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 Fenrir Kitsune wrote:

 Wilytank wrote:

valace2 wrote:
Seriously how do people play Daemons without Fateweaver?

I do it all the time. It's fun and hilarious to just let everything ride. All Chaotic like, ya know?

So do I, when I do play 40K nowadays. 100% Khorne, 100% fun.

valace2 wrote:
I seriously felt bad after the game.

valace2 wrote:
I will never apologize for the list I run.

Khorne is the way to go. By far the most fun, although gets crushed a bit in a tournament

valace2 wrote:


You want to let the Warp Storm Table dictate how your game will be run, be my guest.. In 2 out of the 4 games I have played in with my daemons I would have lost because of the Warp Storm table.

Most of the time, it lands on 5-9 and ends up not doing anything anyway.. And if I do get 4 or less, well then that's what happens to me then; I accept that. But those moments when Slaanesh's tongue-kiss of death lands on a Leman Russ, penetrates, and explodes the thing is 100% priceless. My GUO doesn't care if his invulnerable gets docked to a 6++ anyway.

thraxdown wrote:


Khorne is the way to go. By far the most fun, although gets crushed a bit in a tournament

I actually tend to lean more towards Slaanesh myself. I just realized recently how useful properly kitted out Slaanesh Heralds can be.

The guy berating op probably runs 2 riptides with a gunline and Eldar ally. in a casual setting.

sand.zzz wrote:
The guy berating op probably runs 2 riptides with a gunline and Eldar ally. in a casual setting.

I run enclave Tau allied to codex Tau. Gun line Tau is boring I love jsj and run crisis suit troops, sniper kroot, marker drone squads, and Riptides. It is highly mobile and performs exceptionally well.

Fateweaver is a crutch in all honesty.

I've played mono-Tzeentch or slight variations of it since the 5th edition codex dropped, and I've never once run 'ol Fatey. In our current book, the Bangstick LoC with a pair of Greater Gifts is way more fun, especially when his fireworks go off!

As for the 2++/re-rolled 2++, 40k players simply need to learn the fine art of chaffing. In Fantasy we have unkillable units and/or insane Deathstars that make even Taudar/Eltau & Screamerstar look tame by comparison. (you think Daemons are filth in 40k, be thankful we don't have Cacobomb or Khurgle Wall!)
Deployment & movement are critical in dealing with points denial or deathstar tactics. What you don't do is sit back and continue to repeatedly smash your entire army on a unit you know damn well you can't viably scratch.

Experiment 626 wrote:
Fateweaver is a crutch in all honesty.

I've played mono-Tzeentch or slight variations of it since the 5th edition codex dropped, and I've never once run 'ol Fatey. In our current book, the Bangstick LoC with a pair of Greater Gifts is way more fun, especially when his fireworks go off!

As for the 2++/re-rolled 2++, 40k players simply need to learn the fine art of chaffing. In Fantasy we have unkillable units and/or insane Deathstars that make even Taudar/Eltau & Screamerstar look tame by comparison. (you think Daemons are filth in 40k, be thankful we don't have Cacobomb or Khurgle Wall!)
Deployment & movement are critical in dealing with points denial or deathstar tactics. What you don't do is sit back and continue to repeatedly smash your entire army on a unit you know damn well you can't viably scratch.

Screamers are jetbikes, so good luck chaffing them. Imagine having a Gutstar or White Lion horde with Fly. Plus, the movement rules aren't as restrictive in 40k as in Fantasy.

Experiment 626 wrote:
Fateweaver is a crutch in all honesty.

I've played mono-Tzeentch or slight variations of it since the 5th edition codex dropped, and I've never once run 'ol Fatey. In our current book, the Bangstick LoC with a pair of Greater Gifts is way more fun, especially when his fireworks go off!

As for the 2++/re-rolled 2++, 40k players simply need to learn the fine art of chaffing. In Fantasy we have unkillable units and/or insane Deathstars that make even Taudar/Eltau & Screamerstar look tame by comparison. (you think Daemons are filth in 40k, be thankful we don't have Cacobomb or Khurgle Wall!)
Deployment & movement are critical in dealing with points denial or deathstar tactics. What you don't do is sit back and continue to repeatedly smash your entire army on a unit you know damn well you can't viably scratch.

How do you chaff a ++2 baronstar that has hit and run at very high Initiative?

Played a screamerstar with 2++ rerollable at the weekend with my marines, was good fun.

Drager wrote:
Played a screamerstar with 2++ rerollable at the weekend with my marines, was good fun.

Said nobody ever.

 MephistonLoD wrote:

Drager wrote:
Played a screamerstar with 2++ rerollable at the weekend with my marines, was good fun.

Said nobody ever.

No seriously was a really fun game. I was heading towards tabling him, but sadly we ran out of time.

Anecdote =/= evidence, Drager.

 BrotherHaraldus wrote:
Anecdote =/= evidence, Drager.

Yeah, I know.

What am I supposed to be providing evidence of? My emotions when playing a game? Do you want brain scans?

Evidence the game happened? It was at the Storm of Iron Tournament in Cardiff, my opponent was named Tom I think, wore a Cool Club T-shirt and played with the guys from that group. Any of them can confirm the game happened, as could the shop keeper, tournie judges etc. Do you need that kind of evidence that the game occured?

It was a fun game, I lost due to time running out (which is just a thing that happens at tourneys sometimes), but I enjoyed it anyway, opponent was a good guy and was a fun list to play against. There was no 100% guarantee I would win if things carried on, but it sure looked that way.

Although a little off topic, still related I played the eventual tourney winner, who had a 3 Serpent list, with Windriders and DE backup. Lost that too, due to (a) being outplayed and (b) soem astounding T1 luck from my opponent that sealed a tough match as unwinnable. I played Cron Air, which I tabled and O'vessa star, which I tabled and some nids, which I won against on objectives. All my opponents were good guys and I think we all had fun. If we didn't I was probably the problem.

So, yeah I was sharing the fact that I enjoy playing against such lists. I don't think that statement needs much evidential support, why would it?

2++ re-rollable isnt that terrible on a T3/T4 unit (where you can make them roll a couple dozen saves per turn from your basic infantry), its only terrible on something thats high toughness that requires you to use the more limited S6/7/8+ weapons you have available to actually wound it consistently.

Drager wrote:

 BrotherHaraldus wrote:
Anecdote =/= evidence, Drager.

Yeah, I know.

What am I supposed to be providing evidence of? My emotions when playing a game? Do you want brain scans?

Evidence the game happened? It was at the Storm of Iron Tournament in Cardiff, my opponent was named Tom I think, wore a Cool Club T-shirt and played with the guys from that group. Any of them can confirm the game happened, as could the shop keeper, tournie judges etc. Do you need that kind of evidence that the game occured?

It was a fun game, I lost due to time running out (which is just a thing that happens at tourneys sometimes), but I enjoyed it anyway, opponent was a good guy and was a fun list to play against. There was no 100% guarantee I would win if things carried on, but it sure looked that way.

Although a little off topic, still related I played the eventual tourney winner, who had a 3 Serpent list, with Windriders and DE backup. Lost that too, due to (a) being outplayed and (b) soem astounding T1 luck from my opponent that sealed a tough match as unwinnable. I played Cron Air, which I tabled and O'vessa star, which I tabled and some nids, which I won against on objectives. All my opponents were good guys and I think we all had fun. If we didn't I was probably the problem.

So, yeah I was sharing the fact that I enjoy playing against such lists. I don't think that statement needs much evidential support, why would it?

No.

The anecdote that you managed to have fun playing a screamerstar does not equal evidence of the screamerstar somehow not being something stupid. If we look at the bigger picture instead of just a game you head, it is honestly something that never should have been introduced.

You can provide as many anecdotes as you wish of you tabling broken lists, it won't make them stop being broken.

 BrotherHaraldus wrote:

Drager wrote:

 BrotherHaraldus wrote:
Anecdote =/= evidence, Drager.

Yeah, I know.

What am I supposed to be providing evidence of? My emotions when playing a game? Do you want brain scans?

Evidence the game happened? It was at the Storm of Iron Tournament in Cardiff, my opponent was named Tom I think, wore a Cool Club T-shirt and played with the guys from that group. Any of them can confirm the game happened, as could the shop keeper, tournie judges etc. Do you need that kind of evidence that the game occured?

It was a fun game, I lost due to time running out (which is just a thing that happens at tourneys sometimes), but I enjoyed it anyway, opponent was a good guy and was a fun list to play against. There was no 100% guarantee I would win if things carried on, but it sure looked that way.

Although a little off topic, still related I played the eventual tourney winner, who had a 3 Serpent list, with Windriders and DE backup. Lost that too, due to (a) being outplayed and (b) soem astounding T1 luck from my opponent that sealed a tough match as unwinnable. I played Cron Air, which I tabled and O'vessa star, which I tabled and some nids, which I won against on objectives. All my opponents were good guys and I think we all had fun. If we didn't I was probably the problem.

So, yeah I was sharing the fact that I enjoy playing against such lists. I don't think that statement needs much evidential support, why would it?

No.

The anecdote that you managed to have fun playing a screamerstar does not equal evidence of the screamerstar somehow not being something stupid. If we look at the bigger picture instead of just a game you head, it is honestly something that never should have been introduced.

You can provide as many anecdotes as you wish of you tabling broken lists, it won't make them stop being broken.

Ahh! I see. You misinterpreted my statement as saying Screamerstar was not broken. For the definition of broken you use I'm sure it is.

I, and others, enjoy playing with and against such lists. There are currently a good variety of top tier lists and decent to good counters to all of them (even if those counters are sometimes each other). This does not mean they are any less strong than they obviously are, nor does it mean they are easy to beat or even beatable at all with your more standard pick up list. They will pretty much horribly stomp such lists every time.

I don't think we disagree on the power level of the lists, the difficulty of playing against them or anything like that. Rather I think we simply disagree on (a) the definition of broken (although I am happy to use yours and agree these things are broken) and (b) whether they are fun.

That said I don't bring my top tier lists for pick up games. That's dull, for me. I try to modulate my play to whomever I am playing against so we both have fun. This does mean that I tell people if they want to go all out with the most powerful "broken" list they can I prefer that style of play, but if they aren't up for that I will break out my other, less competetive lists.

Exalted. Honestly, quite tired of the whinging from casuals and players who don't understand the game well enough to claim Screamerstar is broken.

Makumba wrote:

Experiment 626 wrote:
Fateweaver is a crutch in all honesty.

I've played mono-Tzeentch or slight variations of it since the 5th edition codex dropped, and I've never once run 'ol Fatey. In our current book, the Bangstick LoC with a pair of Greater Gifts is way more fun, especially when his fireworks go off!

As for the 2++/re-rolled 2++, 40k players simply need to learn the fine art of chaffing. In Fantasy we have unkillable units and/or insane Deathstars that make even Taudar/Eltau & Screamerstar look tame by comparison. (you think Daemons are filth in 40k, be thankful we don't have Cacobomb or Khurgle Wall!)
Deployment & movement are critical in dealing with points denial or deathstar tactics. What you don't do is sit back and continue to repeatedly smash your entire army on a unit you know damn well you can't viably scratch.

How do you chaff a ++2 baronstar that has hit and run at very high Initiative?

Are you talking about a deathstar that has been illegal for six months ?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Asmodai Asmodean wrote:
Exalted. Honestly, quite tired of the whinging from casuals and players who don't understand the game well enough to claim Screamerstar is broken.

I think the word broken is the problem here, it doesn't have any precise meaning, a bit like WAAC, or TFG, or fluffbunny, or... hey look at that article:

http://www.torrentoffire.com/6721/play-the-game-thats-right-for-you

Don't use his force axe and with Iron Arm and Warp Speed you get 7 st7 I7 ap2 attacks, and T7 2++ and 5+fnp (as he's obviously in a command squad, just for this ;-)) IF the opponent causes a wound, get it back with life leech.
This is when you know sevrin loth is OP
AND HES A SPACE MARINE! DUN DUN DUUUUUNNNNN!!!!

morgoth wrote:

Makumba wrote:

Experiment 626 wrote:
Fateweaver is a crutch in all honesty.

I've played mono-Tzeentch or slight variations of it since the 5th edition codex dropped, and I've never once run 'ol Fatey. In our current book, the Bangstick LoC with a pair of Greater Gifts is way more fun, especially when his fireworks go off!

As for the 2++/re-rolled 2++, 40k players simply need to learn the fine art of chaffing. In Fantasy we have unkillable units and/or insane Deathstars that make even Taudar/Eltau & Screamerstar look tame by comparison. (you think Daemons are filth in 40k, be thankful we don't have Cacobomb or Khurgle Wall!)
Deployment & movement are critical in dealing with points denial or deathstar tactics. What you don't do is sit back and continue to repeatedly smash your entire army on a unit you know damn well you can't viably scratch.

How do you chaff a ++2 baronstar that has hit and run at very high Initiative?

Are you talking about a deathstar that has been illegal for six months ?

I'm sure a year ago when he posted that it was still legal.

morgoth wrote:

Makumba wrote:

Experiment 626 wrote:
Fateweaver is a crutch in all honesty.

I've played mono-Tzeentch or slight variations of it since the 5th edition codex dropped, and I've never once run 'ol Fatey. In our current book, the Bangstick LoC with a pair of Greater Gifts is way more fun, especially when his fireworks go off!

As for the 2++/re-rolled 2++, 40k players simply need to learn the fine art of chaffing. In Fantasy we have unkillable units and/or insane Deathstars that make even Taudar/Eltau & Screamerstar look tame by comparison. (you think Daemons are filth in 40k, be thankful we don't have Cacobomb or Khurgle Wall!)
Deployment & movement are critical in dealing with points denial or deathstar tactics. What you don't do is sit back and continue to repeatedly smash your entire army on a unit you know damn well you can't viably scratch.

How do you chaff a ++2 baronstar that has hit and run at very high Initiative?

Are you talking about a deathstar that has been illegal for six months ?

And was perfectly legal for about six months after that post was made. How did you stumble into this thread?

 Vaktathi wrote:
I remember a time when 2+ and even 3+ invul saves were considered OP, and 2++ rerollables existed purely within the realm of hyperbole and parody.

I do wish we could return to some of that.

I run GKs with Dragio and I've honestly never even thought to cast sanctuary on the guy? it just seems... abusive

Are you talking about a deathstar that has been illegal for six months ?

Necroing a year old thread to say army is outdated

Thread locked since the previous post was from a year ago. Please check the date before posting in a thread like this - thanks!