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While fluff wise I've never understood the continuing ongoing reserve option, I think in a friendly setting I'd definately let them redeepstrike the unit. Otherwise, if it was destroyed, that'd be devestating as there is a destroyed mishap option anyway.. might as well of rolled that us know?

Friendly game: I'd let it play out however my opponent wants.

I think in tournaments, I'm going to add this to my list of questions to ask TOs beforehand. One of my local organizers is the one who told me this. I believe his reasoning is that the rule telling you to put them back into Reserves normally means 'without the benefit of special deployment options.'

 Jimsolo wrote:

Pain4Pleasure wrote:

 Jimsolo wrote:

Pain4Pleasure wrote:
So if my opponent says he is deepstriking, can he choose to change his mind on turn two? Or does he have to stick with what he told me when we went over our armies and what they are doing.

He cannot change his mind.

However, something interested pointed out to me: if you mishap and go back into Ongoing Reserve, you don't Deep Strike the next turn, you walk on from your own edge.

So a unit in a pod that mishaps and goes into ongoing, must walk on? Is the drop pod then considered destroyed since it must arrive from reserve?

In the very unlikely event that a Pod would mishap, I think you'd have to go to a TO. I'd probably let the squad walk on and count the pod as destroyed, but I could easily see a TO ruling the unit destroyed entirely, or just allowing the pod to DS again.

Scattering off the table is a posible mishap for a drop pod, since it's not impassable terrain or a model.

DS mishap is not the only way of going into Ongoing Reserves.
Second, as I said and darkcloack said, Ongoing Reserves are treated the same way as reserves EXCEPT it enter automatically. Everything that afects Reserves affects ongoing reserves... Placing a unit in ongoing reserves is treated the same way as placing a unit on reserves, everything you can/must do when pacing a unit in reserves, you can/have to do it when placing a unit in ongoing reserves.

If you could not DS from Ongoing reserves then the Burrow skill from Mawloc would become useless. And the Mawloc on itself.

But that's not really treating Reserves normally though is it? That's a stipulation to the rule which is unsupported by the language used.

The mishap table provides suitable effects for when things go wrong, and the delayed result is one of them. In the fluff Drop Pods are described as having a guidance system and this is supported rule-wise as well. Its not a large extrapolation to think that a Drop Pod computer would calculate hitting impassable terrain and take steps to avoid it while in flight, thus creating the delay. A turn is supposed to represent how much real time? Not a lot I imagine. I don't think it's that much of a stretch to say that a Drop Pod will enter play from Ongoing Reserves using Deep Strike.

After all the Drop Pod is one of those "must DS" units...

There is also the fact that it is entirely possible for a Drop Pod to be stuck in Ongoing Reserves all game and counting as being destroyed come the end of the game. Unlikely, but then again...

Edit: That would be hilarious actually. I would be so mad at my dice if they nommed a whole Drop Pod on me! Lol

 Jimsolo wrote:
Friendly game: I'd let it play out however my opponent wants.

I think in tournaments, I'm going to add this to my list of questions to ask TOs beforehand. One of my local organizers is the one who told me this. I believe his reasoning is that the rule telling you to put them back into Reserves normally means 'without the benefit of special deployment options.'

So if th drop pod normally enters play via DS (as in, it is disallowed from entering any other way), why does it not do so from ongoing reserves?

Wallur wrote:
I'm discussing with a friend for like an hour or 2 now:
He says that if I put a unit with the Deep Strike Special Rule on reserves it must enter via DS.
I say that even though a unit having the DS special rule can enter from your table edge from reserves if you want so.

Specifically with Necrons Deathmarks that have all his benefits if they are in DS reserves, I let him do it, since it's a friendly game, but told him that he has to say they will be placed in DS reserves. He said he doesn't need to say so because if they are placed on reserves, they HAVE to enter via DS.

Pls everyone say his opinion, or even if it's just a "He is right" "your are right"

You are right. If you place a unit with DS in reserves they can still walk on if you want. But if you want them to DS you must declare this when placing them in reserves, and can't change your mind part way through the game. The opposite also applies; if you don't declare they will be deepstriking when you place them in reserves then they can't arrive via deep strike. This is why the rules make a clear distinction between units in reserve and units in deep strike reserve.

Ongoing Reserves re-enters reserves, and aside from coming in automatically next turn is otherwise treated exactly like normal reserves.

Because of the above selections and the implication of Skyleap(eldar swooping hawk wings) combined with the grenade packs it seems pretty clear that at least the intention is for any ongoing reserves with deepstrike/outflank capable or required units to be able to declare those entry options.

This is not a specifically stated allowance, but does have an implied nature. I wouldn't even really put it into a RAW vs RAI category; the RAW simply does not address the interaction.

As for the issue of the second sentence: it goes back to one of the things I am most vocal about. Context matters. The rules are written in English, and English has its own set of rules for writing. You cannot focus on a single sentence or word out of context from the paragraph or sentence that contains it. The paragraph in question is detailing how to make use of the rule; not requiring that the rule is used in all cases.

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
Because of the above selections and the implication of Skyleap(eldar swooping hawk wings) combined with the grenade packs it seems pretty clear that at least the intention is for any ongoing reserves with deepstrike/outflank capable or required units to be able to declare those entry options.

This is not a specifically stated allowance, but does have an implied nature. I wouldn't even really put it into a RAW vs RAI category; the RAW simply does not address the interaction.

RAW deals with this situation just fine. Unless you start your Swooping Hawks in deep strike reserve, they are walking back on the board the turn after Skyleaping.

 Tonberry7 wrote:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
Because of the above selections and the implication of Skyleap(eldar swooping hawk wings) combined with the grenade packs it seems pretty clear that at least the intention is for any ongoing reserves with deepstrike/outflank capable or required units to be able to declare those entry options.

This is not a specifically stated allowance, but does have an implied nature. I wouldn't even really put it into a RAW vs RAI category; the RAW simply does not address the interaction.

RAW deals with this situation just fine. Unless you start your Swooping Hawks in deep strike reserve, they are walking back on the board the turn after Skyleaping.

If RAW would've said "Beggins the turn in reserves" there won't be much discussion.
But let say. Skyblight swarm, with the Gargoyles re spawning, it's a NEW unit (exactly the same as the one dead) placed in ongoing reserves. But this NEW unit NEVER EXISTED at the start of the game, so it didn't started the game in DS Reserves. So when I place the New spawned Gargoyles on Ongoing Reserves, you are saying I have no option on making them Deep Strike? Same goes for Spore mines with Sporefield Formation.... that would make those formations close to useless (specially if spores could not deep strike/outflank)

Wallur wrote:

 Tonberry7 wrote:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
Because of the above selections and the implication of Skyleap(eldar swooping hawk wings) combined with the grenade packs it seems pretty clear that at least the intention is for any ongoing reserves with deepstrike/outflank capable or required units to be able to declare those entry options.

This is not a specifically stated allowance, but does have an implied nature. I wouldn't even really put it into a RAW vs RAI category; the RAW simply does not address the interaction.

RAW deals with this situation just fine. Unless you start your Swooping Hawks in deep strike reserve, they are walking back on the board the turn after Skyleaping.

If RAW would've said "Beggins the turn in reserves" there won't be much discussion.
But let say. Skyblight swarm, with the Gargoyles re spawning, it's a NEW unit (exactly the same as the one dead) placed in ongoing reserves. But this NEW unit NEVER EXISTED at the start of the game, so it didn't started the game in DS Reserves. So when I place the New spawned Gargoyles on Ongoing Reserves, you are saying I have no option on making them Deep Strike? Same goes for Spore mines with Sporefield Formation.... that would make those formations close to useless (specially if spores could not deep strike/outflank)

Unfortunately I'm not familiar with the rules for those units you're describing. I never claimed that GWs RAW make perfect sense though

But consider another situation if you could deep strike without having started the game in deep strike reserve. You could bring say four Daemon FMCs, fly them off the board in turn 1 then automatically deep strike them all in turn 2. Just like the Skyleap situation though it would be a cheap way of getting out of having to make reserve rolls for deep striking units that would legally have to start the game in deep strike reserve.

 Tonberry7 wrote:

Spoiler:

Wallur wrote:

 Tonberry7 wrote:

 Kommissar Kel wrote:
Because of the above selections and the implication of Skyleap(eldar swooping hawk wings) combined with the grenade packs it seems pretty clear that at least the intention is for any ongoing reserves with deepstrike/outflank capable or required units to be able to declare those entry options.

This is not a specifically stated allowance, but does have an implied nature. I wouldn't even really put it into a RAW vs RAI category; the RAW simply does not address the interaction.

RAW deals with this situation just fine. Unless you start your Swooping Hawks in deep strike reserve, they are walking back on the board the turn after Skyleaping.

If RAW would've said "Beggins the turn in reserves" there won't be much discussion.
But let say. Skyblight swarm, with the Gargoyles re spawning, it's a NEW unit (exactly the same as the one dead) placed in ongoing reserves. But this NEW unit NEVER EXISTED at the start of the game, so it didn't started the game in DS Reserves. So when I place the New spawned Gargoyles on Ongoing Reserves, you are saying I have no option on making them Deep Strike? Same goes for Spore mines with Sporefield Formation.... that would make those formations close to useless (specially if spores could not deep strike/outflank)

Unfortunately I'm not familiar with the rules for those units you're describing. I never claimed that GWs RAW make perfect sense though

The ones I'm describing, in formation, says when X units in the Formation is completely destroyed, you roll a D6, on a 4+ you put a copy of that unit in ongoing reserves. Spores have a movement of 3" and Deep Strike, what makes totally usefull if they deep strike, but usless if they have to move 3" from the edge.

 Tonberry7 wrote:
But consider another situation if you could deep strike without having started the game in deep strike reserve. You could bring say four Daemon FMCs, fly them off the board in turn 1 then automatically deep strike them all in turn 2. Just like the Skyleap situation though it would be a cheap way of getting out of having to make reserve rolls for deep striking units that would legally have to start the game in deep strike reserve.

That is totally legal, with it's downside. You have to make it swoop away from table and unless you go first, your opponent can harm your Deamon Prince, don't know if it has a special ability when it DS. Also Reserves and Ongoing reserves, though they are treated the same, they are different things and you cant, for example, join an IC from Ongoing Reserves with units in Reserves. In the case of the Mawloc, it's ability Burrow, se to remove the model from table and put it in Ongoing Reserves, but the Burrow rule has the explicit exception that you can't use it on Turn 1, for the reason you are saying, it would be better than placing him in reserves So, or you put it in reserves risking arriving turn 2 or 3 or 4. , or deploy it and burrow in turn 2 and make sure it enters turn 3.