I plan on buying myself a box and fielding one five man squad of Assault Marines, giving two of them Plasma PIstols and the sergeant the veteran sergeant upgrade with a Plasma Pistol and either a Power Fist or a Thunder Hammer.

The DA chaplins are also better and our Librarians are much cheaper if you want to go that route instead. Overall I would say that DA Assault Marines are okay for a harassing unit. Even with a character they don't really shine all that much though.

Go BA. Magnetize your assault troops with their jump packs and backpacks. If they drop their jump packs they can take razorbacks for mad cheap. Also, blood angels have DoA which lets them deep strike with 1 d6 (they can also re-roll reserve rolls) sooooooo, give a squad of 10 2 melta guns and watch the lulz begin (be prepared to potentially lose the unit though).

I personally like using them as a BA player

I'm just wondering something. I made it clear I'll be playing DA, why is everyone telling me to go BA? I get it they can take assault marines as troops but in order to field BA, I'll have to buy a new HQ.

Stick with DA; it's a better codex.

I want to stick with DA because I love the chapter. But people keep saying I should go BA, a chapter I dislike.

Also, my options are to:
Pay about $30 for an Assault Marine Squad and use a codex I already own.
or
Pay $30 for the squad, another $30 for the Codex and about $20 for an HQ choice.

Then just use DA assault marines and try to make it work.

Which is completely possible, I did the math.

10 Man Assault Marine squad, 2 Plasma Pistols and the Sergeant with either a Plasma Gun, Power Weapon or a Lightning Claw (not sure which yet) totals out to 215 points.

My plan came from a video I've seen Fritz post. I park my Assault Marines in cover and within range of an objective, using them as area denial and control so I can get in my scoring units.