Warhammer 40K Video Bat Rep New Orks vs Black Dragons

Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:

No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.

If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

**Barrywise**

Ashwaster wrote:
These guys found some good in the new mob rule.

Warning: Very Australian

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wonFApCHqHs

Holy bajeesus, i never considered that. For those too lazy to watch a second video, because of the new leadership table the Orks can never fail leadership in CC, yes they can inflict some wounds on themselves but they never run from combat. Even if you're down to the last man you can still tie up a blob of 16 chaos marines for another turn.

I think the reason the orks are such a threat now is because they're using some Dark Eldar tactics, specifically: "get in their face and present multiple threats" and because of their greater survivability and numbers compared to Dark Eldar they can actually pull it off, effectively pinning the chaos space marine army in the corner until their numbers were wittled down, at which point it was too late for the CSM to come back for points. So as much as people are saying that the orks are nerfed, they might be one of the best armies currently for Maelstorm missions.

**WrentheFaceless**

Red Corsair wrote:
WrentheFaceless wrote:
Even with the Mob Rule stuff, he still won.

Nids didnt win their initial reports

Well.. actually he lost lol... Reece has to be one of the most emotionally bipolar players I have ever seen. I got cold all the way over here on the east coast when he realized what happened hahaha.

Ok I'm going crazy today n/m thought the Orks had won.

**easysauce**

having a whole army of fearless units was a bit of a crutch/anachronsim, and they were given fearless at a time when it caused extra wounds to be had,

mob rule + ld 7 is still better then plain old ld 7 (which works out fine for guard, tau, and so on)

you can take HQ's to mitigate it (ONE example being zagstrukk who auto gets the re roll LD and pinning check)

having the possibility to fail a LD test shouldnt break your game... even space marines can run once in a while, it makes sense that orks can too.

good bat rep, orks lost, but the codex got a huge buff in general.

**Zagman**

Red Corsair wrote:
WrentheFaceless wrote:
Even with the Mob Rule stuff, he still won.

Nids didnt win their initial reports

Well.. actually he lost lol... Reece has to be one of the most emotionally bipolar players I have ever seen. I got cold all the way over here on the east coast when he realized what happened hahaha.

Yes, I swear someone just kicked his puppy.

**y0disisray**

I think the solution to the Mob Rule is to run 10 Trukk Boyz without a Nob that way when the Trukk does explode the worse thing that is going to happen is they will fail their Leadership check and Pinning check but they won't have to take extra wounds. Also another solution I would like to try is to run Ghazghkull since he automatically gets the Prophet of the Waagh! Warlord Trait which will make all your units with the 'Ere We Go rule Fearless for a turn. The beauty of this is if units are falling back you can call the Waagh! to have them gain Fearless and automatically regroup. Ghazghkull's Waagh! didn't use to be able to work on units that were already falling back so I think this is a gem.

**Reecius**

Glad you liked it, fellas.

Yeah, when Dan said he won at the end you can feel me just deflate, lol! Hahaha, I totally didn't see that he had me, the sneaky git!

As for taking Morale and Pinnin when a Trukk explodes, you only HAVE to take pinning, of course, but, you lose an average of 5 Boyz when a Trukk explodes (12 boys hit, 6 wounds, 1 save=5 dead). So, you then take the Pin test and Morale test which overages say you fail 1, you then hit yourself for an average of another 1-2 dead Boyz.

But, you guys are right, Drop Pod Sallies vs. Turkks is a tough match, that made it worse than it would have been in many cases which is why it was so shocking to me, I think.

Plus, regular Trukks in Boyz is not a good idea, really. Trukks work with Meganobz fine, though, and I tried Ard Boyz in a Trukk and while a tad expensive for what you ge,t they survive.

Painboy helps a ton, too, I tired that and it makes a huge difference.

Basically though, I don't think you can run straight Trukk rush as any army with good shooting will dominate you. If you go first, you will deliver 108 Boys into their face turn 1, so that would work really well, but if you go second it is brutal.

Maybe use a VSG? That actually may be the solution, or a way to mitigate it.

Orks don't suck at all, Mob Rule is a bummer, though, no doubt.

**y0disisray**

Reecius wrote:
Glad you liked it, fellas.

Yeah, when Dan said he won at the end you can feel me just deflate, lol! Hahaha, I totally didn't see that he had me, the sneaky git!

As for taking Morale and Pinnin when a Trukk explodes, you only HAVE to take pinning, of course, but, you lose an average of 5 Boyz when a Trukk explodes (12 boys hit, 6 wounds, 1 save=5 dead). So, you then take the Pin test and Morale test which overages say you fail 1, you then hit yourself for an average of another 1-2 dead Boyz.

But, you guys are right, Drop Pod Sallies vs. Turkks is a tough match, that made it worse than it would have been in many cases which is why it was so shocking to me, I think.

Plus, regular Trukks in Boyz is not a good idea, really. Trukks work with Meganobz fine, though, and I tried Ard Boyz in a Trukk and while a tad expensive for what you ge,t they survive.

Another trick is to tank the wounds on a character in Mega Armor when it pops (if you can) especially with a Lucky Stikk. That helps immensely.

Painboy helps a ton, too, I tired that and it makes a huge difference.

Basically though, I don't think you can run straight Trukk rush as any army with good shooting will dominate you. If you go first, you will deliver 108 Boys into their face turn 1, so that would work really well, but if you go second it is brutal.

Maybe use a VSG? That actually may be the solution, or a way to mitigate it.

Orks don't suck at all, Mob Rule is a bummer, though, no doubt.

Interesting...the effects of the passengers of a vehicle that Explodes! says you have to randomly allocate the wounds but in the far back of the book it says the unit just takes the wounds. So I guess it depends on how you play it as whether its important to take a tanking character? I thought you were sold on the idea of running just 10 Boyz in a Trukk and nothing else? Two Objective Secured units for 90 points is dirt cheap! Six units of those and just throw in a bunch of units that are equally just as fast to force your opponent to pick their poison. This is all just hypothetical of course as I have not yet tried it.

**Reecius**

Ah good catch, it is randomly allocated. Damn, that sucks.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
I tried 10 Shoota Boyz in a Trukk, it worked OK. They died but they did require a decent amount of attention.

**Valek**

A question for Captain Dee, the spacemarine list looks tough but in fact has 0 air counterdefence, is this playable in this edition, do we suspect less flyers?

**Kelly502**

I enjoyed that battle report! Going to look at a similar Mob but I think I'll include armor, and the Pain Boyz as suggested by one of the guys.

Ordering the 4by6 urban mat too, thanks for the mid report commercial otherwise I would have forgotten to finish my order.

**koooaei**

Well. Probably it's better not to put boyz in trucks vs salamanders drop pods. Just a ton of footslogging 12-strong squads and a blos wall of trucks.

Mob rule is better with meganobz now. I guess, only meganobz are gona be good in trucks thanks to it.

Meganobz + mek boy in a ram truck.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

easysauce wrote:
having a whole army of fearless units was a bit of a crutch/anachronsim, and they were given fearless at a time when it caused extra wounds to be had,

mob rule + ld 7 is still better then plain old ld 7 (which works out fine for guard, tau, and so on)

you can take HQ's to mitigate it (ONE example being zagstrukk who auto gets the re roll LD and pinning check)

having the possibility to fail a LD test shouldnt break your game... even space marines can run once in a while, it makes sense that orks can too.

good bat rep, orks lost, but the codex got a huge buff in general.

Guards are fearless armywide. In general...it's hard to say. Boyz are worse and they are supposed to be a backbone of the army. I mean if he was playing a 4 ed codex, he'd do way better. It's clear that truckrush ain't working no more.

**Ravenous D**

Valek wrote:
A question for Captain Dee, the spacemarine list looks tough but in fact has 0 air counterdefence, is this playable in this edition, do we suspect less flyers?

He has rerolls on the melta and multimeltas, Its more then enough. Local tournament saw 4 Valkyries/Vendettas drop in a single turn to on mass twin linked melta. Each multi melta has a 30" threat range.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kelly502 wrote:
I enjoyed that battle report! Going to look at a similar Mob but I think I'll include armor, and the Pain Boyz as suggested by one of the guys.

Ordering the 4by6 urban mat too, thanks for the mid report commercial otherwise I would have forgotten to finish my order.

Go Grotsnik, adds FNP, fearless and rampage. Also good in combat and rocks T5.

**Reecius**

@Kelly

Hey, nice! Thanks for the business and glad you enjoyed the commercial!

@Valek

Yeah, as Ravenous D pointed out, the twin-linked Melta weapons work really well for dropping airborne threats.

**Ravenous D**

Ive been looking at a couple things and haven't hide time to try them out, go nuts if you feel like it:

Mega armoured boss with lucky stikk tanking wounds.

Mega armoured boss/mek with flash gitz in a battle wagon, since slow and purposeful applies to the whole unit they can move and fire as stationary (so +1BS from gitfinda).

Grotsnik in various places, seriously rampage is insane for meganobz.

**herpguy**

I'm pretty sure slow and purposeful doesn't make you count as stationary for assault weapons.

Anyways even though flash gitz saw one of the biggest price drops they're still pretty bad. S5 is just that awkward strength that isn't really enough to hurt many things and they still only have a 6+ save.

I always liked the MANz missile and I think it got slightly better. I know I'll be running them from the formation that gives them fearless and +1 ws for free.

Just for fun though I really want to try a tellyport blasta, it looks awesome! That + Lucky stikk = lots of instant death.

**Reecius**

@Ravenous

We have tried Megaboss with Lucky Stikk and it's pretty outstanding!

S&P does count as being stationary so it seems like it would work for the Gitfinda, nice! Although, it also means you can't fire overwatch, so there is pros and cons.

Grotsnik is a beast. I think you will see him in a great many lists. So good.

**Dozer Blades**

BS3 relentless Lootas is nasty !

**RiTides**

Red Corsair wrote:
WrentheFaceless wrote:
Even with the Mob Rule stuff, he still won.

Nids didnt win their initial reports

Well.. actually he lost lol... Reece has to be one of the most emotionally bipolar players I have ever seen. I got cold all the way over here on the east coast when he realized what happened hahaha.

Lol, after a few of you mentioned this I had to watch it just for that

. Saw the one with jy2 where he still pulled it out, but yeah, I think that has probably happened to all of us, just not on camera

. Way to be a good sport about it, Reece, and it looks like your orks did really well in the game regardless. Lots of carnage... some self-inflicted due to the new rules.

Also cool seeing a drop pod list in 7th ed, looks pretty viable!

**Sheokronath**

Reece, tell me you asked your opponent how he painted the Black Dragon symbol.

**Reecius**

Drop Pod lists are amazing in this edition, no doubt.

And yeah, I got caught with my pants down, lol! All I had to do was move a unit that had sat for two turns and I win, but I didn't, so I lost! Haha, live and learn.

@Sheokronath

Dan is a really good hobbyist, he sculpted one shoulder pad with a blank pad and greenstuff, then made a mold of that, and press-molded greestuff copies onto each shoulder-pad. It sounds way more complex than it actually is, but it looks killer. He also added forearm blades and horns onto them as is only fitting! They look great.

@thread

Yeah, in this video I got a lot of shock and awe as I took Trukks against Meltas which is worst case scenario for Mob Rule. In retrospect, I should have spread out to deny him so many targets, and then called my WAAGH! turn 2, and came back in to assault. I would have taken far fewer casualties and been in position to just wipe him. Also, a VSG would have made a HUGE difference, soaking up a lot of hose Meltas. Hell, even an Aegis would have made a big difference.

Oh well, live and learn!

**doktor_g**

Reece
What do you think about not putting the boyz in the trukks in deployment if you're facing an alpha strike or you are player 2? I just ran a traditional boy list in a tourney (except I had 2 pain boyz and a warboss). I won 1/3 games. Generally I go 0/3 with the boyz. I gotta tell ya I am pretty disappointed with the new dex. I was planning a special trip down to FLG to play the boyz against one of you folks. I have a few more games before I make up my mind completely. Just as lootas and shootas were auto-includes, I do see that Pain Boyz are now high on that list.
Other winners in 7th IMO:
- Deffkoptas w/TLRL
- Grot Riggers
- KMB on meks
- Lobbas w ammo runts. Remember that you have to have the closest gun fire first (per arty rules). If that gun doesn't have the runt, you are S.o.L. Also Lobbas are "Heavy" so no move and shoot. (can't snapfire blasts) to get that runt up front. You'd have to convince your opponent through transdimensional multiverse geometry that the ammo runt you used in turn 1 now isn't the closest gun and it's actually the other one...

Anyone:
How about the silly new gorka/morka 'naut? Anybody tried that thing yet? Results?

@Boom

BoomWolf wrote:
"If a truck explodes you take a moral check and a pinning check"

No you don't?
Its just a pinning test.
You took twice as many tests as needed, no wonder you got hit that hard by the mob rules.

Not to mention you had no painboys, no armor or any other defensive upgrade to think of, it was the most straight-forward "get me more orks" list, and it preformed pretty well.

Exploding Trukk = Pinning Test
+ Mob Rule D6 S4 more hits (most likely)
Losing >25% = Morale Test
+ Mob Rule D6 S4 more hits (most likely)

Automatically Appended Next Post:
If they could Errata Mob Rule where you only test on it once per phase. Or that pinning doesn't trigger it.

**ansacs**

doktor_g wrote:- Lobbas w ammo runts. Remember that you have to have the closest gun fire first (per arty rules). If that gun doesn't have the runt, you are S.o.L. Also Lobbas are "Heavy" so no move and shoot. (can't snapfire blasts) to get that runt up front. You'd have to convince your opponent through transdimensional multiverse geometry that the ammo runt you used in turn 1 now isn't the closest gun and it's actually the other one...

A fun little trick I have been seeing is to take a mega armour big mek to make heavy units slow and purposeful. It sort of depends of you not needing the HQ for something else.

**RedNoak**

Barrywise wrote:
Ashwaster wrote:
These guys found some good in the new mob rule.
Warning: Very Australian
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wonFApCHqHs

Holy bajeesus, i never considered that. For those too lazy to watch a second video, because of the new leadership table the Orks can never fail leadership in CC[u], yes they can inflict some wounds on themselves but they never run from combat. Even if you're down to the last man you can still tie up a blob of 16 chaos marines for another turn.

maybe you should watch again. on a roll of 4-6 so 50% of that damn table is only useful if you have 10+ models left

so basically they are saying this:

Spartan089 wrote:
The new mob rule and nerf to trukks were clearly designed by GW to hurt low model count trukk ork armies. This to force players to play larger horde style lists and buy more boyz.

also this is one of the most ridiculous post i've ever seen:

easysauce wrote:
having a whole army of fearless units was a bit of a crutch/anachronsim, and they were given fearless at a time when it caused extra wounds to be had,
mob rule + ld 7 is still better then plain old ld 7 (which works out fine for guard, tau, and so on)
you can take HQ's to mitigate it (ONE example being zagstrukk who auto gets the re roll LD and pinning check)
having the possibility to fail a LD test shouldnt break your game... even space marines can run once in a while, it makes sense that orks can too.
good bat rep, orks lost, but the codex got a huge buff in general.

orks were never a fearless wide army. only mobs with 10+ models were fearless.
and btw you just took the single worst HQ choice as an example how to mitigate the new mob rule. (zagstruk has ONE s8 HoW attack, lost his wieldy-powerclaw and cant assault the turn he arrives)
and its not about running away once in a while... its getting autohitting d6 bolter shots everytime i need to pass an morale-test

@batrep
what i really miss about these types of batreps are some important rolls or situations "live" on cam... net the entire game but just those gamebreaking moments (like you did with the reserve rolls)

**SabrX**

Wow, the new mob rule is terrible. There isn't a whole lot of guarantee ways to negate the the mob rule other than buying an expensive big fat Stompa for 6" fearless or supplement big boss pole. To me, this codex has been one big fat nerf with lack of invulns in close combat, mob rule doing more damage than good, and shoota boyz costing more. I'm not sure if GW play tested this codex properly, but given their rapid release cycle, probably not.

Great game and good battle report. Scoring drop pods appears to be very effective and it great to see drop pod armies coming back.

**Reecius**

@Doktor_G

Yeah, there are a lot of tactics you can use to mitigate Trukks blowing up, but essentially it is a bummer to see my favorite Ork list hit so hard.

@RedNoak

You said it, Orks were hardly OP, not even close, and the rule that helped them got turned into a nerf. It is rough for the Trukk Boyz.

@Sabrx

You pretty much have to find ways to play around Mob Rule. If you can do that, you will do well with Orks. If not, you watch as they kill themselves. It is frsutrating.

But yes, Drop Pods are BIG TIME back. They are a tournament winning army.

**koooaei**

By the way, i've just checked - in 7-th edition vehicle damage table there's not a word about pinning tests after explosions and wreckages.

**Reecius**

BRB Pg.82, under the section about effects of damage result on transported units. Wreck and Explode both cause pin checks.