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 DeathReaper wrote:

 Abandon wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Abandon wrote:

 DeathReaper wrote:

 Abandon wrote:
I'm just pointing out that if unit A can be reached by a charge and unit B can be reached by a charge. Both are valid targets for a charge. As all charges are declared at once and both are within reach the attacking unit is permitted to declare a disordered charge. No rule differentiates a unit of one model from a unit with multiple models in this regard.

This is of course false as the rules have shown. Both are not in reach as you have to move the initial charger just as you would against a single target.

If you are a single model then there is no way to reach the 2nd unit, therefore you may never even declare a multi-charge with a single model.

This is only true after you have declared your charge. At the time of declaration, both are valid targets for a charge.

Taking all rules into account they are not both valid targets as you can not reach two different units with a single model.

So at the time of declaration, which one cannot be reached A or B?

The one you are trying to declare as a secondary target.

Which has not yet been decided so both are still valid. The moment I declare a charge, then I'll have to admit I cannot reach the other. However, as all charges are declared at once and both remain possible at that time... I may in fact declare a disordered charge.

That... Makes no sense. You admit that the moment you declare the charge, you have to concede that you cannot reach the other, which is precisely the time at which the charge MUST be valid. It doesn't matter that a different charge declaration would have been valid, nor would it matter if the charge later becomes invalid (via overwatch), but at the precise moment that you declare a charge, that precise charge, in that precise configuration, must be conceivably possible.

It's like you're imagining that the rules have this strange extra step where you evaluate all possible charge targets as primary targets, and then use that earlier determination to allow primary and secondary charges. But it's just RaMU (rules-as-made-up).

Pyrian wrote:
That... Makes no sense. You admit that the moment you declare the charge, you have to concede that you cannot reach the other, which is precisely the time at which the charge MUST be valid. It doesn't matter that a different charge declaration would have been valid, nor would it matter if the charge later becomes invalid (via overwatch), but at the precise moment that you declare a charge, that precise charge, in that precise configuration, must be conceivably possible.

It's like you're imagining that the rules have this strange extra step where you evaluate all possible charge targets as primary targets, and then use that earlier determination to allow primary and secondary charges. But it's just RaMU (rules-as-made-up).

Such a concession is only made after a charge is declared. Until then each unit is in reach of a charge.
The rule does indeed ask you to evaluate possible charge targets but does not differentiate between primary or secondary targets in that regard.
The rule does not say the charge must be conceivably possible. It says you cannot declare a charge on a unit if you cannot conceivably reach that unit. You can conceivably reach either unit so both are valid targets for a charge.
Both targets are declared at once. That means by the time the second target is invalidated the charge has already been declared.

Only if you ignore the part that says you cannot engage a second unit until after the inital model has been moved.

 hyv3mynd wrote:
Only if you ignore the part that says you cannot engage a second unit until after the inital model has been moved.

That does not mean that either target could not be reached at the time the charge was declared.

-All charges are declared at once
-You can reach unit A
-You can reach unit B
-You are allowed to charge multiple units
-The rule for assault are the same and grant the same permissions regardless of the number of models in the unit.
-There is no rule stating you must move into base contact with the secondary target
-Discovery that you cannot move into base contact with the second target due to the charge move rules is common and acceptable*
-The rules for moving the initial charger are not in effect until you start moving you models, well after the charge is declared.

*This could be for any number of reasons.

A further examination of the rule indicates what is meant by it.
"A unit can never declare a charge against a unit that it cannot reach, nor can it declare a charge against a unit that it cannot see. This means that a charge can usually only be declared on a unit up to 12" away (the maximum charge range for most models, as we'll discover later)." Page 20 BRB

The rule on page 27 of the BRB "Remember that a unit cannot declare a charge against a unit it cannot reach or cannot see..." is clearly a reminder.

The stated meaning of the rule does not prohibit a disordered charge by a unit with only one model.