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it's not rocket science, just go for it.

The perfect situations for me are parties/gatherings with friends of friends. I find people tend to be drawn to my conversations and a small group forms around me. If I see a cute girl peeking over then I'll approach her in a few minutes after that.

Once the conversation is started, I just go through the motions (Hi I'm (blank), how do you know so and so, oh cool! blah blah). Then playfully poke fun at them (hopefully they will return the favour), make a mental note of things they are saying and bring it up later in the conversation as a joke or something if possible.

More introverted people can sometimes easily be offended or feel slightly overwhelmed, but then again I'm not interested in that type anyways so it's for the best.

I'm not going to lie though - if you are over 6 ft, in decent shape, and dress decently (dress matter a lot for the type I'm after!) then you can take your pick. As others have said, personality is the main factor. Its best to stick to your guns in terms of interests and your overall behaviour. Act as you would normally, don't pretend to be something your not because you will get called out on it eventually and thats a deal breaker right off the bat.

One thing that is killing me personally is age at the moment. I'm 25 and despite the stupid things I post here, I feel a little older in terms of where I am in my career and mindset. It seems every girl I come accross who seems ideal is this magic #28 - many of them just won't date down regardless of how I come accross during a conversation or how well I'm doing with my career. Those that are within that 23-26 age range just don't interest me - lack of goals/focus, slacking in school/not looking for a solid job and just not seriously looking for a relationship. Bad luck I guess

 gorgon wrote:
The flip side to that is if you're from the U.S. and pursue a girl not from the U.S., she might expect you to pursue a little harder and give you fewer strong, positive signals than you're used to. This depends on her country and culture, but I can tell you from firsthand experience that it's definitely something to keep in mind when chasing international tail.

I was lucky that with my wife there was mutual interest, and we were both able to be pretty up front with each other. If there were any lingering doubts (there weren't) then they would have been blown away at our first meeting.

Step 1: Don't go to Dakka for dating advice.

 Albatross wrote:
The thing is, it's really no mystery. Anyone, repeat ANYONE can get a date. I go on loads of them. I've got a few extra pounds (though working on it, with success), I'm over 30 and starting to resemble Bruce Willis in the follicle department. Yet, and without sounding like a total dick, I'm pretty successful when it comes to *ahem* 'the Ladies'. I'm going to share what works for me, and I would encourage the rest of you to do the same. Let's get these gentlemen hooked up!

Oh come on now Alby, we all know you have the voice of an angel... I still get all weak in the knees whenever I listed to Annihilation.

 Albatross wrote:


There is nothing more powerful than not giving a gak when talking to a woman. I don't mean being aloof or uninterested. This isn't the '50s. Act friendly and interested. Crack jokes. Make fun of her. If she does it back, you're onto something. It's sort of a negging approach, but gentler.

I think that, right there, might be a huge part of my problem... though I also think part of that is that I might have an irrational fear that if I show any interest whatsoever then women will suddenly lose interest in me... that fear is (in part) based on prior experience, though it isn't necessarily an accurate conclusion to reach, merely the one that seems to fit the observations.

Getting a date is a numbers game. If you approach more women, you'll find yourself meeting more girls you take an interest in, and the more of them you ask out for a coffee, the more who will say yes.

Personally, I'm not a fan of that approach. I mean, it seems good if all you're after is a date and you don't really care with who/what, but if you're after something in particular then it takes a bit more effort and focus.

This is something I actually only figured when, of all places, my search of the internet for all truly crazy things took me to the Pick Up Artist community. Now these guys are really creepy and most of their ideas range between weird and completely insane, but the funny is that they have a much better success rate with women than a lot of guys. The interesting thing is that they get this success despite their their games and theories being incredibly stupid... but in focusing on games and method, they stop the pick up being personal - if a girl says no it is just a failure of their method, not a personal rejection. As a result, they can approach dozens of girls and not worry when they get turned down, because sooner or later a girl will say yes.

Sadly enough that sort of objectification is what most girls will tell you they ARENT interested in... this is also a dangerous approach (to the user of such techniques) as it borders on sociopathic.

The trick is how to get that mindset without picking up any of the PUA community's misogyny. To learn to just move on when a girl says no. It isn't ever easier, but it gets easier with age, and easier the more you try it.

This is true.

Sitting back eating cheetos, watching anime, playing video games and complaining about being friendzoned leaves you on the beach of the metaphorical gene pool. Sure, you might hook a girl in the same position, but the odds are you'll be taking what you can get as opposed to what you want, both in terms of personality and appearance.

And this!!!

I was never really shy or self-conscious, but certainly one of the more laid-back, let-it-happen-type of guys. At least that's what I thought. What I gathered over the course of my 20s was that instead I came across as friendly, but disinterested, unapproachable or even aloof, even though there was definite interest on the other side. For a long time I didn't understand why, as I was open, nice and rather successfull with my humor.

What I had to learn was to, for a lack of better words, "tone it down a bit"; and I don't mean acting dumber because all women are stupid, but showing that next to my intellectual side, there's a human being with strengths and weaknesses who's also really interested in the woman in front of him, not just the conversation. I simply never made that a topic before, because I was so caught up in "interesting things" to talk about that I always forgot to give a little of myself away as well.

I'm realizing this about myself as well.

The other really refreshing thing is that American girls don't give off so many weird mixed signals and so on, they are much more forward and clear on what their intentions are than British girls.

REALLY!??? Thats like the complete opposite of my experience.

In any case, I think the Aussie accent does more for American women than the English one... le sigh, if only I spoke like that

Like I said in the other thread, what will really undermine you with the first two points is to build things up too much. The best way to avoid this is to ACT. You see a girl you'd like to talk to, do it NOW. Waiting and watching and pining away will make you less than confident heading in and also put too much of your ego on the chopping block if she isn't into you. See girl, approach girl. Rinse and repeat.

Sometimes its not that simple, in my case it seems every girl I want to approach is always with someone (as in a guy), they might be just friends, they might be dating or whatever, in any case to me it doesn't matter, I have a pretty strict personal policy against that sort of thing, because I've been on the receiving end of that (over-confident dude trying to make a move on my date) a few times and absolutely hate it and wouldnt perpetuate that by doing it to others... interestingly enough though, it seems that married women/girls that are dating other dudes can't leave me be. Towards the end of this past summer there was probably a 6 week long stretch where every weekend a married (or otherwise unavailable) woman was making a pass at me, it really sucks cuz I ain't about that life.

As an aside, if you're like me, the thing that will take your desirability up to Super Saiyan level is to get married. Because I'm not looking anymore and don't care. Albatross knows this and has the advantage of being single, so he's got the special sauce. If I could give my 25 year old self the knowledge I have know, my young self would CLEAN UP. Seriously.

Your words are wise.

It should go without saying that the dating pool is ridiculously deeper if you don't limit yourself to gamer girls. So don't. And do what you need to do to be able to start a conversation with them.

Butbutbutbutbut... hot gamer girl covered in tattoos is like the holy grail...

I have a buddy. Good looking, athletic, ripped actually. Abs that every man wants. Immediately gets attention from women. His "game" however consists of being as intense as he possibly can. He has it in his head that women want the strong-silent type, so he consistently stares without blinking or saying anything, jaw clenched. Women are immediately turned off. I don't know how many times I've told him he's got to lighten up, personality goes a loooong way with women.

Oh gawd... this sounds so much like me... except the abs part.

One thing that is killing me personally is age at the moment. I'm 25 and despite the stupid things I post here, I feel a little older in terms of where I am in my career and mindset. It seems every girl I come accross who seems ideal is this magic #28 - many of them just won't date down regardless of how I come accross during a conversation or how well I'm doing with my career. Those that are within that 23-26 age range just don't interest me - lack of goals/focus, slacking in school/not looking for a solid job and just not seriously looking for a relationship.

This also sounds a lot like my quandry....

Step 1: Don't go to Dakka for dating advice.

I have a theory that dakka is actually a better resource for dating advice than you think. There are clearly members of the dakka community that have success with women and know a thing or two about it. These people are a better resource to the average gamer/nerd type than muscles mcgee over on pickupartistonline or whatever website it is that they use, because dakkites usually will have a similar background and set of hobbies, interests, etc. and will be able to relate better to a dakka users situation, etc.

 gorgon wrote:

Project confidence? Check.

Try and try again? Check.

Get your gak together? Check.

Straightforward and smart stuff right there. This is directed at men but works for women as well.

I can't wait to see where Alby is taking this thread, but I'm sure it will be a fun ride.

Get out there. Join a Meetup.com group for something non-nerdy like wine tasting or hiking. Chicks love wine, you like wine, you like chicks... fething go!

 kronk wrote:

 gorgon wrote:

Project confidence? Check.

Try and try again? Check.

Get your gak together? Check.

Straightforward and smart stuff right there. This is directed at men but works for women as well.

I can't wait to see where Alby is taking this thread, but I'm sure it will be a fun ride.

Get out there. Join a Meetup.com group for something non-nerdy like wine tasting or hiking. Chicks love wine, you like wine, you like chicks... fething go!

The only time I went to a wine tasting thing was with another couple. the girlz wouldn't finish their glasses, so we were forced to. Add on some port we had to taste and some crown royals when we stumbled from there to the next door Olive Garden, and us Menz were bombed out of our skulls before the evening even started.

So... you had a great time!

Here's how it works.

MANDATORY STEP: Step 1: Be attractive to the other person.

Step 2: Don't be super shy.


And that's it. It's pretty much that simple. If they think you're attractive, however they define that term, you simply need to have the confidence to act on it.

Confidence is the last .2 miles of the marathon, but attraction is the difference between sexy-time and sexual harassment.

The downside of this is that there's not really a magic way to act that will suddenly make you more attractive to someone who does not feel that way. If you don't fit within their "type" you're pretty much sunk.

And this is fairly true for both genders, frankly. Guys and Girls both have their "types," and just as a woman might deny a guy for being too large, men obviously do the same.

Then you bounce around between people who are your physical "type" until you find someone whose personality is compatible enough that you can stand them for longer than a few months of partying, and voila, marriage, or whatever long term partnership they choose (which has a 50% chance of failing).

 DogofWar1 wrote:
Here's how it works.

MANDATORY STEP: Step 1: Be attractive to the other person.

If they think you're attractive, however they define that term, you simply need to have the confidence to act on it.

You qualified Step 1 with that 2nd sentence, but worth reinforcing that looks aren't everything where women are concerned. Personality goes a long way.

Confidence can get you past DofofWar1's mandatory step 1, but it will only take you so far. Sometimes you just aren't their type/build.

Move on!

Bullockist wrote:
The whole exercize angle was more aimed at people who seem to be overly lacking in self confidence

I am !
It is not as obvious on the internet as it is when physically meeting me. It may not even be obvious when meeting physically to some people. But I sure am.
Bad body image was just a tiny part of it.

 Da Boss wrote:
Actually, "avoid being intensely serious" is great advice. When I was doing my PhD and immediately after I quit, I was really serious and dour, and I had zero luck with making friends with ANYONE, let alone laydees, at that time.

Lots of us nerds tend to be a bit intense, but cooling off on it is a good thing a lot of the time!

Nerds being too serious ? I would have thought the other way around. I mean, I consider all those goddamn crazy movies I like (from Troma to Sushi Typhoon) to be very nerdy, but also as far from serious as can be. Except if serious is to be taken in the Serious Sam sense, maybe.
Well, geek/nerd are such a blurry notions nowadays anyway…

 gorgon wrote:
One thing I'd add to the last point above -- which is specifically relevant to Dakka -- is to get yourself some interests and knowledge outside of geek stuff. Read some popular books, watch some popular TV shows, read/watch the news, whatever. This gives you a stronger base from which to start casual conversation with regular girls. It should go without saying that the dating pool is ridiculously deeper if you don't limit yourself to gamer girls. So don't. And do what you need to do to be able to start a conversation with them.

Well, geek stuff is going more and more mainstream anyway. I mean, I am pretty sure there are many, many more girls that would enjoy talking about stuff like Games of Throne now than there would have been about Star Trek a few years back.

But yeah, it is obviously almost always harder to speak about, say, music with random people when your favorite music style is something obscure and niche like psychobilly rather than ultra-mainsteam like pop-rock.
Niche interests can also be assets if you are lucky though, I think, If you discover some psychobilly chick and she discovers you share her musical tastes, it will be a much more meaningful shared interest. I mean, they do not get to meet other people that enjoy the same music they do as often as pop-rock fan.

 Flashman wrote:
but worth reinforcing that looks aren't everything where women are concerned. Personality goes a long way.

I guess what women cares about is just the same as what men care about. Analyzing what you want should give a pretty good idea of what they want. Not taking it too literally, of course, women do not want men with big boobs , but more like almost everyone will prefer being with someone who is just fun rather than someone who is nicer but oh so boring.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oups, most important part of my last message went missing somehow.

 Albatross wrote:
Why do you need to improve yourself?

Because I feel like at every step during my education, I had to be given a second chance, or have pityed my way in, rather than actually just succeed at anything. Because it seems I can not just focus on work, and will always look for something else, anything really, to do instead, and that will just certainly create big problems for me in some close future. Because I can not even get a decent amount of sleep because no matter how many time I decide that I will impose on myself a rigorous sleep schedule, when it is time to sleep, I always have an irresistible urge to do something else, anything really, rather than sleeping. Because I have absolutely no willpower whatsoever, and my life is so much worse than what it could be (not that I am complaining about my life, I am way too lucky for it not to be obscene, but that will not make me to like myself). Because there is such a gap between what I want to do, and what I actually do.
Getting a girlfriend would just be icing on the cake !

 Flashman wrote:

 DogofWar1 wrote:
Here's how it works.

MANDATORY STEP: Step 1: Be attractive to the other person.

If they think you're attractive, however they define that term, you simply need to have the confidence to act on it.

You qualified Step 1 with that 2nd sentence, but worth reinforcing that looks aren't everything where women are concerned. Personality goes a long way.

Actually, I think I misspoke by using "need" in that 2nd sentence. I should have read "term, then having the confidence to act on it is generally sufficient."

You can still be lacking in confidence and be successful, it simply requires the other person to be that much more confident and willing to approach. If a guy is shy, it won't bar success if the woman comes up and makes it clear he won't be rejected. Once there is mutual attraction, one of the parties has to have enough of it to approach, and the other party should be accepting enough to show that their approach is not being rejected. Like, if someone is really attracted to someone else, they'll likely be willing to forgive some shyness, because the payoff for not writing off someone attractive because of confidence issues is high enough that a second chance is warranted (that's also the reason people forgive their significant others for doing really stupid things, the costs of staying with them are outweighed by the benefits of staying).

But there has to be attraction in the first place. Attraction is not always based on looks (some people look for positive things for the right reasons, such as intellect, and some people look for positive things for the wrong reasons, like money), but it usually is heavily based on physical attraction. Compatible personality minus attraction tends to result in friendship, while compatible personality plus attraction equals relationship. Attraction alone tends to result in booty calls.

Confidence is a very important step in the courting process, but it is usually separate from the issue of attraction. It helps chances (if you walk into a room with 100 people of the opposite gender and 20 find you attractive, having the confidence to hit on 10 of them makes you far more likely to be successful than having the confidence to only talk to 3), and can help to ensure someone learns enough about you that they can make an educated decision on their level of attraction (assuming their standard for attraction is not looks-based, like discovering common interests), but unless confidence is the determinative factor through which they decide if someone is attractive or not, it ends up sort of being it's own issue that is secondary in importance to attraction.

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:
Well, geek stuff is going more and more mainstream anyway. I mean, I am pretty sure there are many, many more girls that would enjoy talking about stuff like Games of Throne now than there would have been about Star Trek a few years back.

Debatable. While geeky/nerdy things like comic book movies and game of thrones are becoming more accessible, I'd argue they have always been 'mainstream'. Star Trek, Star Wars, et al. have always been fairly popular (maybe not amongst women), hell the kids that picked on me for being a nerd or what have you when I was little watched those movies/played those games, etc. The difference, however, is that those kids didn't read the books, study the history, buy the essential guides/encyclopedias, debate what it means to make the Kessel run in 12 parsecs, etc. etc. etc. In other words, they liked that stuff, but they weren't fans. Likewise, for the most part, things like Game of Thrones, the Marvel comic movies (because as much as I like DC, their movies are terrible), etc. are more accessible to women these days, and women even like those things, but they aren't necessarily fans who are going to dig into the comics, study the history, debate whether or not the Kirby Silver Surfer was better than the Moebius Silver Surfer, etc.

But yeah, it is obviously almost always harder to speak about, say, music with random people when your favorite music style is something obscure and niche like psychobilly rather than ultra-mainsteam like pop-rock.

Oddly enough I know a lot of girls that ARE into that obscure/indy music scene lol probably more than those that listen to the poppy top 20 stuff on the radio

Because I feel like at every step during my education, I had to be given a second chance, or have pityed my way in, rather than actually just succeed at anything. Because it seems I can not just focus on work, and will always look for something else, anything really, to do instead, and that will just certainly create big problems for me in some close future. Because I can not even get a decent amount of sleep because no matter how many time I decide that I will impose on myself a rigorous sleep schedule, when it is time to sleep, I always have an irresistible urge to do something else, anything really, rather than sleeping. Because I have absolutely no willpower whatsoever, and my life is so much worse than what it could be (not that I am complaining about my life, I am way too lucky for it not to be obscene, but that will not make me to like myself). Because there is such a gap between what I want to do, and what I actually do.
Getting a girlfriend would just be icing on the cake !

Join the Army and get some discipline.

Doesn't work all the time there Chaos

chaos0xomega wrote:
Star Trek, Star Wars, et al. have always been fairly popular

Star Wars maybe, but Star Trek ? Really ?

chaos0xomega wrote:
Likewise, for the most part, things like Game of Thrones, the Marvel comic movies (because as much as I like DC, their movies are terrible), etc. are more accessible to women these days, and women even like those things, but they aren't necessarily fans who are going to dig into the comics, study the history, debate whether or not the Kirby Silver Surfer was better than the Moebius Silver Surfer, etc.

Well, it is true that much more people seem to have saw the series rather than read A Song of Ice and Fire. As for comics… well, they are not really popular in France. Actually, manga are. Much more than even our own, home-made bande-dessinée (which is a bit sad, especially since it is in general way less driven by commercial decisions than both comics and manga). And there are quite a bunch of girls reading manga. Well, usually younger girls, but still.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Oddly enough I know a lot of girls that ARE into that obscure/indy music scene lol probably more than those that listen to the poppy top 20 stuff on the radio

I know quite a lot of girls that are quite geeky. No wonder. Alike people go together, or whatever is the actual idiomatic expression in English.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Join the Army and get some discipline.

That is quite a “swim or die” solution . Not sure it would help. Following orders is not the same as having self-discipline. Also would cause problem for my academic career.

That is quite a “swim or die” solution . Not sure it would help. Following orders is not the same as having self-discipline. Also would cause problem for my academic career.

So out of touch

The best way to get a date/impress someone is to slide up next to them and say "Hey, I play Orks".

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

Well, geek stuff is going more and more mainstream anyway. I mean, I am pretty sure there are many, many more girls that would enjoy talking about stuff like Games of Throne now than there would have been about Star Trek a few years back.

Truth. I met a stripper in Nashville who was a massive Dr. Who fan and, as it turns out, anglophile. Yes, I asked her out. In the strip joint. Why the feth not? She said yes. We had a lovely time.

 Albatross wrote:
Why do you need to improve yourself?

Because I feel like at every step during my education, I had to be given a second chance, or have pityed my way in, rather than actually just succeed at anything. Because it seems I can not just focus on work, and will always look for something else, anything really, to do instead, and that will just certainly create big problems for me in some close future. Because I can not even get a decent amount of sleep because no matter how many time I decide that I will impose on myself a rigorous sleep schedule, when it is time to sleep, I always have an irresistible urge to do something else, anything really, rather than sleeping. Because I have absolutely no willpower whatsoever, and my life is so much worse than what it could be (not that I am complaining about my life, I am way too lucky for it not to be obscene, but that will not make me to like myself). Because there is such a gap between what I want to do, and what I actually do.
Getting a girlfriend would just be icing on the cake !

You just described the life of literally almost everyone, more or less. To a certain extent. The difference is our attitude towards it. You think everyone has their gak together? It's all relative. The key is to enjoy your life as it is, but making positive changes where needed.

 Ahtman wrote:
The best way to get a date/impress someone is to slide up next to them and say "Hey, I play Orks".

Is that a good way to start, implying she looks like an ork?

Hybrid son , I'd say start creating an "aura" of discipline/order , establish a time table for doing small tasks and then take the time to enjoy making those small achievements. Works for me even on small tasks like cleaning, i started doing this about 1 year ago and it's obscene how much relief i feel after doing some housework. This then follows on to other parts of your life because you get in a habit of completeing things. I have a huge problem with sleep, forcing yourself to stay in bed not thinking about anything or how you should be sleeping is amazingly theraputic in fact lying in bed letting my brain defragment can be almost as good as a nights sleep. I also to have the attention span of a gnat unfortunately creating order around me seems to be the best way to deal with it.

Incidentally, I've just come back from a first date with a girl I met on Tinder. She only bloody kissed me, didn't she?!

 Da Boss wrote:
First off, Seb is right on the money about ignoring any pick up artist stuff if you are actually interested in a girlfriend, rather than sex.

Except the numbers thing. The PUA community is bang on the money about the numbers thing - put yourself out there and approach girls. The more girls you approach, the more will say yes. This doesn't mean throw yourself in front of every women you ever see, but it does mean that if you see a single girl you like, go up and say 'hi'.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Frazzled wrote:
I would also add, don't be serious. Don't make it life or death.

Yeah, this is also really good advice.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Da Boss wrote:
It was only online correspondence that brought out my less than absolutely dour and serious side. (Which is weird, because I'm a lot less jokey on Dakka now than I am in real life.)

Dakka is the place I use to get all the shouting out of my system

That's a hell of a lot of shouting Sebster , perhaps you should pay seaward as your councillor.

Bullockist wrote:
That's a hell of a lot of shouting Sebster , perhaps you should pay seaward as your councillor.

Maybe I do.... you don't think he posts all that stuff because he actually believes it

I honestly am not sure about either of you , but i believe I owe you guys some money from the laughter your multiquote argments generated a few months ago. I was up to the 5th page of some topic and lo and behold a sebster/seaward argument started and kept going the whole page, I think"geez this seems like a good one" , check the next page, still going, the next, still going and this point i think "WTF guys" and burst out laughing. 3 pages of internet argument is dedicated.

chaos0xomega wrote:

Join the Army and get some discipline.

There are other ways to get disciplined. Ones that don't involve pledging yourself to an organization whose goals you might not actually agree with.

Just a thought.

Oh, and a couple bits of advice: DRESS WELL. Seriously people. It's not hard or expensive to do this. Plus, you just feel better when you wear good clothes.
On a related note, GROOM. Shower regularly, brush your teeth twice a day, floss, wear good deodorant/cologne*, get a flattering haircut. This is all basic stuff that an appallingly large amount of men, especially single men, neglect to do.

Oh yeah, and be yourself and be comfortable with that. Putting on a facade is a good way to end up with the wrong person. Potential partners need to know who you really are.

~Tim?

*you want it to be subtle and not overpowering - Axe=NO

Yeah, the importance of a decent anti-perspirant and cologne cannot be overstated. I wear Paul Smith for Men or YSL L'Homme (depending on the occasion) and they both go down well. If a woman actually TELLS you that you smell amazing (as opposed to just thinking it) it's a good start.

 Albatross wrote:
Yeah, the importance of a decent anti-perspirant and cologne cannot be overstated. I wear Paul Smith for Men or YSL L'Homme (depending on the occasion) and they both go down well. If a woman actually TELLS you that you smell amazing (as opposed to just thinking it) it's a good start.

I've worn any kind of that stuff about... 15 times in my life. Every version of perfume gives me major headaches so I can't be arsed. It helps that I don't exert myself much.

 Hybrid Son Of Oxayotl wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:
Oddly enough I know a lot of girls that ARE into that obscure/indy music scene lol probably more than those that listen to the poppy top 20 stuff on the radio

I know quite a lot of girls that are quite geeky. No wonder. Alike people go together, or whatever is the actual idiomatic expression in English.

chaos0xomega wrote:
Join the Army and get some discipline.

That is quite a “swim or die” solution . Not sure it would help. Following orders is not the same as having self-discipline. Also would cause problem for my academic career.

"Birds of a feather flock together." I'm a man of many faces and travel in many circles, including more athletically oriented ones, I know lots of girls that are into really really heavy/dark metal, rockabilly, bands I've never heard of, *insert arbitrary, random, and superfluous sub-genre here*, etc.

As for the following orders/discipline thing, I disagree but fair enough, I found my experience with ROTC helped me out a lot in many, many ways (although in a sense it damaged me, because my tolerance for the level of bs in the civilian world has dropped through the floor, probably why I'm trying to get into OTS/OCS so badly lol).

There are other ways to get disciplined. Ones that don't involve pledging yourself to an organization whose goals you might not actually agree with.

Just a thought.

Fine, Air Force or Marine Corps if you want to be a real man Oh, you meant you DON'T want to be a real man? Fine... Coast Guard... but not the Navy. Seriously though, military service in France is a good bit different than in the US, aside from the standard issue white flags (JOKING!!!), they tend to do the humanitarian/peacekeeping thing primarily (rather than being used as a warfighting/political instrument) more like the National Guard in the US (without the combat deployments to the mid-east for a decade +), so unless you disagree with protecting people from harm and assisting in recovery, etc. that shouldn't really be an issue.

Oh, and a couple bits of advice: DRESS WELL. Seriously people. It's not hard or expensive to do this. Plus, you just feel better when you wear good clothes.
On a related note, GROOM. Shower regularly, brush your teeth twice a day, floss, wear good deodorant/cologne*, get a flattering haircut. This is all basic stuff that an appallingly large amount of men, especially single men, neglect to do.

This is dangerous advice to give if the person receiving it has a different perspective on what it means to dress well and groom. What you're trying to tell them is to dress in a trendy and sophisticated manner, for example by wearing a grey tailored suit with brown leather wingtip shoes and matching brown belt, perhaps a pink button up beneath the jacket with the top two buttons undone to reveal a white crew neck underneath... what they *MIGHT* be hearing is "Oh, so I should put on my best black leather trenchcoat with my favorite black Megadeath t-shirt and the black pants with neon green accents I got at Hot Topic with the chains crossed behind the back and my studded arm bracelets, etc. etc.

at least you qualified your statement by telling them not to use Axe though!

Better, try suggesting that someone looking to improve their fashion sense and style pick up say... Mens Health, or perhaps check out askmen.com or similar sites online...

As for scent, scent is IMPORTANT, though I think cologne should be severely limited to only formal occasions. Personally, I am of the philosophy that you should 'brand' yourself with a certain scent. For this reason, I have been using the same shampoo, soap, and deoderant for about 4 years now, its kind of like my 'odor identity' and I get complimented all the time over it. It's very subtle and the ladies only really pick up on it once they get closer to me (physically speaking), but you never want to lay all your cards down on the table up-front anyway. What you want to happen is to draw them in with looks, charm, and personality, and once they're within range of your scent they'll be thinking "Oh damn, and he smells amazing too, must know more about him!"

Hotties (Men or Women) are a dime a dozen. Don;t get bent out of shape about finding the right one. Just find one that is interested in you.