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"So you pay 25 points per squad for a str8 weapon that may or may not be used, and on a 2a base model to boot? Wow bro"

What are you talking about?

"Breaking down Dante's cost numerically, we find that his stat line is worth about 130 points. The jump pack, pistol, and axe are 15 each, and the artificer armor is 20. The normal death mask is about 5, bringing us to 200 points even. This means that the hit and run, tactical precision, enemy IC nerf and force org swap are all crammed into the last 25 points. Seems pretty efficient. "

The whole is far less than the sum of the parts.

As for the libby, you can pick at the beginning of each battle to go codex or BRB. That's pretty valuable sometimes.

"And Mephiston is definitely the best HQ in the book."

No, I'd say level 1 libby, because sometimes you don't want a 250 pt HQ.

Dante is just not really worth the points you spend on him. As someone who plays against BA, I HATE his Death Mask and H&R shenanigans can be annoying, but other than that, he doesn't scare me. He's mediocre in assault, and nearly all the damage he'll cause will be on arrival. Unfortunately, most units he needs to join to make that damage painful enough are just too expensive for it to be worthwhile - you're looking at 500pts or more for a 1 turn deep strike, and that's going to gimp the rest of your killing power on that first turn.

The Reclusiarch has the same problem - he helps 1 unit, but doesn't do anything for the rest of the army, whereas the Librarian is more flexible. Mephiston gets a pass because he can annihilate units singlehandedly - he's actually good at what he does, and is a massive distraction.

500 points for a unit is not much right now, compared to squads that easily crack 1k. And the whole is less than the sum of its parts? So putting all that good stuff on a dude actually makes him bad?

Whatever, you make less than zero sense, and are simply another child of the internet. Make your own observations, for once. I now remember why i stopped posting on dakka. Peace out.

 th3maninblak wrote:
500 points for a unit is not much right now, compared to squads that easily crack 1k. And the whole is less than the sum of its parts? So putting all that good stuff on a dude actually makes him bad?

Whatever, you make less than zero sense, and are simply another child of the internet. Make your own observations, for once. I now remember why i stopped posting on dakka. Peace out.

Amusing, because I started playing BA in 1994. I probably have far, far more observations than you. The stuff on Dante is not that good. He pays a lot for a ton of features that don't accomplish much. If this were a net-friendly game, I could crush your Dante-centric list a few times like I have done to locals who pimp DC. C:BA has very few units worth fielding in 6th ed, and even those are subpar.

"500 points for a unit is not much right now"

There are no 500 pt squads that I can think of out of C:BA that are worth it. C:BA is all about being a cheapass now.

 th3maninblak wrote:
500 points for a unit is not much right now, compared to squads that easily crack 1k. And the whole is less than the sum of its parts? So putting all that good stuff on a dude actually makes him bad?

Whatever, you make less than zero sense, and are simply another child of the internet. Make your own observations, for once. I now remember why i stopped posting on dakka. Peace out.

Well you certainly seem like a very mature chap, and are also probably very good at the 40ks. Good job you!

The thing about those super expensive units you're comparing Dante and a squad of dudes to, is that those super units are actually good. They are super hard to kill, are really good at killing, and have different ways of actually winning you the game. For instance, a Seer Council can be split into 4 different, almost unkillable, parts, 3 of which can move 48" in a single turn and the 4th a mere 18". That's pretty damn convenient for contesting objectives.

Dante and some dudes can only do one thing: drop in, kill tank, die horribly. That's really it.

As for the "So putting all that good stuff on a dude actually makes him bad?" thing. You pay 225 points for an amusing nerf to your opponent's warlord, a crappy cc dude, good deep strike and hit and run (in an army that doesn't get that much out of it). That's what makes Dante bad. 2+/4++ without EW means he dies quickly. 5 attacks with a power axe isn't really that impressive. So after you've killed a tank, what then? 25% of your army dies. In an army that already struggles with few models and everything being overcosted. That is, if you actually manage to kill that tank. Against Wave Serpents you're pretty unlikely to be successful. Against Tau you're probably dead before the movement phase is over anyway.

Martel732 wrote:

 th3maninblak wrote:
500 points for a unit is not much right now, compared to squads that easily crack 1k. And the whole is less than the sum of its parts? So putting all that good stuff on a dude actually makes him bad?

Whatever, you make less than zero sense, and are simply another child of the internet. Make your own observations, for once. I now remember why i stopped posting on dakka. Peace out.

Amusing, because I started playing BA in 1994. I probably have far, far more observations than you.

And I've been playing against Dante bomb lists since 6th started and routinely trash them. Dante comes in and kills a tank or a couple Tyrant Guard. My units then shoot the gak out of him and then win in assault, or Swarmlord turns around and mutilates Dante with ease. Dante is just plain mediocre in assault. Sure it's good that he has all that stuff on him, but he has some pretty glaring weaknesses (WAAAAAAARD) that are so easily exploitable that it makes him not really worth it.

 Thud wrote:
The thing about those super expensive units you're comparing Dante and a squad of dudes to, is that those super units are actually good. They are super hard to kill, are really good at killing, and have different ways of actually winning you the game. For instance, a Seer Council can be split into 4 different, almost unkillable, parts, 3 of which can move 48" in a single turn and the 4th a mere 18". That's pretty damn convenient for contesting objectives.

Dante and some dudes can only do one thing: drop in, kill tank, die horribly. That's really it.

This is exactly what I was saying.

I guess he wants to kill that tank really, really badly. Me? I'll just prescience some autolas preds that are safely 48" away. Yes, I do indeed play the coward angels. Because we suck.

Why not run both?

Because Dante is 225 pts of fail. I can almost buy another libby and tank with that.

I've played against many many Blood Angels lists, and none of them ever used Dante. Corbulo and the Sanguinor were a popular combo from one guy (Corbulo tanking wounds with 2+ FNP), but Mephiston was by far the biggest pain in the neck. Even though he's only AP3 now (I think they'll fix that in the next Codex to be AP2 at normal initiative) he still wreaks havoc, and forces many shots to be dedicated to him to do anything.

The Reclusiarch is awesome on the charge, and with jump packs can get there with a potent assault force, but then you're left sitting in the wind for the next round of shooting.

So until they let units consolidate into another combat in 6 1/2th edition, maybe try a Reclusiarch with a HUGE jump pack unit and multi-charge enemies so as to not auto-kill everything in that turn, or kill so much in 1 turn that there's little else to shoot you next turn. Multi-charging does permit that multiple Overwatching, but can really pay off on occasion (my Jugger-Herald/Flesh Hound unit has proven that many times).


Can't Death Company take like 30 guys with all thunderhammers? Heck, get a Libby in there too with a unit-wide invul power or something. Scoring units....who needs 'em?!

 Lord Krungharr wrote:
Can't Death Company take like 30 guys with all thunderhammers? Heck, get a Libby in there too with a unit-wide invul power or something. Scoring units....who needs 'em?!

For, like, 1000pts for one unit...

 Andilus Greatsword wrote:

 Lord Krungharr wrote:
Can't Death Company take like 30 guys with all thunderhammers? Heck, get a Libby in there too with a unit-wide invul power or something. Scoring units....who needs 'em?!

For, like, 1000pts for one unit...

One non-scoring unit.

Remember that folks.

In a game where 5/6 missions are about objectives...

Still, my Flesh Tearers are works in progress, probably going to go MSU assault squads. Not the current meta but sort of what I was going for. Plus they can conveniently ally with the SMs or Eldar I have.