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Made in au
Jinking Ravenwing Land Speeder Pilot





the down underworld

All the formations in the book say they must contain a "flyer wing consisting of........"

That is what I mean when a formation requires you to take a wing

"If you wait a few months, they'll pick one of the worst codexes and they'll nerf almost everything, its an abstract sort of balance, but it's the sort of balance gw likes... "
 
   
Made in us
World-Weary Pathfinder




I agree some formations require you to take a wing.

Just because some formations Require a wing, doesn't mean other formations CAN'T have a wing.

For that to be true the rule would have to be written differently.

Currently: "Flyers can either operate on their own as single models, or be taken in a Flyer Wing of between two and four models. All of the models in a Flyer Wing must be chosen from the same datasheet or be part of the same Formation"

In order for them to be restricted to ONLY DftS formations (and any subsequent ones with Flyer Wing requirements) it would need to read:
"All of the models in a Flyer Wing must be chosen from the same datasheet or be part of the same Formation that lists a flyer wing."

So we have our permissive rule that allows Flyer Wings to exist. "Flyers can either operate on their own as single models, or be taken in a Flyer Wing of between two and four models."
And the restrictions. "All of the models in A Flyer Wing must be chosen from the same datasheet or be part of the same formation"

Let's look at the construction of the Tempestus Scion Airborne Assault Formation.
It requires the following:
1 Commissar
1 Tempestus Command Squad
3 Tempestus Scion squads
4 Valkyries

We know from the FAQ ruling and the like that the 4 Valkyries means 4 Valkyrie Models.

I want to create a Flyer Wing of those 4 Valkyries.

Check my Permission to create one.
"Flyers can operate on their own as single models," - Well, I can certainly choose to do that. Up until DftS, that's exactly what the Airborne Assault Valks did. (Thought they do come on at the same time.)

"or flyers can operate as a Flyer Wing of between 2 to 4 models." Well...I have 4 Valkyries, that's the maximum allowable for an Air Wing.

Check my Restrictions
"All of the models in a Flyer Wing must come from the same Data Sheet" - Debatable since we don't know exactly what "same data sheet" means. But if we assume it to mean the same purchase for which you would go to a sheet for each unit chosen...then no. If we go to mean the same page of the codex, or DftS, then yes. So this condition either is or isn't met...so folks can debate this reasonably and rationally quite a bit.

"or be from the same formation." Yes. There can be no rational argument that these four Valkyries haven't come from the same formation. I have 2 to 4 models from the same Formation. I have clear permission for them to become a "Flyer Wing." I now treat them as such with all the benefits and draw backs there of.

Where things start to break down:
I will concede, some formations do not work nearly as nicely. But that seems to be because they are not SPACE MARINES and so GW seems to forget about them. The Emperor's Spear Aerial company is an example. But that one starts to break down before you even get to whether "Valkyrie Squadron" is intended to be replaced by "Valkyrie Air Wing" which, according to DftS, the Valkyrie is no longer taken as a squadron...because we don't even know what in the heck a Vendetta can do whether it is an Attack Flyer, Fighter, or Bomber. But, that's a Proposed Rules debate, not a YMDC discussion.

Also of note...strict RAW...Inquisition Valkyries aren't replaced. They don't have an Agi or Pursuit value. House rules galore! (DftS is kinda broken if they really do intend it to completely replace how flyers have been used. We'll see if it gets fully incorporated and if the next codex released has its flyers follow the DftS format. I am betting it will. (I'm also hoping it's a Guard Dex....I'm also hoping that Vendettas aren't just being shelved...but that's again a whole different forum discussion!)

Edit: Couple grammatical edits. One of which actually changed the meaning of the sentence. Oops.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/05/17 04:15:49


 
   
Made in us
Not as Good as a Minion





Astonished of Heck

 jokerkd wrote:
All the formations in the book say they must contain a "flyer wing consisting of........"

That is what I mean when a formation requires you to take a wing

So, is constructing a wing, "from the same formation in this book" or just "from the same formation"?

Those three letters are important. If it is the latter, then 3 DT Night Scythes from a Reclamation Legion would qualify, even in a Decurion.

Are you a Wolf, a Sheep, or a Hound?
Megavolt wrote:They called me crazy…they called me insane…THEY CALLED ME LOONEY!! and boy, were they right.
 
   
Made in us
World-Weary Pathfinder




My quotes are word for word from DftS for the general rules of creating Flyer Wings.

The formations in DFtS use the phrase "A Flyer Wing consisting of" indicating you have only 1 Flyer Wing within that formation, and precisely what is in that Flyer Wing.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/05/17 04:25:26


 
   
 
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