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2016/06/23 16:25:32
Subject: Daft Tactics: It's crazy but it just might work.
Melevolence wrote: Mine is simple and one I've pulled off only 3 times in the times I've tried it (I lost count of how many times I've tried) which is simply using a Weirdboy to use Da Jump on a Green Tide. The three times I succeeded resulted in forfeited games almost immediately after :I
That reminds me of an idea I had for an Weirdy Orkclave:
3-4 lvl2 Weirdboyz
1 Painboy with grot orderlies (helps with perils)
30 shoota boyz with 3 big shootas.
Statistically the unit will get Da Jump something like 1.5 times per game. So almost always getting a least one and sometimes getting two. It is a unit that can deep strike anywhere unleash a bunch of killy spells (frazzle, killbolt, da crunch..) all at different targets, then let the boyz unload 60 odd dice of small arms before doing all again the next turn and the next... If you get two da jumps you can get the ultimate jump-shoot-jump unit. Jump in, unleash beams & blasts large and small, then jump out again behind BLOS, hehhe.
Da Jump also gives it the ultimate "hit and run" because it is a blessing and so can be cast in while locked in combat.
If you give the boyz eavy armour it will cost around 660 pts and eat up at 4-5 HQ slots though, so battleforged it comes with a big troop tax.. then again grots are cheap.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/06/23 16:27:53
2016/06/23 22:56:06
Subject: Daft Tactics: It's crazy but it just might work.
IHateNids wrote: Once a friend of mine built a ridiculous Ld bomb which hit harder than I care to admit.
Contains
Archon - Armour of Misery (-2Ld)
Shadowseer - Mask Of Secrets (-2Ld) + Mirror of Minds
Any formation from Haemonculus Covens for a -1Ld bubble.
Optional: Farseer fishing for Terrify & DOminate (and Psychic Shriek)
Positioning allows for anything to be at -5 Ld. Then hit with MoM to force a max 11 vs min 11, whjich as per MoM will loop until the target dies.
Point, Click, Remove on any unit in the game that has a Ld value.
Huh, lol. How bout we kick this into overdrive. The Crimson slaughter formation would add another -1 Ld for the entire army and another -1 for being within 12" of a unit of kranon's helguard. If you manage to get the right warlord trait, you can subtract yet another point of leadership. For a total of -8 with correct positioning. -9 on any fear tests they would have take.
Also isn't there a an eldar flyer that also causes a bubble of - leadership or something along those lines?
Kick it up even more. Take another Archon with the Deldar, give him the Archangel of Pain.
That forces a -2 (stacks with everything else) Leadership test on all units within its aura and causes a wound per each point of failure per unit.
I was oddly planning doing something similar with my dark eldar list but only pure dark eldar. Something along the lines of archon with armor of misery (-2 LD 6" bubble) + archon with arch angel of pain (-2 LD 9" bubble where you take a LD test and pass or take wounds with no cover or armor in the bubble). I also may add 4 tormentors from raiders with disintegrators base and warriors with them inside and some on archons. Hard to say what'd be the cheapest route but archons normally have the best BS when shooting them.
Roknar wrote: So basically a giant buffed psychic shriek. Nice. Plus at this point we're WELL into apocalypse territory so it would hit a lot and even works against fearless units. Now we jsut need to find something that forces people to use the highest dice in leader ship tests lol.
Sadly no at least not with tormentors, phantasm or archangel of pain. Basically fearless and ATSKNF units are immune. It caused lots of dark eldar player bitterness. I have the book and have read it enough times to know but i could check again for you. That said vs tau and even eldar such as stupid bikes it can still do ok. Against invisible units bubble abilities like archangel of pain can still work too.
I have no haemonculus covens codex sadly so i will need to check that at some point. Dunno if they have any wargear but there's a possibility they have a negative modifier to enemy leadership with something.
Haha, funny, I've done the same with my Dark Eldar. Fear bombing ftw.
Full Kabalite Squad + Sybarite w/ Phantasm + Blaster
Deepstrike the full unit EXACTLY where you need it, fear bomb with Archangel and then mop up with Phantasms.
How well does it work? It actually sounds good in theory vs tau. Tormentors on raiders with disintegrators means they can move 12" and still shoot both weapons full BS and the tormentor has 24" range. With tau the main issue is they have massive overwatch if anything is in 6" of a unit being charged which works well with the armor of misery and arch angel of pain bubble effects. Also it goes through both cover and armor and the last tau opponent i had had a lot of both. Combined with tau's fairly decent movement tormentors would get their smaller jetpack units fairly easily. Only real issue at that point is the riptide (3+ inv. save sometimes and feel no pain) and the stormsurge (which isn't even effected by this). Course that's where blasters and such come in. The incubi and dual archon unit may even be able to do a couple wounds to riptide. Sadly once again 2+ armor on riptide :( (archons can't wield melee weapons beyond ap 3). Those annoying big stealth suits might feel the pain from the incubi and dual archons though.
Anyway i still think for dark eldar players the tau and eldar are the ones to beat (even with space marines going to the top again). Against tau this Fear Bomb should work very well and vs eldar it should be ok (at least with archangel vs the bikes). Against other armies it's debatable but dark eldar have other ways to handle those armies and they aren't the problem armies far as i'm concerned. It also might waste some enemy heavy weapons, special weapons or other small units. That said it'll be useless vs marine armies so i'll have to have quite a few disintegrators and maybe blasters in my army for fighting them.
This is all just a noob dark eldar player that has only 2 games of 7th under his belt and before that didn't play since some point during 5th.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2016/06/23 23:01:35
IHateNids wrote: Once a friend of mine built a ridiculous Ld bomb which hit harder than I care to admit.
Contains
Archon - Armour of Misery (-2Ld)
Shadowseer - Mask Of Secrets (-2Ld) + Mirror of Minds
Any formation from Haemonculus Covens for a -1Ld bubble.
Optional: Farseer fishing for Terrify & DOminate (and Psychic Shriek)
Positioning allows for anything to be at -5 Ld. Then hit with MoM to force a max 11 vs min 11, whjich as per MoM will loop until the target dies.
Point, Click, Remove on any unit in the game that has a Ld value.
I've been dying to try this for ages, though with a Death Jester for his further debuff, archangel of pain for deepstrike debuff, and phantasm + torment grenade launcher for wounds caused on failed Ld value. I seriously NEED to do this!
Edit: this'd give a -7 Ld modifier if the DJ causes a casualty, before psychic powers. DS in all those lovely launchers around bunched up enemies and say goodnight to absolutely everything that isn't immune to fear, that hasn't already died to psychic powers.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/06/23 23:35:00
IHateNids wrote: Once a friend of mine built a ridiculous Ld bomb which hit harder than I care to admit.
Contains
Archon - Armour of Misery (-2Ld)
Shadowseer - Mask Of Secrets (-2Ld) + Mirror of Minds
Any formation from Haemonculus Covens for a -1Ld bubble.
Optional: Farseer fishing for Terrify & DOminate (and Psychic Shriek)
Positioning allows for anything to be at -5 Ld. Then hit with MoM to force a max 11 vs min 11, whjich as per MoM will loop until the target dies.
Point, Click, Remove on any unit in the game that has a Ld value.
Huh, lol. How bout we kick this into overdrive. The Crimson slaughter formation would add another -1 Ld for the entire army and another -1 for being within 12" of a unit of kranon's helguard. If you manage to get the right warlord trait, you can subtract yet another point of leadership. For a total of -8 with correct positioning. -9 on any fear tests they would have take.
Also isn't there a an eldar flyer that also causes a bubble of - leadership or something along those lines?
Kick it up even more. Take another Archon with the Deldar, give him the Archangel of Pain.
That forces a -2 (stacks with everything else) Leadership test on all units within its aura and causes a wound per each point of failure per unit.
I was oddly planning doing something similar with my dark eldar list but only pure dark eldar. Something along the lines of archon with armor of misery (-2 LD 6" bubble) + archon with arch angel of pain (-2 LD 9" bubble where you take a LD test and pass or take wounds with no cover or armor in the bubble). I also may add 4 tormentors from raiders with disintegrators base and warriors with them inside and some on archons. Hard to say what'd be the cheapest route but archons normally have the best BS when shooting them.
Roknar wrote: So basically a giant buffed psychic shriek. Nice. Plus at this point we're WELL into apocalypse territory so it would hit a lot and even works against fearless units. Now we jsut need to find something that forces people to use the highest dice in leader ship tests lol.
Sadly no at least not with tormentors, phantasm or archangel of pain. Basically fearless and ATSKNF units are immune. It caused lots of dark eldar player bitterness. I have the book and have read it enough times to know but i could check again for you. That said vs tau and even eldar such as stupid bikes it can still do ok. Against invisible units bubble abilities like archangel of pain can still work too.
I have no haemonculus covens codex sadly so i will need to check that at some point. Dunno if they have any wargear but there's a possibility they have a negative modifier to enemy leadership with something.
Haha, funny, I've done the same with my Dark Eldar. Fear bombing ftw.
Full Kabalite Squad + Sybarite w/ Phantasm + Blaster
Deepstrike the full unit EXACTLY where you need it, fear bomb with Archangel and then mop up with Phantasms.
How well does it work? It actually sounds good in theory vs tau. Tormentors on raiders with disintegrators means they can move 12" and still shoot both weapons full BS and the tormentor has 24" range. With tau the main issue is they have massive overwatch if anything is in 6" of a unit being charged which works well with the armor of misery and arch angel of pain bubble effects. Also it goes through both cover and armor and the last tau opponent i had had a lot of both. Combined with tau's fairly decent movement tormentors would get their smaller jetpack units fairly easily. Only real issue at that point is the riptide (3+ inv. save sometimes and feel no pain) and the stormsurge (which isn't even effected by this). Course that's where blasters and such come in. The incubi and dual archon unit may even be able to do a couple wounds to riptide. Sadly once again 2+ armor on riptide :( (archons can't wield melee weapons beyond ap 3). Those annoying big stealth suits might feel the pain from the incubi and dual archons though.
Anyway i still think for dark eldar players the tau and eldar are the ones to beat (even with space marines going to the top again). Against tau this Fear Bomb should work very well and vs eldar it should be ok (at least with archangel vs the bikes). Against other armies it's debatable but dark eldar have other ways to handle those armies and they aren't the problem armies far as i'm concerned. It also might waste some enemy heavy weapons, special weapons or other small units. That said it'll be useless vs marine armies so i'll have to have quite a few disintegrators and maybe blasters in my army for fighting them.
This is all just a noob dark eldar player that has only 2 games of 7th under his belt and before that didn't play since some point during 5th.
I'm not going to sugar coat it - it's decidedly alright.
As previously mentioned, ATSKNF and Fearless negates it entirely but there are other more subtle ways for them to avoid feeling its maximum potential; interceptor was a problem until I started taking a full kabalite squad (really they're just meatshields for the Archons) and once you've hit an enemy with it once or twice, they'll spread out more to prevent you from claiming too many kills.
One thing you should note - RAW, only one Phantasm/Tormentor Nade launcher will work per target unit, the exact quote being 'at the end of the shooting phase, a unit suffering one or more hits from a weapon with this special rule (Soulfright) in that phase must take a leadership test' etc. etc. What this means is that after you land, you need to split the non-Archangel Archon from the Warriors in order to split your Phantasm fire among the nearby enemy units.
ALSO, fire the Archangel of Pain first (it has a limited AOE and you don't want to remove targets from it by killing them by shooting other things before it). Then once those wounds have been dealt with, select your targets for the Phantasms.
If your units survive the following turn, then separate the 2nd, now spent Archangel, Archon in order to use his own Phantasm too.
It's interesting because it's called the Fear Bomb because of what it actually does on the table YET it also affects your opponent's playstyle through the fear of what it can do. Call it a win if your opponent modifies his positioning simply because of the threat of its arrival.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2016/06/23 23:39:09
