Why 30k?

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**jasper76**

Drasius wrote:
Because people get to feel superior to others since they can show off that they spent more money on their man-dollies than you did.

30k'ers are the hipster, vegan, reborn Christians of warhams, They'll preach and tell you how great it is every opportunity they get whilst feeling superior for no reason.

Some of the models are pretty rad though, I won't deny that.

*Waits for accusations of not being able to afford a 30k army, since that's the only possible reason to not want one*

Meh. Of the 4 dudes I know who play 30k, only one of them has anything more than a couple models from forgeworld.

**AnomanderRake**

Because the Legion army list is vastly more balanced internally and against itself than any 40k game can ever be, so you don't end up getting wiped by the guy with the cooler stuff because your toys are too old. Crafworld versus DE two-turn tablings don't exist in 30k.

Also because the implementation of armour and anti-armour makes your tanks feel like tanks in a way that 40k has lost since hull points hit the table and massed Strength 6-7 became the preferred anti-armour tool.

**Harley Quinn**

Tamwulf wrote:
SirSweetroll wrote:
Is there a way to play normal humans in 30k?

What do you mean normal humans? Like Imperial Guard (won't use the Astra Whatever GW has come up with). If that is the case, you should be looking for Horus Heresy Book IV: Conquest and maybe Book V: Tempest for rules to use Imperial Army units.

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Harley Quinn wrote:
Thanks for the answers everyone. I might consider doing 30k sometime.

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Also, the lack of ATSKNF has had me win a few games against 30k lists. I has Lelith Hesperax and a Succubus charge a 20 man blob and killed only like 7. The rest were run down by Lelith's Initiative 9! It was fun, but I felt pretty bad when she did it again in the same game. 40 marine kills to her name for just that game is pretty impressive I think.

30K is not really meant to be played against 40K. There are more then a few blurbs about it in each of the HH books. A few questions I'd ask about your DE vs. Legion game- how many points were you playing? 30K doesn't really come into it's own unless you play more than 2000 points. Was his army tailored for Dark Eldar? That would be the #1 reason why 30K isn't meant to be played vs. 40K. If the Legion player knew he was playing against Dark Elves, and it was at a decent points level (more than 2000), he would have shot you off the table and none of your units would have gotten anywhere near his for close combat. It also sounds like it was the ideal situation for Lelith charging a unit of Legion Tactical Marines- a non-close combat unit. It would have been interesting to see her charge a tooled up command squad with a Praetor, or a Legion Assault Squad, or even a Terminator squad. Terminators suck in 40K, but they are pretty darn good in 30K.

It was at 2000 points this game. I had DE allied with Eldar. We both didn't tailor at all. Never knew each other's lists.

I don't think she would survive against all the other strong 30k stuff, I just thought it was cool how many she took out with her and actually survived the end of the game.
He had plenty of firepower though, such as 2 contemptor dreadnoughts and a BS5 10 man lascannon team. I only just managed to win, but he complained about 7th ed of 40k.
Oh well. I had fun anyway.

**nudibranch**

Drasius wrote:
Because people get to feel superior to others since they can show off that they spent more money on their man-dollies than you did.

30k'ers are the hipster, vegan, reborn Christians of warhams, They'll preach and tell you how great it is every opportunity they get whilst feeling superior for no reason.

Some of the models are pretty rad though, I won't deny that.

*Waits for accusations of not being able to afford a 30k army, since that's the only possible reason to not want one*

Nice strawperson...

**Tannhauser42**

Drasius wrote:
Because people get to feel superior to others since they can show off that they spent more money on their man-dollies than you did.

30k'ers are the hipster, vegan, reborn Christians of warhams, They'll preach and tell you how great it is every opportunity they get whilst feeling superior for no reason.

Some of the models are pretty rad though, I won't deny that.

*Waits for accusations of not being able to afford a 30k army, since that's the only possible reason to not want one*

Yeah, because 40K is so much cheaper than a 30K army.

**Camundongo**

The 30K stuff does seem pretty cool, I'm reading through the HH FW books and loving it so far (I play Thousand Sons in 40K, but really tempted to start a Night Lords 30K legion).

As for balance, I've only seen 40K vs 30K - the Legion lists seem fairly well balanced, but the Legio Cybernetica list can be very tricky to fight, due to the large numbers of high(ish) toughness and wound models, which can be a struggle for some armies.

**Vash108**

The different legions are fluffy and work well. Overall balance feels good too.

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Drasius wrote:
Because people get to feel superior to others since they can show off that they spent more money on their man-dollies than you did.

30k'ers are the hipster, vegan, reborn Christians of warhams, They'll preach and tell you how great it is every opportunity they get whilst feeling superior for no reason.

Some of the models are pretty rad though, I won't deny that.

*Waits for accusations of not being able to afford a 30k army, since that's the only possible reason to not want one*

You got a few chips on your shoulder there.

**Toofast**

Camundongo wrote:
The 30K stuff does seem pretty cool, I'm reading through the HH FW books and loving it so far (I play Thousand Sons in 40K, but really tempted to start a Night Lords 30K legion).

As for balance, I've only seen 40K vs 30K - the Legion lists seem fairly well balanced, but the Legio Cybernetica list can be very tricky to fight, due to the large numbers of high(ish) toughness and wound models, which can be a struggle for some armies.

Cybernetica was changed in the red book. Castellax don't score now. The army is full of tough models but theyre very expensive and basically forced to table the opponent to win. MSU thallax is a killer though. They can be kitted out to do anything, they're tough, mobile, have access to deep strike and one of the best dedicated transports in 30k.

My Eldar list will table any 30k list up to 2500 where they get the cool stuff. 40k is not meant to be played against 30k as others have said. I find the 30k missions, armies and rule changes to be for the benefit of the game in every case so I prefer not to play against 40k unless I absolutely have to.

As to those who play 30k without any FW, you're really missing out. The sight of 2 well painted forge world armies on a nice table with well done terrain is as good as it gets.

**jasper76**

I'd be more into forgeworld stuff if it wasn't resin. People always say and I agree that forgeworld resin is a better material to work with than finecast, but I just I greatly prefer plastics to resin and metal models, for several reasons. I also have some wysiwig issues for some of the sculpts for my army in particular.

Regarding 30k armies vs. 40k armies in lower point games, one way that helps levelling somewhat in my experience is to force the 40k army to use one of the 30k force org charts, and dissallow both Formations for the 40k army and Rites of War for the 30k army. Not perfect, but that's what we do alot of the time in sub-2500 games.

**Tamwulf**

Harley Quinn wrote:

It was at 2000 points this game. I had DE allied with Eldar. We both didn't tailor at all. Never knew each other's lists.

I don't think she would survive against all the other strong 30k stuff, I just thought it was cool how many she took out with her and actually survived the end of the game.
He had plenty of firepower though, such as 2 contemptor dreadnoughts and a BS5 10 man lascannon team. I only just managed to win, but he complained about 7th ed of 40k.
Oh well. I had fun anyway.

Hey! Having fun is what it's all about.

Side note: Contemptor Dreads are not that great of a choice. They are basically a Venerable Dreadnought. They still have all the issues a Dreadnought Walker have in 40K- which is a long list.

I use a Contemptor-Mortis with a pair of Kheres Assault Cannons for AA, but at that point cost, I almost feel like getting a Lightning Fighter, or Xiphon, or maybe even a Fire Raptor...

**Brennonjw**

Tamwulf wrote:

Side note: Contemptor Dreads are not that great of a choice. They are basically a Venerable Dreadnought. They still have all the issues a Dreadnought Walker have in 40K- which is a long list. I use a Contemptor-Mortis with a pair of Kheres Assault Cannons for AA, but at that point cost, I almost feel like getting a Lightning Fighter, or Xiphon, or maybe even a Fire Raptor...

I dissagree. Conemptors have more front armor, fleet, and has access to "better" weapons. in 40k, yeah, contemptors have issues. In 30k, not so much, I think there a lot like terminators in that reguard.

It seems like, to me at least, looking at the community: 30k lists are less "bring whats best" and more "bring what looks cool/is fluffy". Since calth dropped, however, I'm noticing more of that "bring the best, and ONLY the best" attitude drifting over from the rest of 40k (not 100 % true in relation to your comment). coincidence?