Austin Bombings

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**djones520**

Frazzled wrote:
War Drone wrote:
Frazzled wrote:
I have an alibi! I was being oriented by the city!

Prove it!
Personally, I think you were squeezing your Wiener...

I have proof! A puddle of drool where I fell asleep!

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gak another one went off at a Goodwill just now.

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That's a lot. This guy has to be running out of inventory.

HME isn't that difficult to mass produce. The Afghan's have figured out how to make tons (literal unit of measurement) of it, in mud huts.

**sebster**

whembly wrote:
We don't know anything yet...

People are scared and are trying to rationalize why this is happening...it's hard not to try find patterns in all of this.

True, it is hard not to start looking for patterns, writing a story that makes all this make sense. It's that natural instinct that TheMeanDM is warning against, quite rightly, because our need to write those stories often leads to us making huge subconscious assumptions.

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Grey Templar wrote:
What is more likely is that its just a coincidence the first victims were African-American. He hand delivered the first bombs and then later began mailing them/setting up booby traps as he became more confidant in his bomb making. Its possible that the bomber lives in the area where the initial bombs were placed so they were more targets of convenience due to proximity.

Or the bomber hated one group of people because racism, then also targeted some other people to cover his tracks, or because he hates them for other reasons, which may also be racist for some reason. Or maybe none of that.

The point is we don't know, and shouldn't guess.

**jhe90**

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5526159/Austin-bomber-shot-dead-police-try-arrest-him.html

That's all folks.

Seems there luck finaly ran out and police got them. It was only a matter of time.. The true reasons behind may start to come out later. There has to be a reason, however crazy or evil. Most people have a reason for somthing. There not deadpool

"The FBI and police tracked the bomber to the Round Rock area using cell phone technology, security video, store receipts before 'engaging him' around 3am on Wednesday, the station reports."

**Disciple of Fate**

Seeing some cobflicting reports that it wasn't the police who shot him, but that he blew himself up. Hopefully it was just one guy though and this is now over.

**nels1031**

Nice.

Hopefully dude didn’t set up any other bombs/boobytraps before he was found.

**Mysterio**

Last I heard he blew himself up, choosing suicide as the police were closing in on him in his car.

He drove into a ditch and trigger a bomb in his car.

Any word of a motive yet?

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

BBC has is that he detonated a device, and was shot at - but it was the explosion that topped them.

Apparently, they're awaiting identification.

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Motive?

Well, if he's white, it'll be mental illness.

Darker skin? Anything from criminal to terrorist, according to the western media in general (UK, France, not just the US)

**jmurph**

24 year old white guy so obviously mental illness. Not like he was some terrorist refusing to kneel for the anthem. (/sarc)

Also interesting is that the two black victims seem to be linked together through ties to a prominent black church. A third victim seems to have been carrying a package and not the intended target, and the Schertz detonation does not seem to be an intentional target either. The tripwire bomb was set up in a more affluent neighborhood by a For Sale sign.

Interested to see what details emerge on him. Won't be shocked if he has conflicting views that don't fit easily into either side of the political spectrum and so get used as ammunition by both.

**Tannhauser42**

I was thinking to myself that I wish all these bombers and shooters could get a new punishment: anonymity. They all basically get free immortality from the media talking about them, books published about them, cable documentaries and them, etc. If they're just referred to as Bomber #00051A, and their name and picture is never shown again, maybe that will remove some of the motivation for why people do these things.
It's just a random thought, not feasible at all, I know.

**djones520**

jmurph wrote:
24 year old white guy so obviously mental illness. Not like he was some terrorist refusing to kneel for the anthem. (/sarc)

Also interesting is that the two black victims seem to be linked together through ties to a prominent black church. A third victim seems to have been carrying a package and not the intended target, and the Schertz detonation does not seem to be an intentional target either. The tripwire bomb was set up in a more affluent neighborhood by a For Sale sign.

Interested to see what details emerge on him. Won't be shocked if he has conflicting views that don't fit easily into either side of the political spectrum and so get used as ammunition by both.

That's typically the case with these people. They're just nutbags.

**nels1031**

Bomber ID'd.

AUSTIN — The suspected serial bomber whose deadly packages terrified Austin for almost three weeks before he blew himself up as law enforcement closed in was identified Wednesday as Mark Anthony Conditt.A federal law enforcement official described Conditt as 23 or 24 years old from a community north of Austin.

Earlier, Austin Police Chief Brian Manley said only that the suspect was a white man who authorities flipped from "person of interest" to suspect hours before his death.

Victor Gonzales, the mayor of Pflugerville, said Conditt lived about two blocks from him in this city about 20 miles north of Austin. Troopers from the Texas Department of Public Safety and agents with the ATF cordoned off several blocks in the neighborhood where Conditt had lived.

Conditt was home-schooled before receiving a degree from Austin Community College’s Northridge Campus, the Austin American-Statesman reported. He had worked at Crux Semiconductor in Austin and previously as a computer repair technician, the media outlet reported.

Fralen Allen, who works near Conditt's home, was stunned that the quiet community would be a crime scene.

“I’m sickened,” she said. “Surely in hindsight someone must have known and maybe this could have been prevented.”

Danene Conditt, who identifies herself on Facebook as Mark Conditt's mother, posted a photo of the suspect in February 2013.

"I officially graduated Mark from High School on Friday," the post reads. "1 down, 3 to go. He has 30 hrs of college credit too, but he's thinking of taking some time to figure out what he wants to do....maybe a mission trip. Thanks to everyone for your support over the years."

Authorities were aided in the identity of the suspect by reviewing surveillance video at the FedEx drop-off location north of San Antonio where the suspect was allegedly seen entering with a package. Investigators were able to pull multiple images from the surveillance video and were able to track him to a hotel parking lot near Austin by monitoring his cell phone activity, the official said.

Authorities also obtained information from Google and from the suspect's computer history that confirmed the bomber was looking at information on where to ship devices, the TV station reported, citing law enforcement sources., KVUE-TV in Austin reported.

“The biggest mistake the guy made was going to FedEx,” the official told USA TODAY.

Authorities identified the suspect at approximately 9 p.m. Tuesday, WFAA-TV reported. Police determined the car he was driving and found it at a hotel in Round Rock, about 20 miles north of Austin. A SWAT team was assembled and more firepower was on the way when the suspect attempted to flee, Manley said.

The suspect's vehicle ran into a ditch moments before the explosion that apparently took the bomber's life.

Four exploding packages in Austin since March 2 killed two people and injured at least four more. Another blast at a FedEx distribution center near San Antonio on Monday slightly injured one person.

Fred Milanowski, agent in charge of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms’ Houston Field Division, said investigators believe all the bombs were built by the same person. Manley said they believe the dead suspect is that person.

"BIG NEWS," tweeted Gov. Greg Abbott. "The Austin Bomber is dead. More work needs to be done to ensure no more bombs had been sent before he died. ... Congratulations to the combined law enforcement effort."

The death also drew a Twitter response from President Trump: "AUSTIN BOMBING SUSPECT IS DEAD. Great job by law enforcement and all concerned!"

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Tannhauser42 wrote:
I was thinking to myself that I wish all these bombers and shooters could get a new punishment: anonymity. They all basically get free immortality from the media talking about them, books published about them, cable documentaries and them, etc. If they're just referred to as Bomber #00051A, and their name and picture is never shown again, maybe that will remove some of the motivation for why people do these things.

It's just a random thought, not feasible at all, I know.

I tend to disagree.

I think the more the public knows, the better these situations can be combated and prevented.

**Kanluwen**

djones520 wrote:
jmurph wrote:
24 year old white guy so obviously mental illness. Not like he was some terrorist refusing to kneel for the anthem. (/sarc)

Also interesting is that the two black victims seem to be linked together through ties to a prominent black church. A third victim seems to have been carrying a package and not the intended target, and the Schertz detonation does not seem to be an intentional target either. The tripwire bomb was set up in a more affluent neighborhood by a For Sale sign.

Interested to see what details emerge on him. Won't be shocked if he has conflicting views that don't fit easily into either side of the political spectrum and so get used as ammunition by both.

That's typically the case with these people. They're just nutbags.

They get labeled as "nutbags" when people choose to ignore elements of the crime, certainly.

**sebster**

djones520 wrote:
That's typically the case with these people. They're just nutbags.

They can be both nutbags and terrorists. In fact I can't think of a person we've ever designated a terrorist who wasn't always pretty nuts. We never hesitated in calling Kaczynski McVeigh terrorists, and they were both off their rockers.

Something changed though, post 9-11. Terrorist became a word we are now reluctant to apply outside of Muslims. I don't think this is a big racist thing or anything like that, but it is driven by some pretty weird politics that to be honest I haven't really gotten my head around.

**Captain Joystick**

Tannhauser42 wrote:
I was thinking to myself that I wish all these bombers and shooters could get a new punishment: anonymity. They all basically get free immortality from the media talking about them, books published about them, cable documentaries and them, etc. If they're just referred to as Bomber #00051A, and their name and picture is never shown again, maybe that will remove some of the motivation for why people do these things.
It's just a random thought, not feasible at all, I know.

This isn't a new punishment. The Romans called it damnatio memoriae, the erasure of the punished person from history.

They instituted it after Herostratus tried to earn noteriety by burning down the Temple of Artemis, they thought that ensuring no one would ever know his name was both a fate worse than death, befitting the heinousness of his crime, and sufficiently poetic.

As for how effective it is, consider that 2500 years later we still know his name, and even have a name for his motive: herostratic fame.

**sebster**

nels1031 wrote:
I tend to disagree.

I think the more the public knows, the better these situations can be combated and prevented.

I agree that there is information that needs to be relayed to the public, not just to counter this but also as a basic service - people deserve to know how and why this man terrorised them. However, Tannhauser42 has a strong point = the worst thing about Columbine, and perhaps a big reason for the steady stream of school shootings since then, is the bizarrely sympathetic myths that were told in the media afterwards. That the boys were bullied, lashing back. It wasn't slightly true, and even if it was it was still wildly inappropriate - that sympathy and the subsequent immortality would have been seen by other disaffected kids.

There is something of a middle ground, where we learn about the whys and hows of these attack, without building a narrative that might give the murderer any sympathy.

**Kanluwen**

sebster wrote:
djones520 wrote:
That's typically the case with these people. They're just nutbags.

They can be both nutbags and terrorists. In fact I can't think of a person we've ever designated a terrorist who wasn't always pretty nuts. We never hesitated in calling Kaczynski McVeigh terrorists, and they were both off their rockers.

Something changed though, post 9-11. Terrorist became a word we are now reluctant to apply outside of Muslims. I don't think this is a big racist thing or anything like that, but it is driven by some pretty weird politics that to be honest I haven't really gotten my head around.

"Terrorist" is a word that gets used to apply to someone whose politics or beliefs are disagreed with by a certain group.
"Lone wolf" and other terms like that are used primarily when a certain group wants to avoid being linked to it and when others try to discuss the issue at hand with said group without wrecking the discussion into weird off-topic tangents and "Stop blaming me for X!".

I'd argue that race does play a part in it, at least in my experience. That these actions were not referred to as terrorism is disgusting to me and makes me wonder just how quickly the bomber was identified but the identity withheld.

sebster wrote:
nels1031 wrote:
I tend to disagree.

I think the more the public knows, the better these situations can be combated and prevented.

I agree that there is information that needs to be relayed to the public, not just to counter this but also as a basic service - people deserve to know how and why this man terrorised them. However, Tannhauser42 has a strong point = the worst thing about Columbine, and perhaps a big reason for the steady stream of school shootings since then, is the bizarrely sympathetic myths that were told in the media afterwards. That the boys were bullied, lashing back. It wasn't slightly true, and even if it was it was still wildly inappropriate - that sympathy and the subsequent immortality would have been seen by other disaffected kids.

There is something of a middle ground, where we learn about the whys and hows of these attack, without building a narrative that might give the murderer any sympathy.

That's been the biggest thing frustrating me of late. We saw this during the whole walkouts last week, where there was an attempt to 'hijack' it with a "Walk Up" movement--the idea being that if you went and talked to the weird kids that nobody talks to or that are constantly bullied it suddenly was going to be okay or that kid wasn't going to shoot up the school?

There's definitely something to be said for 'erasing' the fame and mythos surrounding these shooters whenever the events happen, but I do believe that we should look at these events and go from there.

**djones520**

sebster wrote:
djones520 wrote:
That's typically the case with these people. They're just nutbags.

They can be both nutbags and terrorists. In fact I can't think of a person we've ever designated a terrorist who wasn't always pretty nuts. We never hesitated in calling Kaczynski McVeigh terrorists, and they were both off their rockers.

Something changed though, post 9-11. Terrorist became a word we are now reluctant to apply outside of Muslims. I don't think this is a big racist thing or anything like that, but it is driven by some pretty weird politics that to be honest I haven't really gotten my head around.

Well, it depends on what he was trying to accomplish. Did he have an political agenda? Or was he just trying to kill the Lizardmen?

I for one do not just ascribe terrorism to Islamists. Yes, I've spent my whole adult life in the fight against Islamic terrorists, but they're hardly the only ones. Hell, according to my government, I'm a threat for being one (white, male, veteran), or will be in a few years.

**nels1031**

sebster wrote:
We never hesitated in calling Kaczynski McVeigh terrorists, and they were both off their rockers.

But only one of those two were charge and punished by the federal government for terrorism. Ergo, by legalistic standards, only one is a terrorist.

sebster wrote:
Something changed though, post 9-11. Terrorist became a word we are now reluctant to apply outside of Muslims. I don't think this is a big racist thing or anything like that, but it is driven by some pretty weird politics that to be honest I haven't really gotten my head around.

Disagree. Its usually the legal complexities of the definition of terrorism.

Case in point is the Ft. Hood shooter. A dude, muslim in this case, was in direct contact with a known and wanted terrorist, (a high ranking member of a group who use violent means to attempt to coerce governments to adhere to their demands) and committed a mass shooting that killed the better part of two dozen citizens. But because the shooter fell under the provisions of the UCMJ he wasn't charged with terrorism. There was much chagrin directed at the Obama administration about it, but that's just the nature of the respective legal system.

I don't think its religious or race based at all, but solely about the complexities of the legal hassles of terrorism charges.

edit: work is about to close, snowing here in Maryland, out for a bit.

**Kanluwen**

djones520 wrote:
sebster wrote:
djones520 wrote:
That's typically the case with these people. They're just nutbags.

They can be both nutbags and terrorists. In fact I can't think of a person we've ever designated a terrorist who wasn't always pretty nuts. We never hesitated in calling Kaczynski McVeigh terrorists, and they were both off their rockers.

Something changed though, post 9-11. Terrorist became a word we are now reluctant to apply outside of Muslims. I don't think this is a big racist thing or anything like that, but it is driven by some pretty weird politics that to be honest I haven't really gotten my head around.

Well, it depends on what he was trying to accomplish. Did he have an political agenda? Or was he just trying to kill the Lizardmen?

Domestic terrorism, as defined by the FBI, doesn't require a "political agenda".

There's some speculation right now that he was radicalized via one of 'the big three' right now when it comes to radicalized white males(Reddit, Facebook, Youtube). There's some speculation that his parents were heavily involved in an organization called "AmWay" with ties to now Secretary of Education DeVos and her husband and which has been accused of promoting Dominionist beliefs.

I for one do not just ascribe terrorism to Islamists. Yes, I've spent my whole adult life in the fight against Islamic terrorists, but they're hardly the only ones. Hell, according to my government, I'm a threat for being one (white, male, veteran), or will be in a few years.

That's a bit disingenuous. The FBI sees you as being at risk of radicalization/disillusionment. I personally don't feel like we, as a country, have done enough to prevent white supremacist groups(the ones that you theoretically would be at risk of being radicalized by) from being able to exist and hell, even thrive. It's been a concern for the FBI since the 1980s at least but it's one of those subjects where it gets just kind of...swept aside.

**whembly**

Possibly how he got caught...

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/austin-bombings-suspect-believed-neutralized-sources-n858576
...

“Exotic” batteries ordered online helped lead authorities to the Austin, Texas, bombing suspect before he died early Wednesday as police closed in, multiple senior law enforcement officials told NBC News…

The unusual batteries were the signature trait that allowed investigators to so quickly link the various explosives to Conditt...

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Kanluwen wrote:

There's some speculation right now that he was radicalized via one of 'the big three' right now when it comes to radicalized white males(Reddit, Facebook, Youtube). There's some speculation that his parents were heavily involved in an organization called "AmWay" with ties to now Secretary of Education DeVos and her husband and which has been accused of promoting Dominionist beliefs.

...so wait... are we, or are we not supposed to speculate on these events?

**Desubot**

How exotic could those batteries have been?

**djones520**

Desubot wrote:
How exotic could those batteries have been?

Well if it's a type that only one manufacturer makes, it narrows down the search quite a bit. They can track what stores sell them, and go from there, or examine online orders. Find people that fit other aspects they were looking at, such as receipts for the FedEx facility the bomb went off at.

**jhe90**

djones520 wrote:
Desubot wrote:
How exotic could those batteries have been?

Well if it's a type that only one manufacturer makes, it narrows down the search quite a bit. They can track what stores sell them, and go from there, or examine online orders. Find people that fit other aspects they were looking at, such as receipts for the FedEx facility the bomb went off at.

Serial numbers too...

batch codes and other details. this can help narrow stuff down.

**Kanluwen**

djones520 wrote:
Desubot wrote:
How exotic could those batteries have been?

Well if it's a type that only one manufacturer makes, it narrows down the search quite a bit. They can track what stores sell them, and go from there, or examine online orders. Find people that fit other aspects they were looking at, such as receipts for the FedEx facility the bomb went off at.

More than that, it can also be just something out of the ordinary(i.e. a marine battery when the person doesn't own a boat or live near water) now that they know what they're looking for.

**Desubot**

Kanluwen wrote:
djones520 wrote:
Desubot wrote:
How exotic could those batteries have been?

Well if it's a type that only one manufacturer makes, it narrows down the search quite a bit. They can track what stores sell them, and go from there, or examine online orders. Find people that fit other aspects they were looking at, such as receipts for the FedEx facility the bomb went off at.

More than that, it can also be just something out of the ordinary(i.e. a marine battery when the person doesn't own a boat or live near water) now that they know what they're looking for.

Well was more thinking along the lines of why he would need some unusual batteries in the first place.

i guess he might of been using them as ingredients instead of as is for the device it self.

**daedalus**

Desubot wrote:

Well was more thinking along the lines of why he would need some unusual batteries in the first place.

i guess he might of been using them as ingredients instead of as is for the device it self.

Depends on the type of battery. Put enough potential energy into something and then destabilize it and you can do nasty things. A small and unintended version of this were the Samsung devices that were catching fire in people's pockets.

**Tannhauser42**

sebster wrote:
nels1031 wrote:
I tend to disagree.

I think the more the public knows, the better these situations can be combated and prevented.

I agree that there is information that needs to be relayed to the public, not just to counter this but also as a basic service - people deserve to know how and why this man terrorised them. However, Tannhauser42 has a strong point = the worst thing about Columbine, and perhaps a big reason for the steady stream of school shootings since then, is the bizarrely sympathetic myths that were told in the media afterwards. That the boys were bullied, lashing back. It wasn't slightly true, and even if it was it was still wildly inappropriate - that sympathy and the subsequent immortality would have been seen by other disaffected kids.

There is something of a middle ground, where we learn about the whys and hows of these attack, without building a narrative that might give the murderer any sympathy.

Thank you for understanding the point I was trying to make and expressing it more fully. Of course we should know and understand how and why people do these things, but we don't need to immortalize these killers in the process.

**Grey Templar**

Indeed. These people need to be vilified, not humanized.

**Kanluwen**

Grey Templar wrote:
Indeed. These people need to be vilified, not humanized.

On the contrary, humanization goes a long way towards actually understanding the issues at play when dealing with terrorism(which is what this was).
Look at the "Us vs Them" mentality surrounding Islam.

Now, if you want to argue we've tried too hard trying to "humanize" white supremacists and their ilk? I'll agree with that. Signs are starting to come up that this individual targeted Austin because it is known as a more "liberal" area of Texas.

**Grey Templar**

Kanluwen wrote:
Grey Templar wrote:
Indeed. These people need to be vilified, not humanized.

On the contrary, humanization goes a long way towards actually understanding the issues at play when dealing with terrorism(which is what this was).
Look at the "Us vs Them" mentality surrounding Islam.

Now, if you want to argue we've tried too hard trying to "humanize" white supremacists and their ilk? I'll agree with that. Signs are starting to come up that this individual targeted Austin because it is known as a more "liberal" area of Texas.

Sure, behind closed doors and while talking about ways to stop it. But the general discussion in the media shouldnt go anywhere near humanizing killers like this. So as to prevent the copycat effect. And this should apply to all types of terror events, regardless of the perpetrators motivation.