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Charistoph wrote:
The Step 2 when the rest of the unit goes to shoot. I still see no classification of the model's target as a target for the unit nor any directions to treat it as such. I see the directive for one model in the unit to shoot a different target to the rest of his unit. I don't seem it directing the unit to pick two targets with one model shooting one and the rest shooting the other.

Unit interactions versus model interactions are the guide here.

That's the rest of the unit's target, but not the unit's target. Split Fire changes step 2 from being the unit choosing a target to the Split Firing model choosing a target and resolving the rest of its shooting attack, and then repeated as the rest of the unit choosing their target and resolving the rest of its shooting attack.

When using Split Fire there is no longer "the unit" but rather the Split Firing model and "the rest of the unit". That doesn't make the Split Firing model's target not one of the unit's targets.

So how do single model units work. I could have sworn that I posted a question about this, but if so it has been removed. My question came down to a Riptide with a Target Lock.

My understanding is this. The Riptide (unit) shoots at a target within assault range. The Riptide utilizes its Target Lock to shoot at a different target than its unit. It then assaults the unit that the riptide (unit) shot at, discounting the fact that nothing shot at it, the unit still counts as having shot at it for pruposes of selecting it as the Charge target.

I've been told this is wishful thinking, but I could have sworn that I read that units can target one unit for shooting then use Target Locks to shoot at different targets than that first targeted one. Meaning that nothing need actually fire a shot against the first target?

 carldooley wrote:
found it, P. 38 of the tau tactica page. Post 20 on that page

I'm pretty sure target lock doesn't do anything on single model units because it makes the model shoot at a different target, not a gun on the model.

 Mr. Shine wrote:

Charistoph wrote:
The Step 2 when the rest of the unit goes to shoot. I still see no classification of the model's target as a target for the unit nor any directions to treat it as such. I see the directive for one model in the unit to shoot a different target to the rest of his unit. I don't seem it directing the unit to pick two targets with one model shooting one and the rest shooting the other.

Unit interactions versus model interactions are the guide here.

That's the rest of the unit's target, but not the unit's target. Split Fire changes step 2 from being the unit choosing a target to the Split Firing model choosing a target and resolving the rest of its shooting attack, and then repeated as the rest of the unit choosing their target and resolving the rest of its shooting attack.

When using Split Fire there is no longer "the unit" but rather the Split Firing model and "the rest of the unit". That doesn't make the Split Firing model's target not one of the unit's targets.

And standard rules have the unit pick a target, and while it is the rest of the unit, it still does not change this situation of the unit actually having established a target while the model is defined as using a different target (though, not necessarily in that order).

Charistoph wrote:
And standard rules have the unit pick a target, and while it is the rest of the unit, it still does not change this situation of the unit actually having established a target while the model is defined as using a different target (though, not necessarily in that order).

But we're not using standard rules because they've been modified by Split Fire, and we're told "the rest of the unit" resolves their shooting attack afterwards. If you accept the Split Firing model has an effectively modified step 2 of choosing a target then "the rest of the unit" must also, rather than remaining "the unit". Once the Split Firing model resolves their shooting attack the return to step 2 is not "the unit can shoot at an enemy unit that it can see" but "the rest of the unit can shoot at an enemy unit that it can see".

Hello some have written That You Can charge a unit who came out from a véhicule You killed in the same round with That unit where do You find That in the rules?

taetrius67 wrote:
Hello some have written That You Can charge a unit who came out from a véhicule You killed in the same round with That unit where do You find That in the rules?

At the end of 'Effect of Damage on Passengers' in the Transports section:

"If a Transport is destroyed by a shooting attack, any unit that shot it that turn can, if allowed, charge the now disembarked passengers."

 Mr. Shine wrote:

Charistoph wrote:
And standard rules have the unit pick a target, and while it is the rest of the unit, it still does not change this situation of the unit actually having established a target while the model is defined as using a different target (though, not necessarily in that order).

But we're not using standard rules because they've been modified by Split Fire, and we're told "the rest of the unit" resolves their shooting attack afterwards. If you accept the Split Firing model has an effectively modified step 2 of choosing a target then "the rest of the unit" must also, rather than remaining "the unit". Once the Split Firing model resolves their shooting attack the return to step 2 is not "the unit can shoot at an enemy unit that it can see" but "the rest of the unit can shoot at an enemy unit that it can see".

And that new standard does not state that the unit targets the Split Fire target, just the model. Nor does it state that the model targets on behalf of the unit, nor does it allow the unit to Charge this Split Fired target.

Charistoph wrote:
And that new standard does not state that the unit targets the Split Fire target, just the model. Nor does it state that the model targets on behalf of the unit, nor does it allow the unit to Charge this Split Fired target.

No more than it states the unit targets the rest of the unit's target. However, when you talk about a part and then the rest of something you are speaking of that part as being included in the something. Indeed, of course we both agree the model is part of the unit just as much as the rest of the unit.

You're claiming "the rest of the unit" qualifies as the unit but you've yet to show any reasoning other than a claim to standard rules you've now agreed we're not using.

The model from the unit targets something and shoots.

Then unit targets something and shoots.

The unit can then charge what the unit targeted.

blaktoof wrote:
The model from the unit targets something and shoots.

Then unit targets something and shoots.

The unit can then charge what the unit targeted.

That would be nice if Split Fire actually used simply "the unit" rather than making it about two parts of a unit by using "the rest of the unit" instead.

 Mr. Shine wrote:

blaktoof wrote:
The model from the unit targets something and shoots.

Then unit targets something and shoots.

The unit can then charge what the unit targeted.

That would be nice if Split Fire actually used simply "the unit" rather than making it about two parts of a unit by using "the rest of the unit" instead.

Well, since it doesn't change THEIR rules, why would their use change the rules from that point?

Charistoph wrote:
Well, since it doesn't change THEIR rules, why would their use change the rules from that point?

What doesn't change whose rules?

If you mean "the rest of the unit" doesn't have their shooting sequence changed, I'd point you to where Split Fire tells you to resolve the shooting attack of the rest of the unit after the Split Firing model's - it's no longer "the unit" choosing a target.