Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Personally, I'd always let combi weapons slide. Having them WYSIWYG for a one shot weapon it quite a lot of hassle. So long as I'm clear in advance (and your painting scheme seems a good way to do this) then it seems harsh to refuse to play just based on that.

Otherwise, WYSIWYG is always better, but it depends on the opponent. In a game against one mate he was proxying space marines for orcs (he was thinking of starting a new army and wanted to try before buying) and that was really confusing...

I would love to be decent at converting but its a skill i lack and try and destroy alot of bits lol!

Overmodeling is worse than proxies.

At least with a Proxy, your model is 'legal' for at least one configuration. So you can have a AoBR boss with a PK and Proxy him to have a Big Choppa a few casual games, but your model is still legal for other WYSWIYG events.

Overmodeled HQs with 10 weapons and invalid wargear combos doesn't meet WYSIWYG as I SEE things which I am NOT getting, and it does nothing to help players identify what your model has... and then it is NOT LEGAL for WYSIWYG events.

Many models can be magnetized. Others, the torso is the cheapest part of the model so it is easy to have 10 chaplains or overlords as you just need power armor/necron bodies with arm swaps.

Whatever your situation, OVERMODELING is the worst answer in all situations.

nkelsch wrote:
Overmodeling is worse than proxies.

At least with a Proxy, your model is 'legal' for at least one configuration. So you can have a AoBR boss with a PK and Proxy him to have a Big Choppa a few casual games, but your model is still legal for other WYSWIYG events.

Overmodeled HQs with 10 weapons and invalid wargear combos doesn't meet WYSIWYG as I SEE things which I am NOT getting, and it does nothing to help players identify what your model has... and then it is NOT LEGAL for WYSIWYG events.

Many models can be magnetized. Others, the torso is the cheapest part of the model so it is easy to have 10 chaplains or overlords as you just need power armor/necron bodies with arm swaps.

Whatever your situation, OVERMODELING is the worst answer in all situations.

I agree here about the over modeling. It's just as bad. WYSISYG is not just "you must have the proper gear modeled" It's "What You See Is What You Get." And if you have every option tacked on, what I'm getting is not what I'm seeing.

I wonder if there are people out there who don't know what WYSIWYG stands for? To them, it might just mean "Wargear must be modeled" and "wiseewig" is just an odd term us old farts use to say that... There are plenty of terms in common use that started life as acronyms, who's details are forgotten.

 Novelist47 wrote:
So WYSIWYG. I understand its purpose and how someone who went the extra mile to get/build say a power fist can get pissed at someone claiming that a sword counts as the same thing.
However I think it would be more versatile if we could do just that. Also I have a 2nd hand army which i plan to heavily convert so my options arent so varied. So question time.

1) Lets say I had 5 havocs with lascannons, would you mind if i count them as say flamers or something. (I think that as long as the model weapon is higher point than a counts as weapons its okay if you get what im trying to say). Would you let that slide?
2) Whats ur thoughts upon WYSIWYG in general.

40k is at its heart a communal game, you need other people to play, WYSIWYG is an extension of that, it is a system that shows you care about the other person. I don't mind if someone says "I'm trying something new, so all my greyhunter special weapons are flamers instead of meltaguns" but if your army contains meltaguns that counts as every different special weapon, I would mind. If you make the gameplay cumbersome and annoying for the other player 9/10 they will decide not to play against you again.

When people say "I shouldn't have to pay £40 for extra models" their arguement doesn't really add up. Wargear is cheap to buy on ebay and pinning or magnets can mean wargear can be swapped easily with a little bit of effort.

@Bluntman, totally agree... +1

@ many other folks, combi weapons are crazy easy. Take a flamer, and have your bolter guy also have a flamer on his back (over the right shoulder usually works). If you want, you can magnetize that part (small rare-earth magnets are about $.1 a piece if you buy 100 of them). Then you magnetize flamers and meltas and swap them to your little hearts content.

I think a ton of players just get hung up on "I can't convert" and hide behind that, instead of just jumping in and trying. You can, you just choose not to, which is fine, but acknowledge its a choice not a medical condition you can't overcome.

You can't give lame excuses to the rest of us... remember, we're in the hobby too and know about these things. We'll help you, heck, if you were in my club, I'd give you six magnets and do the fire 3 conversions for you (and every FLGS I know of has plenty of people that would do the same and more for a kind, respectful player).

40k is a club. All and all, we're pretty supportive of people wanting to get things right... use our help and experience and don't abuse our good nature by phoning it in on options that you've chosen to play with.

I follow wusiwug but I dont require others to. I have a personal gripe with the system honestly. I understand its helpful for your opponent to know what your using, I would be more understanding if the boxes had all the weapon options available. As it is its not an ideal situation. My ocd requires that I model as exactly as possible, but I'm not gunna be that guy to make you feel uncomfortable just becuase you don't. If I'm there on game night and you want to play I'm your huckleberry.

Now I just model and collect, I dont play though I have an army list.

I do have a list for if I would play.

I do have a problem, I have a decent ammount of Plasma in my army cause I love plasma weapons but I hate the idea of gets hot! (Just fire less often and aim like in the games) As such even though my models are all plasmas, I would want them to be treated as Melta Guns (or in the case of the plasma pistol on my metal LT, a laspistol) I love the looks of them, and I like the idea of them functioning as melta weapons so I just interchange them.

Sense I keep it written down in my army list I could give it to the player so he wouldnt have to remember it.

I play almost full wysiwyg. The only departure I have from that is that I always ask my opponent before the battle if they're OK with my storm bolters being heavy bolters - every single storm bolter.

I do this, because as a Sisters player, I have an insane number of otherwise useless storm bolter armed models and heavy bolter models are difficult to get hold of and very expensive.

Since it's an army-wide representation and I have a bullfluff explanation if asked, everyone agrees it's fine.

If you're proxying having all of a particular weapon (eg flamers) be something else (eg meltas) seems the only sensible way to go as somebody will forget which is which (or worse pretend to)

If you/your oponant is doing a lot of proxying in a friendly game having a card with the unit description (set it up like a standard) can also help (though some find it more annoying than helpful)

but the basic rule is the more competetive the game the more WYSIWYG you should be, and the less you know the other player (eg a stranger in a store game) the more WYSWIG you should be

I never play WYSIWYG with my friends. that said, I try to model all the weapons I give to my guys, just to keep things simple