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 thedarkavenger wrote:


I dunno about you, but I'm using ascendant rules for my demons all the time.

Except you can't. it's not a normal rule.

Right out of the book: "IF you are playing the scenarios from this book, AND the scenario lists Chaos Ascendent in its special rules..."

Emphasis mine. This clearly states Chaos Ascendent is a special rule that must be listed in the scenario being played to take effect. I don't know anyone in their right mind who would let you use it without you giving them some concession.

 Shas'O Dorian wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:


I dunno about you, but I'm using ascendant rules for my demons all the time.

Except you can't. it's not a normal rule.

Right out of the book: "IF you are playing the scenarios from this book, AND the scenario lists Chaos Ascendent in its special rules..."

Emphasis mine. This clearly states Chaos Ascendent is a special rule that must be listed in the scenario being played to take effect. I don't know anyone in their right mind who would let you use it without you giving them some concession.

Hey. It fits my narrative. And you should quote the part where it lists they're optional and can use them if they fit your narrative too.

That part alone will make them pretty much standard in anything bar competitive play.

From What I've read, it appears that you need both players permission to use the chaos ascension rules. I know that I wouldn't want to face off a horde of unbreakable daemons which can spawn more unbreakable daemons each turn.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
It's not in my narrative, as GW would put it.

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 Shas'O Dorian wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:


I dunno about you, but I'm using ascendant rules for my demons all the time.

Except you can't. it's not a normal rule.

Right out of the book: "IF you are playing the scenarios from this book, AND the scenario lists Chaos Ascendent in its special rules..."

Emphasis mine. This clearly states Chaos Ascendent is a special rule that must be listed in the scenario being played to take effect. I don't know anyone in their right mind who would let you use it without you giving them some concession.

Hey. It fits my narrative. And you should quote the part where it lists they're optional and can use them if they fit your narrative too.

That part alone will make them pretty much standard in anything bar competitive play.

I already did quote the part is says they're optional, it actually tells you which conditions need to be satisfied in order to use them. Then there is always the golden exception of "My opponent and I both agreed to play it this way..."

Are you using a scenario from the end times book II?
If so does the scenario list Chaos Ascendent as a special rule?

If the answer to either of these questions is no then you cannot use them. However as with ANY rule in WHFB if you and your opponent (or in tournaments the TO as well) both agree to use it that's between you two. Hell if you wanted to play completely unbound (Any unit any army no % limits) and your opponent said it was OK, nobody else can stop you.

Also I don't care if they fit your narrative. It doesn't say the narrative of your army but that of your battle. As in your battle with your opponent. Your opponent gets a say and again I don't know any player who would willingly play against a chaos ascendent list without receiving a concession in return.

I don't know the style over there. But where I'm from if you walked in & said "I'm using chaos ascendent rules because it fits my narrative and if you don't like it too bad" 90% of the time you'll get "Ok, I don't want to play those rules, I'll find another opponent"

 thedarkavenger wrote:
Khorne gor with the beast banner. Nurgle minotaurs with a regen herald of nurgle palanquin.

Netlist demons with skullcrushers, and beastmen chaff. Those raiders have mark of slaanesh.

Daemon characters can only join daemon units of the same alignment? Are we reading the same book?

Kairos + BEast man heardstone +pink horror of tzeentch +4/5 free power dice in all magic phase, tanks GW i LOVE you

 nathan2004 wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:
Khorne gor with the beast banner. Nurgle minotaurs with a regen herald of nurgle palanquin.

Netlist demons with skullcrushers, and beastmen chaff. Those raiders have mark of slaanesh.

Daemon characters can only join daemon units of the same alignment? Are we reading the same book?

Oh right, yeah. My bad.

Thunderfrog wrote:Im my opinion, the End of Times stuff has no business anywhere near a tournament that isn't directly themed as EoT. The 50% lords and heroes thing is whatever, its a rule now. But the combined Legions have no semblance of balance what-so-ever.

QFT.

From what I've seen so far, Unified Chaos lists are not all about building towards an impressively thematic army or ones like Matt's ...

HawaiiMatt wrote:
Wulfrik as general.
Scouting great bray shaman in a chariot.
Ambushing Khorne Gors.
Ambushing Slaanesh ungors/ungor raiders.
Ambushing Flesh Hounds.
Scouting Harpies.
Ambushing Marauder block w/ the general.

... that are interested in doing something new with units that aren't auto-includes. Unified Chaos lists have become a sort of Meta Netlist, which combine the netlist knee jerk obvious auto-includes from WoC & DoC, with some of the only functional stuff from Beasts (Beast Banner BSB + horde, Doombull, Herdstone Spam, Tuskgors) for extra spice. This is not in any way exciting to me.

As to containing End Times: Unified X armies in competitive (or whatever) play, without outright banning them, I would heartily suggest returning to Swedish comp and seeing what it can do for you. It's going to be pretty tough to get a Unified Douchebaggery list to score between 10-16, when you're scooping up fistfuls of cheddar And this goes for the 50% Lords deal too: you can totally take double greater daemons, it'll just cost you some Swedish to pull it off, which means going a little more balanced for the rest of the army.

- Salvage

is that true?

can i have chaos dwarfs, stuff from demons book, and stuff from the normal chaos book *legally* in fantasy?

I might actually start an army if i could do that, I love those models!

 easysauce wrote:
is that true?

can i have chaos dwarfs, stuff from demons book, and stuff from the normal chaos book *legally* in fantasy?

I might actually start an army if i could do that, I love those models!

chaos dwarves were not included in legions of chaos. They are included in the grand host from the tamurkhan book but that is generally not allowed in most tournment scenes for one reason or another. The most obvious is that it MUST be a grand army and very few tournments are 3000+ points

After a quick read of the (rules) book yesterday, I just spotted something that I didn't see highlighted so far
The "summon daemons" spell is only available in Chaos/God/whatever Ascendant scenarios, NOT in regular games with Legions of Chaos

 Boss Salvage wrote:

Thunderfrog wrote:Im my opinion, the End of Times stuff has no business anywhere near a tournament that isn't directly themed as EoT. The 50% lords and heroes thing is whatever, its a rule now. But the combined Legions have no semblance of balance what-so-ever.

QFT.

From what I've seen so far, Unified Chaos lists are not all about building towards an impressively thematic army or ones like Matt's ...

HawaiiMatt wrote:
Wulfrik as general.
Scouting great bray shaman in a chariot.
Ambushing Khorne Gors.
Ambushing Slaanesh ungors/ungor raiders.
Ambushing Flesh Hounds.
Scouting Harpies.
Ambushing Marauder block w/ the general.

... that are interested in doing something new with units that aren't auto-includes. Unified Chaos lists have become a sort of Meta Netlist, which combine the netlist knee jerk obvious auto-includes from WoC & DoC, with some of the only functional stuff from Beasts (Beast Banner BSB + horde, Doombull, Herdstone Spam, Tuskgors) for extra spice. This is not in any way exciting to me.

- Salvage

*IF* the LGS adopts the combined lists, I was planning on for a combined DoC + WoC 'Knights of Tzeentch' warband based around:

Lords:
Chaos Lord w/Wizard Hat + gifts
LoC

Heroes:
MoT Sorcs & Exalts (no 3++/re-roll 1's BS though, because it's super boring)
Tzheralds
Exalt Flamers

Core:
Forsaken!
Chariots
Horrors

Special:
Chaos Knights
Flamers (still painfull how awful they are, but they've always been my favourite daemon models)
Screamers

Rare:
Burny Chariot
Soul Grinder


Everything that can takes Mark/Daemon of Tzeentch upgrade.

Now if only Tzeentch could get his own unique WoC unit...

 TanKoL wrote:
After a quick read of the (rules) book yesterday, I just spotted something that I didn't see highlighted so far
The "summon daemons" spell is only available in Chaos/God/whatever Ascendant scenarios, NOT in regular games with Legions of Chaos

This is true, the special rules that fall under Chaos ascendant are:
A God Ascendant
Ascendant Daemons
Ascendant Mortals
Storm of Chaos
Summon Infernal Legion
(p.12 of Glottkin Rules)

But tbh, why deny a LoC using Ascendant rules? They're so fitting for the setting of the End Times and so much fun when Daemons start popping up everywhere.

I'm loving the use of the Reign of Chaos table for WoC armies since we're not affected by the bad side of things. I finally have access to Skirmish shooting to ping people to death, I can create any army I want using Chaos and more importantly, GW gets to take more of my money because I can use BM/DoC and Undead models now!

 Lord Commissar wrote:

kooshlord wrote:
I only have WOC rules at the moment. Anyone have thoughts on the legality/viability of something like:

The Inevitable (WOC DP of Nurgle with the works)
Tzeentch BSB
WOC Core
Bestigor herd with a couple of beast brayshamans
Maybe Chimeras or Bloodcrushers if points allow?

I like great weapon hordes a lot, and I've seen a beastman player do nasty things with them, including rerollable frenzy str6 attacks, with spammed wildform as a bonus

You don't even know the pain that is the comparison between the skullcrusher and bloodcrusher. For more points you go from the second best Heavy Cav in the game to the worst.

What do you mean SECOND best?, do they loose out to Mournfang, IF, HA, DHB?