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Fragile wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:

Fragile wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:

 insaniak wrote:

 Unit1126PLL wrote:
Why? Does disembarking have a prerequisite of being removed from the table independently from the need to first be embarked?

Because being removed from the table is the only alternative to them moving to wherever the Monolith portal is.

You can't just move them the way you would in the Movement phase?

No, because the Portal is not moving them X inches, it is making them appear as if they had just disembarked

Either way, if it is more than 6" the relic drops anyways.

If I am not mistaken, that only refers to the relic being "moved" six inches, rather than being Teleported six inches, or whathaveyou.

"Moved". If the original spot is more than 6" from the new spot (whip out your tape and check) then the relic has "moved" more than 6" in one phase. That is the simplest and most effective definition of the rule.

So in this case we're defining "move" as linear displacement, rather than the way 40k defines it? So you can still port it through the monolith portal, to, say, somewhere out of Line of Sight, provided that its final position is within six inches of its initial position, regardless of route taken?

How does 40k define movement? I thought it was linear displacement. You can perform a standard move up to x in the movement phase, but running etc is also 'movement' as defined in the entry. A model staring at point Y and ending at point Z is considered movement, it may not be standard ' movement '. But it is still considered moving. (and still governed by movement parameters, coherency etc)

Problem is there's only 2 possible ways the basic rules can handle this - either they are removed from the table, or the models are moving from Y to Z.

IMO its pretty simple.


The unit is disembarking correct?

Embarking and disembarking units are considered to have moved for the turn.

Did they end their move more than 6" from where they started?

If yes, they dropped the relic.

Eihnlazer wrote:
IMO its pretty simple.


The unit is disembarking correct?

Embarking and disembarking units are considered to have moved for the turn.

Did they end their move more than 6" from where they started?

If yes, they dropped the relic.

But nothing in the rules says anywhere that the movement made while disembarking is counted towards the total movement. A vehicle can move 6" with the relic in it, then have whatever is holding the relic disembark for another six inches, and there would be no issue with that as disembarking does not cause you to drop the relic. The model is off the table at this point, as is the relic, so any movement made by the vehicle does not count towards the amount of movement the model carrying it makes.

That said... no where in the rule does it say that the necron moving through the portal leaves the table. It only says that it acts as though disembarking from it.

Going from another perspective, I could easily see this working within the fluff of the game. They are being teleported from where ever they are on the board, to in front of the monolith. As I can only assume that short-range teleportation isn't a traumatic experience, physically anyway, then there would be no reason for it to damage the relic. That said... who cares about fluff?

The relic can't move more then 6" at all. So moving its vehicle 6" then disembarking and moving another 6" is not allowed.

I would also say it can't be teleported. If the unit holding it wants to, they drop it first.

Acting as disembarking means, as far as the rules are concerned, you ARE disembarking.

 DarthSpader wrote:
The relic can't move more then 6" at all. So moving its vehicle 6" then disembarking and moving another 6" is not allowed.

I would also say it can't be teleported. If the unit holding it wants to, they drop it first.

Page 131 of the core rule book, under 'Moving with the relic':

"The Relic is fragile, and swift movement will likely damage
it, so the model carrying the Relic cannot Run and can never
move more than 6" in any phase. If it is forced to do so, the
Relic is immediately dropped. A model with the Relic can
embark a Transport vehicle, but that vehicle cannot move
more than 6" per phase whilst the Relic is on board"

No where in there does it state that the relic itself is limited to any amount of movement within a single phase. The vehicle moves, but no where in the rules does it state that any movement taken by a vehicle counts towards the amount of movement a unit made within a turn.

So, it would be quite possible for a unit to do the following after taking the relic:

1.) move two inches to embark onto a transport(2)
2.) have the transport move six inches in the movement phase(6)
3.) have the transport flat out in the shooting phase-flat out is not restricted by the relic rules-for another six inches(6)
4.) have the transport move six inches during the next turns movement phase(6)
5.) have the unit disembark another six inches away from the vehicle (6)
6.) (conditional) have the unit make a jet pack move for up to another six inches in the assault phase (2-6)

So, in two turns, it is possible to move the relic (2+6+6+6+6=26) twenty-six inches, and possibly up to 32" if you manage to find a scoring jet pack unit and a transport to carry it.

As to how this affects how a relic interacts with moving through a monolith portal... well, the unit itself isn't moving more than six inches away from it's disembarking point, which is completely allowable under the relic movement rules.

Could anyone quote me the exact monolith text? Does it say the word "Moved" ? If not i find most of the arguments against invalid.

Necroes - didnt think you could flat out if a unit embarked.

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Necroes - didnt think you could flat out if a unit embarked.

They can move as normal after embarking, including flat out, so long as the vehicle did not move prior to the unit embarking that turn. Page 78 of the core rulebook, under 'embarking'

Cool, its another change from 5th to 6th to remember. I so rarely use vehicles or have them survive to pick up troops it isnt usually an issue...

Talk about shooting your foot:

Necroes wrote:
Page 131 of the core rule book, under 'Moving with the relic':

"The Relic is fragile, and swift movement will likely damage
it, so the model carrying the Relic cannot Run and can never
move more than 6" in any phase. If it is forced to do so, the
Relic is immediately dropped. A model with the Relic can
embark a Transport vehicle, but that vehicle cannot move
more than 6" per phase whilst the Relic is on board"

The model, here carrying a relic, cannot go more than 6". Limitation 1, and the relevant one here.
The vehicle, carrying the model, who is carrying the relic cannot go more than 6". Limitation 2

If your model is within 1" of the vehicle, only Limitation 2 applies.
But in you example, on turn 1, the model only has 4" left in it's "allowed movement", even if the vehicle has an allowance of 6".
And on turn 2, both vehicle and model have used the allowance of 6" therefore you can do:
2+4+6+6+0+6 = twenty-four inches in 2 turns.

Eldar Jetbikes can do 6" move, 6" flat-out, 6" in assault phase and do 36" in two turns which is the maximum the relic can ever do. RAI as such too.

 BlackTalos wrote:
Talk about shooting your foot:

Necroes wrote:
Page 131 of the core rule book, under 'Moving with the relic':

"The Relic is fragile, and swift movement will likely damage
it, so the model carrying the Relic cannot Run and can never
move more than 6" in any phase. If it is forced to do so, the
Relic is immediately dropped. A model with the Relic can
embark a Transport vehicle, but that vehicle cannot move
more than 6" per phase whilst the Relic is on board"

The model, here carrying a relic, cannot go more than 6". Limitation 1, and the relevant one here.
The vehicle, carrying the model, who is carrying the relic cannot go more than 6". Limitation 2

If your model is within 1" of the vehicle, only Limitation 2 applies.
But in you example, on turn 1, the model only has 4" left in it's "allowed movement", even if the vehicle has an allowance of 6".
And on turn 2, both vehicle and model have used the allowance of 6" therefore you can do:
2+4+6+6+0+6 = twenty-four inches in 2 turns.

Eldar Jetbikes can do 6" move, 6" flat-out, 6" in assault phase and do 36" in two turns which is the maximum the relic can ever do. RAI as such too.

I thought this was a place for Fact not opinion?

Unless you wrote the book how do you know what is intended? There is only two point's to this topic.

A. If they are transported by the Monolith are they removed from the table.
B. Do the models count as moving the distance between point A (where they were) and point B (Where the Monolith puts them)

Stratos wrote:
I thought this was a place for Fact not opinion?

Unless you wrote the book how do you know what is intended? There is only two point's to this topic.

A. If they are transported by the Monolith are they removed from the table.
B. Do the models count as moving the distance between point A (where they were) and point B (Where the Monolith puts them)

Ah, fact then:

OP:
If a squad of necrons is holding the relic in a relic mission and are pulled through the monolith's portal what happens?
-the relic goes with them
-they immediately drop the relic and go through
-they go through and the relic is dropped 6in closer to the monolith than the squad was(effectively moving towards the monolith 6in)
-they simply can't use the monoliths ability

Rule: The Relic is fragile, and swift movement will likely damage
it, so the model carrying the Reliccannot Run andcan never
move more than 6" in any phase

RAI: 18" per turn Max Relic movement.

Result:
If a squad of necrons is holding the relic in a relic mission and are pulled through the monolith's portal what happens?
-the relic goes with them
-they immediately drop the relic and go through
-they go through and the relic is dropped 6in closer to the monolith than the squad was(effectively moving towards the monolith 6in)
-they simply can't use the monoliths ability

2 or 4 are the only options adhering to the Rule

Automatically Appended Next Post:
Unless, of course, the Monolith Portal is within 6" of the Relic

The Necron Codex, page 47 wrote:Dimensional Corridor:... That unit immediately phases out from its current position and 'disembarks' from the Monolith's portal... the move is otherwise treated exactly as disembarking from a vehicle that has moved at combat speed.

The Rulebook, page 131 wrote:... the model carrying the Relic cannot Run and can never move more than 6" in any phase.

Disembarking is considered movement, if the Necron unit in question started its disembarking move from more than 6" away from the Monolith it has moved more than 6" in the phase, which the Relic rules do not allow.

I'm quite certain the monolith portal literally uses the word 'move' to describe what it is doing, so I'm not sure where the confusion still stems from. "... but the move is otherwise treated exactly as disembarking..."


So given that it is a move, if it is a distance of greater than 6", this applies: "...can never move more than 6" in any phase. If it is forced to do so, the Relic is immediately dropped..."

Indeed, the OP has been resolved, where said Relic cannot cross the table via said Monolith portal. =P

PrinceRaven wrote:

The Necron Codex, page 47 wrote:Dimensional Corridor:... That unit immediately phases out from its current position and 'disembarks' from the Monolith's portal... the move is otherwise treated exactly as disembarking from a vehicle that has moved at combat speed.

The Rulebook, page 131 wrote:... the model carrying the Relic cannot Run and can never move more than 6" in any phase.

Disembarking is considered movement, if the Necron unit in question started its disembarking move from more than 6" away from the Monolith it has moved more than 6" in the phase, which the Relic rules do not allow.

Neorealist wrote:I'm quite certain the monolith portal literally uses the word 'move' to describe what it is doing, so I'm not sure where the confusion still stems from. "... but the move is otherwise treated exactly as disembarking..."


So given that it is a move, if it is a distance of greater than 6", this applies: "...can never move more than 6" in any phase. If it is forced to do so, the Relic is immediately dropped..."

This is exactly what i asked does the Necron monolith say "Move"

Also I'm pretty sure you don't count as disembarking 30" for example in this situation.

Don't get me wrong i believe its intended that you can't but i cant see anyone giving a compelling rule based argument.

Stratos wrote:

B. Do the models count as moving the distance between point A (where they were) and point B (Where the Monolith puts them)

Yes, rules as stated above say so?

Yes the necron portal thing says 'move', quite clearly. Please refer to my post above (which you've directly quoted. Or for that matter page 47 of the 5th ed necron codex I got it from)

That and a measuring tape to determine the distance the unit carrying the relic has moved should be all that is necessary in these circumstances to arbitrate the OPs question.