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Kharn - yes, Bs6+ grants a reroll to hit. Indisputably. Meaning it rerolls blasts as well. Cypher on a Macrocannon battery gets -10" to scatter AND a reroll.

If you have the ability to re-roll your to hit rolls (of a 1) you have the ability to re-roll your to hit rolls. You are making it up if you think there is a difference.

BS6 only grants a reroll to hit if you roll a 1 first. Yet it ALWAYS grants a reroll to Gets Hot. Because it REMINDS you that "the ability to reroll its rolls To Hit" INCLUDES BS6+

BS6 rerolls ona 1. EXACTLY the same as Preferred Enemy.

So, definitively as the reminder is just that - a reminder, in parentheses - we KNOW that "the ability to reroll its rolls To Hit" includes rules that only grant rerolls on a to-hit roll of a 1

Exactly the same As PE.

If you state PE CANNOT re-roll Blast to Hit, it means it CANNOT reroll Gets Hot!, and neither can BS6 as they have the EXACT same trigger. And if you deny THAT, you are literally contradicting the rulebook

There is absolutely no doubt that, if you are firing at your PE and thus would have the ability to..., you may reroll Blast AND reroll Gets Hot

Disagreement on this is not possible, without denying the literal Rules as Written.

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Kharn - yes, Bs6+ grants a reroll to hit. Indisputably. Meaning it rerolls blasts as well. Cypher on a Macrocannon battery gets -10" to scatter AND a reroll.

Well, as long as you're consistent in your thinking.

And gets hot and PE don't have the exact same trigger for blasts. Gets hot gives a specific condition of rolling a D6 to see if it gets hot, and that's what you get to reroll, gets hot doesn't trigger on scatter. I'd just like to make sure we are, in fact, talking about preferred enemy rerolling blast scatter. And BS6 rerolling on 1s is still the same as preferred enemy. Some things miss on 2s, some things miss on 3s. Preferred enemy doesn't let them reroll that. Therefore, they can't reroll their hits, they can only reroll their to hits of 1, which is a different ability. You're taking the very narrow conditions of rerolling gets hot (which only triggers on a 1) with BS6 (which only triggers on a 1) and Preferred enemy (which only triggers on a 1) and applying them to things that trigger on other conditions (hits of 2, 3, etc) that would allow rerolls. It's a question of being specific. If you said preferred enemy lets you reroll your failed hits, you'd be wrong, since it doesn't let you reroll failed hits of 2, 3, and so on.

No, they both have the exact same trigger to see if you get a REROLL on either "gets hot" or blast scatter.

DO you have a rules argument in there? Its hard to tell.

BS6 indisputably lets you reroll your to-hit. THis is stated as such by the rule book. In order to reoll a BS6 model MUST roll a 1 to hit. Same as a PE model MUST, in order to reroll, roll a 1 to hit.

Since this is blasts, and we NEVER EVER roll to hit, either you consider PE AND BS6 to grant the ability to reroll blast scatter, as they BOTH have exactly the same requirement, or you are denying the rulebook rules as being true

Which is it? Is the rulebook right or wrong?

Hard to hit for FMC and Flyers both have the same trigger you look at blasts, but as the rule are written in different section and have different wording the outcome us different.

Gets Hot Does not use the same wording in how to hit re-rolls affect the gets hot rule as the wording for re-rolling to hit for blasts.

You are taking the rules for one thing and applying them to another based on some similar wording, which is RAI not the literal rules as written.

Threads like this should be pinned in my opinion as topics like this one come up a lot and surely a search would find earlier threads. This will go back and forth in banter then get locked by a mod.

blaktoof wrote:
Hard to hit for FMC and Flyers both have the same trigger you look at blasts, but as the rule are written in different section and have different wording the outcome us different.

Gets Hot Does not use the same wording in how to hit re-rolls affect the gets hot rule as the wording for re-rolling to hit for blasts.

You are taking the rules for one thing and applying them to another based on some similar wording, which is RAI not the literal rules as written.

Being disingenuous again. Who'd have thought

P164 Gets Hot, Gets hot and rerolls
"If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit (incouding because of BS6+ or the ....) ..."

P158 Blast, blast weapons and rerolls
"If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit..."

Exactly the same REQUIREMENT, the ability to Reroll it's rolls to hit.

You're then REMINDED that BS6+ is included in this requirement

BS6 is by definition included in "BS6+"

BS6 requires you to roll a 1 on your to hit before you may Reroll
PE requires you to roll a 1 on your to hit before you may Reroll

Oh look, exactly the same

PE IS EXACTLY the same "type" of Reroll as something we know qualifies as a Reroll to hit, so it rerolls blast scatter as well

So, which is it Blaktoof? Is the rule book wrong again, now again the rule has been posted to again show that you're being "creative" about what the rule book actually says? Or will you deflect to something else, as per usual?

nosferatu1001 wrote:

blaktoof wrote:
Hard to hit for FMC and Flyers both have the same trigger you look at blasts, but as the rule are written in different section and have different wording the outcome us different.

Gets Hot Does not use the same wording in how to hit re-rolls affect the gets hot rule as the wording for re-rolling to hit for blasts.

You are taking the rules for one thing and applying them to another based on some similar wording, which is RAI not the literal rules as written.

Being disingenuous again. Who'd have thought

P164 Gets Hot, Gets hot and rerolls
"If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit (incouding because of BS6+ or the ....) ..."

P158 Blast, blast weapons and rerolls
"If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit..."

Exactly the same REQUIREMENT, the ability to Reroll it's rolls to hit.

You're then REMINDED that BS6+ is included in this requirement

BS6 is by definition included in "BS6+"

BS6 requires you to roll a 1 on your to hit before you may Reroll
PE requires you to roll a 1 on your to hit before you may Reroll

Oh look, exactly the same

PE IS EXACTLY the same "type" of Reroll as something we know qualifies as a Reroll to hit, so it rerolls blast scatter as well

So, which is it Blaktoof? Is the rule book wrong again, now again the rule has been posted to again show that you're being "creative" about what the rule book actually says? Or will you deflect to something else, as per usual?

You do realize typing something doesn't make you correct?

Obviously one requires you to have re-rolls to hit.

The other requires to have re-rolls to hit and gives additional inclusions. That t hey are not written the same way should be indicative that they are not exactly the same.

You are taking the rules from one thing, which has additional inclusions, and applying it to another which does not give permission to allow those as additional inclusions.

it is not the exact same thing.

Much like you can only snap shot at FMC and Flyers. Flyers cannot be hit by blasts or template weapons.

FMC do not have the same inclusion, this does not mean they RAW have permission to not be hit by said weapons scattering on them or clipping them as secondary targets.

I JUST typed out the exact rule. If you disagree, maybe you could, for once, cite the rule? You just said an awful lot without a single shred of substance

So far we have: I've proven that BS6+ Satisfies "the ability to re-roll it's To Hit" and that PE also satisfies that requirement, as it has exactly the same trigger (rolling a 1 to-hit). To deny the latter is to say the rule book is wrong on the former. There is no other conclusion possible, within the actual written rules

You have...done nothing. Absolutely nothing. You're claiming a lot, but have absolutely nothing to back up your claims

You are again breaking the tenets. Please, Mark your posts hywpi as you are failing to discuss written rules.

I don't eve understand why we are having this discussion again. Is there anything new to be discussed ?

No, just the same posters giving the same few discredited arguments again.

It's more for the benefit of people coming across this for the first time , so they can see the actual RAW answer.

I don't see why this should go more than two to three pages max.

Well it shouldn't do - the poster who was so struggling with the fact the written rules disagreed with their position has apparently put me on ignore, so hopefully that's the last "argument" we get from them.

To summarise: yes you get to Reroll blast scatter, AND gets hot, if you are firing at your PE.

I'm confused, I thought a roll to hit was for normal shooting and for blast weapons you roll for scatter?

From what I can gather PE on a blast weapon will allow you to reroll 'gets hot' tests, just like BS6+*.

What exactly are you guys talking about when you say PE lets you reroll blasts?

Do you mean if a BS 4 troop rolls a 5 on scatter (meaning a roll of 1 after modifiers)?

*I'm pretty sure it works like this because BS6+ all allow rerolls of 1, which is the result that gets hot occurs on. This is my RAI attempt. This interpretation makes more sense to me than a rule that specifically allows rerolls of 1s to allow rerolls of ALL misses. My question is this: is there anything in game that allows gets hot on any roll other than a 1? If so should BS6/PE work on these non-1 get hots?

Have you read the rule called "blasts and rerolls"? It's also been quoted in this thread. If you have done, please explain your stance a little further.

Didn't really have a stance, beyond acknowledging PE allows gets hot rerolls.

Would be nice if you could answer those questions, since I am asking for help understanding.

So reroll scatter applies to any ability to reroll to hit, even if the conditions can't be met?

So if a model has hatred (normally only works 1st turn of close combat) it can reroll blasts?

nareik wrote:
Didn't really have a stance, beyond acknowledging PE allows gets hot rerolls.

Would be nice if you could answer those questions, since I am asking for help understanding.

So reroll scatter applies to any ability to reroll to hit, even if the conditions can't be met?

So if a model has hatred (normally only works 1st turn of close combat) it can reroll blasts?

Hatred does not work for Shooting Attacks, only Attacks in Assault. Thus, Hatred applies zero ability to reroll for Blast Attacks.

Even a partial ability is an ability. Shaquille O'neal has the ability to score Free Throw Shots, but he is not very good at it, but he at least has the ability to do it as opposed to a rooster which does not have the ability.

I think its closer to this :

Shaquille O'neal has the ability to score 3 point shots, but he does not have the ball. can Shaquille O'nea score a 3 point shot ?

nareik wrote:
Didn't really have a stance, beyond acknowledging PE allows gets hot rerolls.

Would be nice if you could answer those questions, since I am asking for help understanding.

So reroll scatter applies to any ability to reroll to hit, even if the conditions can't be met?

So if a model has hatred (normally only works 1st turn of close combat) it can reroll blasts?

Its more the question you asked - about "what do we mean about reroll" - is answered precisely by the Blasts and Rerolls rules. I.E. if a model with PE is firing at their PE, they HAVE the abilty to reroll their to-hit, and therefore they reroll the blast to scatter

Your "even if the conditions cannot be met" line is too broad, and not the actual stance.

A model with Hatred has NO ability to reroll their to hit when shooting a blast weapon, therefroe cannot reroll the blast scatter. A model sat on the mysterious objective that allows rerolls 1s to hit DOES have the ability, so DOES reroll scatter. A model with BS6 DOES have the ability to reroll to hit, therefore DOES reroll scatter.

We know, absolutely, that BS6+ allows a reroll to hit. WE know normally you must roll a 1 to qualify to reroll, however as Blasts do not roll to hit, this "how good" a reroll cannot be relevant - and luckily, it isnt relevant, as the gets hot rules REMIND US that BS6+ grants the ability to reroll to hit. Its this line that so troubles Blaktoof, who does not agree that the exact same phrasing - down to the exact same words, in the same order - for Gets Hot and rerolls as Blasts and Rerolls has any meaning. Of course, this is nonsense. If something is defined as giving the model the ability to reroll its to hit, it doesnt matter if we then use that to reroll gets hot or blast scatter - it is still "the ability" to reroll to hit, and satisfies eithers requirement. And this is also where Blaktoof is being deliverately dishonest in their argument, as they compare this to the two versions of Hard to HIt - which actually DO have different words, and therefore a different meaning (FMC HtH misses the line about Blasts) - and try to pretend that these are equivalent situations.

THis is the actual rule, and has been explained a fair few times now. Do you still have questions?

Thank you for explaining (again!), I'm a little clearer now.

I don't think you can use the definition of reroll to hit from Gets Hot for other applications; Firstly on principal I believe the special rules should be self contained, and should not require reading when they are not referenced. Completely subjective perspective, I confess.

Secondly, Gets Hot is really interested in the rolling (and rerolling) of 1s (as this is the result that matters) rather than rerolls proper. RAI on my part, I admit.

Thirdly, Blasts gives its own definition of rerolls to hit and we should honour these.

That said, Blasts is clear rerolls to hit allows rerolls of scatter. A reroll of a 1 is still a reroll so I guess that counts. What about if a squad, for whatever reason, has the ability/penalty to reroll successful hits, even though such an ability would meant to make the unit less accurate, would that still qualify as allowing the unit to reroll its blasts if it desired?

Sorry if this question is already covered (and the previous questions!), but it is freezing outside and my books are in the car.

1) it isn't the gets hot definition. Reread it. The function of parens is to act without modifying the sentence. In this case they are a reminder of what they consider "the ability to Reroll to hit" is.

The wording is identical, meaning the requirement must be identical.
2) no, gets hot and rerolls is only about whether you get to Reroll gets hot. The fact gets hot is on a one is utterly and totally irrelevant.
3) no it does not I give its own definition of ability. It gives exactly the same wording. Meaning exActly the same definition.

If gets hot says X means you have the ability to,Reroll to hit, it must hold for blasts.

Lastly,,yes. It makes absolutely no question on whether your Reroll to hit was a good thing or not. Just that you Reroll to hit.

nosferatu1001 wrote:

blaktoof wrote:
Hard to hit for FMC and Flyers both have the same trigger you look at blasts, but as the rule are written in different section and have different wording the outcome us different.

Gets Hot Does not use the same wording in how to hit re-rolls affect the gets hot rule as the wording for re-rolling to hit for blasts.

You are taking the rules for one thing and applying them to another based on some similar wording, which is RAI not the literal rules as written.

Being disingenuous again. Who'd have thought

P164 Gets Hot, Gets hot and rerolls
"If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit (incouding because of BS6+ or the ....) ..."

P158 Blast, blast weapons and rerolls
"If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit..."

Exactly the same REQUIREMENT, the ability to Reroll it's rolls to hit.

You're then REMINDED that BS6+ is included in this requirement

BS6 is by definition included in "BS6+"

BS6 requires you to roll a 1 on your to hit before you may Reroll
PE requires you to roll a 1 on your to hit before you may Reroll

Oh look, exactly the same

PE IS EXACTLY the same "type" of Reroll as something we know qualifies as a Reroll to hit, so it rerolls blast scatter as well

So, which is it Blaktoof? Is the rule book wrong again, now again the rule has been posted to again show that you're being "creative" about what the rule book actually says? Or will you deflect to something else, as per usual?

Why don't you quote what the rule book says about BS6? being a bit disingenuous aren't you?

BS6 require you to roll a 1 so that you GAIN the ability to reroll. If you can't roll a 1 on the to hit roll, you have not gained the ability to reroll.

the fact that you keep ignoring that part of the rule book means you know it proves your argument wrong and you have it backwards.

Like BS6 requires a 1 to gain a reroll, PE also requires a roll of 1 to gain a reroll. because like you said, they're exactly the same. If you can't roll a 1 then the model does not have the ability to reroll anything because it has yet to gain the ability.

sirlynchmob wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:

blaktoof wrote:
Hard to hit for FMC and Flyers both have the same trigger you look at blasts, but as the rule are written in different section and have different wording the outcome us different.

Gets Hot Does not use the same wording in how to hit re-rolls affect the gets hot rule as the wording for re-rolling to hit for blasts.

You are taking the rules for one thing and applying them to another based on some similar wording, which is RAI not the literal rules as written.

Being disingenuous again. Who'd have thought

P164 Gets Hot, Gets hot and rerolls
"If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit (incouding because of BS6+ or the ....) ..."

P158 Blast, blast weapons and rerolls
"If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit..."

Exactly the same REQUIREMENT, the ability to Reroll it's rolls to hit.

You're then REMINDED that BS6+ is included in this requirement

BS6 is by definition included in "BS6+"

BS6 requires you to roll a 1 on your to hit before you may Reroll
PE requires you to roll a 1 on your to hit before you may Reroll

Oh look, exactly the same

PE IS EXACTLY the same "type" of Reroll as something we know qualifies as a Reroll to hit, so it rerolls blast scatter as well

So, which is it Blaktoof? Is the rule book wrong again, now again the rule has been posted to again show that you're being "creative" about what the rule book actually says? Or will you deflect to something else, as per usual?

Why don't you quote what the rule book says about BS6? being a bit disingenuous aren't you?

BS6 require you to roll a 1 so that you GAIN the ability to reroll. If you can't roll a 1 on the to hit roll, you have not gained the ability to reroll.

the fact that you keep ignoring that part of the rule book means you know it proves your argument wrong and you have it backwards.

Like BS6 requires a 1 to gain a reroll, PE also requires a roll of 1 to gain a reroll. because like you said, they're exactly the same. If you can't roll a 1 then the model does not have the ability to reroll anything because it has yet to gain the ability.

Sigh, still spouting that tired argument again? Even when the rule book proves you wrong, and it was quoted above, where you didn't read it?

I quoted where the rule book defines BS6+, which includes BS6, as satisfying the requirement of "has the ability to..."

Done. Mine is proven. Prove that the line I quoted doesn't exist, as that is now the only argument you can honestly make.

Over to you. Come back when you can do it.

nosferatu1001 wrote:

sirlynchmob wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:

blaktoof wrote:
Hard to hit for FMC and Flyers both have the same trigger you look at blasts, but as the rule are written in different section and have different wording the outcome us different.

Gets Hot Does not use the same wording in how to hit re-rolls affect the gets hot rule as the wording for re-rolling to hit for blasts.

You are taking the rules for one thing and applying them to another based on some similar wording, which is RAI not the literal rules as written.

Being disingenuous again. Who'd have thought

P164 Gets Hot, Gets hot and rerolls
"If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit (incouding because of BS6+ or the ....) ..."

P158 Blast, blast weapons and rerolls
"If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit..."

Exactly the same REQUIREMENT, the ability to Reroll it's rolls to hit.

You're then REMINDED that BS6+ is included in this requirement

BS6 is by definition included in "BS6+"

BS6 requires you to roll a 1 on your to hit before you may Reroll
PE requires you to roll a 1 on your to hit before you may Reroll

Oh look, exactly the same

PE IS EXACTLY the same "type" of Reroll as something we know qualifies as a Reroll to hit, so it rerolls blast scatter as well

So, which is it Blaktoof? Is the rule book wrong again, now again the rule has been posted to again show that you're being "creative" about what the rule book actually says? Or will you deflect to something else, as per usual?

Why don't you quote what the rule book says about BS6? being a bit disingenuous aren't you?

BS6 require you to roll a 1 so that you GAIN the ability to reroll. If you can't roll a 1 on the to hit roll, you have not gained the ability to reroll.

the fact that you keep ignoring that part of the rule book means you know it proves your argument wrong and you have it backwards.

Like BS6 requires a 1 to gain a reroll, PE also requires a roll of 1 to gain a reroll. because like you said, they're exactly the same. If you can't roll a 1 then the model does not have the ability to reroll anything because it has yet to gain the ability.

Sigh, still spouting that tired argument again? Even when the rule book proves you wrong, and it was quoted above, where you didn't read it?

I quoted where the rule book defines BS6+, which includes BS6, as satisfying the requirement of "has the ability to..."

Done. Mine is proven. Prove that the line I quoted doesn't exist, as that is now the only argument you can honestly make.

Over to you. Come back when you can do it.

you misquoted the rule book, go read BS6 I'll wait. just keep ignoring the part where you gain the ability, and dismissing the fact that until you gain the ability, you don't have the ability.

I know any arguments that prove you wrong are just dismissed by waving your hands, and you go into your personal attacks. Just keep quoting get's hot and ignoring that to be looking at gets hot a to hit roll of 1 must have already been made.

you've proved nothing, you keep asserting yourself correct while misquoting the rule book.

pg 33 "If a model has BS6 or higher, it GAINS a reroll whenever it rolls a 1 to hit. so if it rolled a 1 to hit and GAINED a reroll, it can use that reroll for gets hot.

sirlynchmob wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:

sirlynchmob wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:

blaktoof wrote:
Hard to hit for FMC and Flyers both have the same trigger you look at blasts, but as the rule are written in different section and have different wording the outcome us different.

Gets Hot Does not use the same wording in how to hit re-rolls affect the gets hot rule as the wording for re-rolling to hit for blasts.

You are taking the rules for one thing and applying them to another based on some similar wording, which is RAI not the literal rules as written.

Being disingenuous again. Who'd have thought

P164 Gets Hot, Gets hot and rerolls
"If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit (incouding because of BS6+ or the ....) ..."

P158 Blast, blast weapons and rerolls
"If a model has the ability to re-roll it's rolls To Hit..."

Exactly the same REQUIREMENT, the ability to Reroll it's rolls to hit.

You're then REMINDED that BS6+ is included in this requirement

BS6 is by definition included in "BS6+"

BS6 requires you to roll a 1 on your to hit before you may Reroll
PE requires you to roll a 1 on your to hit before you may Reroll

Oh look, exactly the same

PE IS EXACTLY the same "type" of Reroll as something we know qualifies as a Reroll to hit, so it rerolls blast scatter as well

So, which is it Blaktoof? Is the rule book wrong again, now again the rule has been posted to again show that you're being "creative" about what the rule book actually says? Or will you deflect to something else, as per usual?

Why don't you quote what the rule book says about BS6? being a bit disingenuous aren't you?

BS6 require you to roll a 1 so that you GAIN the ability to reroll. If you can't roll a 1 on the to hit roll, you have not gained the ability to reroll.

the fact that you keep ignoring that part of the rule book means you know it proves your argument wrong and you have it backwards.

Like BS6 requires a 1 to gain a reroll, PE also requires a roll of 1 to gain a reroll. because like you said, they're exactly the same. If you can't roll a 1 then the model does not have the ability to reroll anything because it has yet to gain the ability.

Sigh, still spouting that tired argument again? Even when the rule book proves you wrong, and it was quoted above, where you didn't read it?

I quoted where the rule book defines BS6+, which includes BS6, as satisfying the requirement of "has the ability to..."

Done. Mine is proven. Prove that the line I quoted doesn't exist, as that is now the only argument you can honestly make.

Over to you. Come back when you can do it.

you misquoted the rule book, go read BS6 I'll wait. just keep ignoring the part where you gain the ability, and dismissing the fact that until you gain the ability, you don't have the ability.

I know any arguments that prove you wrong are just dismissed by waving your hands, and you go into your personal attacks. Just keep quoting get's hot and ignoring that to be looking at gets hot a to hit roll of 1 must have already been made.

you've proved nothing, you keep asserting yourself correct while misquoting the rule book.

pg 33 "If a model has BS6 or higher, it GAINS a reroll whenever it rolls a 1 to hit. so if it rolled a 1 to hit and GAINED a reroll, it can use that reroll for gets hot.

Except that the rule for gets hot and rerolls makes no such stipulation

Of course if your contention were true - it isn't, of course, but pretend for a moment it is - then you've just asserted there is no way for a BS6+ model to EVER Reroll Gets Hot with a blast weapon

Because the roll for a blast weapon is separate to the roll to hit. It isn't a roll to hit. And its rolled before you roll scatter (the bit that replaces the roll to hit) meaning you can never roll a one on the to hit to gain the Reroll

Except the rulebook says under those circumstances - bs6+ and gets hot - that you CAN reroll. Which contradicts the hypothesis - your claim, remember - meaning your contention cannot be true.

Argument proven, again. Will you now follow the tenets, and cite the precise rule that overrides the rule book quotes I gave above? Or will you claim that I'm "hand waving" again, so you can pretend it's all ok, and that your argument isn't still in ruins, like it is every thread you jump into late?

Oh, and retract your assertion that I "misquoted" the "rulebook", or substantiate it. Show the precise word / sentence fragment / etc that I misquoted, state the correct version, including page cites. Do it, otherwise you yet again fail to follow the tenets. Or you can simply retract your falsehood, and apologise.

nosferatu1001 wrote:

Except that the rule for gets hot and rerolls makes no such stipulation

Of course if your contention were true - it isn't, of course, but pretend for a moment it is - then you've just asserted there is no way for a BS6+ model to EVER Reroll Gets Hot with a blast weapon

Because the roll for a blast weapon is separate to the roll to hit. It isn't a roll to hit. And its rolled before you roll scatter (the bit that replaces the roll to hit) meaning you can never roll a one on the to hit to gain the Reroll

Except the rulebook says under those circumstances - bs6+ and gets hot - that you CAN reroll. Which contradicts the hypothesis - your claim, remember - meaning your contention cannot be true.

Argument proven, again. Will you now follow the tenets, and cite the precise rule that overrides the rule book quotes I gave above? Or will you claim that I'm "hand waving" again, so you can pretend it's all ok, and that your argument isn't still in ruins, like it is every thread you jump into late?

Oh, and retract your assertion that I "misquoted" the "rulebook", or substantiate it. Show the precise word / sentence fragment / etc that I misquoted, state the correct version, including page cites. Do it, otherwise you yet again fail to follow the tenets. Or you can simply retract your falsehood, and apologise.

You're showing your lack of understanding on how blast weapons work with gets hot. Read the last sentence.

you keep referring to get's hot in a discussion about blasts and preferred enemy, why is that? Let's look at that shall we.

Now in the situation of blast weapons, and get's hot, is the wound suffered from the d6 roll a result of the d6 prior to shooting a blast weapon? or from a to hit roll? both? The last sentence says that you can reroll the 1 result for weapons that do not roll to hit. which is not a to hit roll, which therefore does not gain the model the ability to reroll. You will admit at least they are 2 different die rolls?

As we can see that last paragraph covers both rolls, the to hit roll in which a model can gain the reroll ability, and the get's hot roll for weapons that do not roll to hit, which is the one we are discussing, yet you fail to quote that rule.

There are two ways to trigger get's hot, and if you think about that paragraph as a whole you could see where you are going wrong, if you weren't to busy hand waving and posting ultimatums.

Unless you can account for why BS6 stats RAW you gain the ability into your theory, then we can see where you went wrong. You dare not even quote the rule, because you know it shows everything you've stated to be wrong.

So as we see, you're misunderstanding of how the rules work does not contract me in any way. ergo I am correct and this is RAW. PE does not allow you to reroll blasts.

And as we know from you theory and your theory, you still allow models with a once per game reroll to reroll blasts every turn. Gotta love the ammo runts. Further proof your theory needs work.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Back on topic though, let's look at it this way. to reroll blasts "a model has the ability"

So we need a model with the ability.

PE says
"A unit that contains at least one model with this special rule"

so does PE grant the models in the unit the ability to reroll? No, it grants the unit a very specific reroll to hit and to wounds of 1.

the model doesn't have the rule, the unit does.

So, you can't point to the misquote?

Awesome.

Back on ignore. Your argument is proven false as you cannot counter that gets hot calls out BS6+ as giving you the ability to Reroll to hit, and thus Reroll gets hot. And this is the exact same wording as in blasts and rerolls

Your argument is done, I wil, not attempt to further this dialogue of the deaf.

I still don't think you can use the gets hot version of reroll to hit as an argument for blasts, regardless of whether PE actually happens to give a reroll to blasts.

The context of gets hot ("was a 1 rolled?") is very important to that interpretation of reroll to hit (as only the ability to reroll 1s is important).

You say the wording in blasts and gets hot is the same, but if that was true why would you repeatedly cross reference GH (without being told to by the rules) to support your interpretation of PE/Blasts? Regardless of whether your interpretation is right or wrong, I think quoting the gets hot version of rerolls to hit (which is only really interested in the ability to reroll 1s, rather than reroll proper) makes your argument seem weaker than it would otherwise appear.

I quoted both. You have a rulebook so can confirm they are exactly the same. They have exactly the same wording. If you believe they are different, then that cannot be a raw opinion.

Again, gets hot and rerolls just tells you when you can Reroll your gets hot. Same as blasts and scatter.

They aren't the same though, because as you repeatedly mention gets hot notes 1 count as a reroll, while there is a noticeable absence for blasts in this area?

nosferatu1001 wrote:
So, you can't point to the misquote?

Awesome.

Back on ignore. Your argument is proven false as you cannot counter that gets hot calls out BS6+ as giving you the ability to Reroll to hit, and thus Reroll gets hot. And this is the exact same wording as in blasts and rerolls

Your argument is done, I wil, not attempt to further this dialogue of the deaf.

Keep clinging to your red herring.

I showed your misquote, you keep failing to recognize it.

you: