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Well, AOBR pretty much invalidated all sales on the metal warboss and the only reason anyone bought boxes of boyz in 5th was because shoota boyz were strictly better than slugga boyz.

Just have a look at ebay. Every ork army consists of at least one set of AOBR orks. I doubt there is any money left to make from that kit.

 hollow one wrote:
I like this list, I reckon it's pretty on. I'd probably place boyz in the potential nerf column (maybe +1 point), and put kans/deff dreads in the potential buff column. I'm also fairly certain that buggies/skorchas will see a buff and a new kit with the codex, with all the rumors going on.

You like the list because you have good taste

Yea, I wouldn't be surprised with Boyz getting a nerf of some description but then again we haven't exactly been winning every tournament and GW seems keen to keep the "core" units of an army strong. I think I'm 50/50 on it. Perhaps if we don't mention it, it won't happen?

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

 hollow one wrote:
I like this list, I reckon it's pretty on. I'd probably place boyz in the potential nerf column (maybe +1 point), and put kans/deff dreads in the potential buff column. I'm also fairly certain that buggies/skorchas will see a buff and a new kit with the codex, with all the rumors going on.

You like the list because you have good taste

Yea, I wouldn't be surprised with Boyz getting a nerf of some description but then again we haven't exactly been winning every tournament and GW seems keen to keep the "core" units of an army strong. I think I'm 50/50 on it. Perhaps if we don't mention it, it won't happen?

I'd be okay with paying an extra point if the Greentide rule went down from 20 to 15, so putting boyz in battlewagons could actually be okay again.

 Vitali Advenil wrote:

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

 hollow one wrote:
I like this list, I reckon it's pretty on. I'd probably place boyz in the potential nerf column (maybe +1 point), and put kans/deff dreads in the potential buff column. I'm also fairly certain that buggies/skorchas will see a buff and a new kit with the codex, with all the rumors going on.

You like the list because you have good taste

Yea, I wouldn't be surprised with Boyz getting a nerf of some description but then again we haven't exactly been winning every tournament and GW seems keen to keep the "core" units of an army strong. I think I'm 50/50 on it. Perhaps if we don't mention it, it won't happen?

I'd be okay with paying an extra point if the Greentide rule went down from 20 to 15, so putting boyz in battlewagons could actually be okay again.

you would be ok with increasing the cost of a Boyz squad by 15% just to get a tiny buff for Battlewagon boyz?

Considering that boyz are not entirely unlikely to get a "fight twice" stratagem and clan rules that benefit them, +30 points per mob isn't that bad.

Just give grots a rule where you can put 2 of them for every slot in transports. I want to make a schoolbus trukk with 24 of them in it and paint it yellow.
Also, boyz increasing a point per model wouldn't surprise me but with traits and stratagems that would still end up a net win most likely

 Jidmah wrote:
Considering that boyz are not entirely unlikely to get a "fight twice" stratagem and clan rules that benefit them, +30 points per mob isn't that bad.

Did dark eldar warriors get price hike with strategems and obsessions?

GW doesn't believe in traits and strategems being worth points. That would make indexeses might actually be BALANCED against codex army which is horror for GW.

 Vitali Advenil wrote:

 koooaei wrote:
I think gw will continue with a one-dimensional greentide trend. So, boyz will get better due to clan rules and strategems, support will get better and cheaper. Stuff like waaagh banner and probably painboyz. Hq will get a buff with support artifacts. Some ranged unit will get better - probably lootas/flash gitz or something. Transports will get cheaper.
The rest of the book will get some buffs but will remain not worth it in competitive games.

That's honestly what I'm expecting but after hearing how DEldar are apparently terrifying now I hope we can get some sort of a similar treatment.

IIRC, deldar are still a mech shooty army with some mellee, so the playstyle hasn't changed - they've just become more effecient at it. Maybe i'm wrong - haven't looked much into de yet.

tneva82 wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
Considering that boyz are not entirely unlikely to get a "fight twice" stratagem and clan rules that benefit them, +30 points per mob isn't that bad.

Did dark eldar warriors get price hike with strategems and obsessions?

GW doesn't believe in traits and strategems being worth points. That would make indexeses might actually be BALANCED against codex army which is horror for GW.

Yea I'm with tneva on this - no other faction I can recall saw an increase in the cost of their basic troop for the benefit of chapter tactics or stratagems. I don't think that's reason enough for a price increase. Perhaps if Boyz become better somehow...
I mean look at what wyches gained from index to codex and didn't their price still drop a point or 2?

I want to see more Kommandos, Meganobz & Burna Boyz on the table.

I'm all for more expensive boyz if they become tougher and killier.

I'd like to see supercharged Orks like the AoS Ironjaws. It would make sense as Orks have always reacted to the energies of the warp, so the opening of the great rift could have caused their apotheosis.
(That would also stop them trying to ruin any of the existing cool Ork sculpts in the name of modernisation!)

Like others have said burna boys need some help and it's about time that 'eavy armour troops made a triumphant return.

It wouldn't surprise me if choppas became 1 pt like how they made shootas 1 pt in 7th. Green tide would probably still be the go to tactic but with shoota boyz, one of the clan tactics will probably be "Assault weapons can shoot while advancing without penalty" since GW likes to recycle it's rules for faction rules.

 Luke_Prowler wrote:
It wouldn't surprise me if choppas became 1 pt like how they made shootas 1 pt in 7th. Green tide would probably still be the go to tactic but with shoota boyz, one of the clan tactics will probably be "Assault weapons can shoot while advancing without penalty" since GW likes to recycle it's rules for faction rules.

Would be annoying to get the nerf when other factions got buffs to already great units. I know it's balanced but kinda nerfing now would make it unbalanced because nobody really got a nerf. XD

tneva82 wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
Considering that boyz are not entirely unlikely to get a "fight twice" stratagem and clan rules that benefit them, +30 points per mob isn't that bad.

Did dark eldar warriors get price hike with strategems and obsessions?

Does it really matter what GW did to a random unit from another codex which was a no-show in every top 8 of any larger event?

GW doesn't believe in traits and strategems being worth points. That would make indexeses might actually be BALANCED against codex army which is horror for GW.

When orks are done, there are no index armies left

For the record, I don't want boyz to go up in points. But I wouldn't cry myself to bed if they did.
Assuming they actually do playtest, they might find that a green tide with traits and stratagems to support them could turn into a very ugly thing for tournaments.

 Jidmah wrote:

tneva82 wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:
Considering that boyz are not entirely unlikely to get a "fight twice" stratagem and clan rules that benefit them, +30 points per mob isn't that bad.

Did dark eldar warriors get price hike with strategems and obsessions?

Does it really matter what GW did to a random unit from another codex which was a no-show in every top 8 of any larger event?

It shows GW doesn't consider traits, strategems etc have point costs. Marines didn't get price hike with codex either. Nor did IG. So idea that orks would get price hike because they get clan traits and strategems is either silly or wanting orks get shafted by being the only codex where models get price hike on those.

I am kinda hoping they bring Deff Koptas back and at least the old 5th edition kit.

What I am wondering is what units/options might end up being removed from the Ork Codex considering their approach to the Drukhari codex. For example if they don't bring the plastic deffkoptas back I imagine they will take out all the options save the ones that are available on the current fugly Kopta.

The Aeldari have their avatars, and with the Warp spilling out like it has been... Avatar of Mork and/or maybe Gork?

tneva82 wrote:
It shows GW doesn't consider traits, strategems etc have point costs. Marines didn't get price hike with codex either. Nor did IG. So idea that orks would get price hike because they get clan traits and strategems is either silly or wanting orks get shafted by being the only codex where models get price hike on those.

1. Neither of us can predict what GW will do.
2. I said boyz could get a price hike because they might turn out too strong during testing.

 Jidmah wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
It shows GW doesn't consider traits, strategems etc have point costs. Marines didn't get price hike with codex either. Nor did IG. So idea that orks would get price hike because they get clan traits and strategems is either silly or wanting orks get shafted by being the only codex where models get price hike on those.

1. Neither of us can predict what GW will do.
2. I said boyz could get a price hike because they might turn out too strong during testing.

Jidmah is right, we can't predict and realistically if they do playtest (I still refuse to believe they do) then they will most assuredly nerf boyz because we can't have a good unit ffs, we are supposed to lose not win. That is a bit of sarcasm but really I do agree with Jidmah, they will playtest (Maybe) and find that boyz do well in general so giving them any kind of buff will make them better and they don't want a horde to dominate the table because most of the META right now is big scary primarch sized monsters.

I really do see a NERF for Boyz coming and minor buffs for units that are in bad need of a HUGE buff. I also see clan tactics and strategems being lackluster like what they pushed out in the Chapter Approved. Nobody at GW from what I have seen, knows what to do with orkz nor how to synergize them. So many obvious choices could have been made to have some kind of synergy between units and instead they nerfed them into the ground or gave them a BUFF while taking away something else that defeats the purpose of the buff. Look at Flashgitz, a utterly useless unit because of the prohibitive cost and lack of range and the fact that they only have BS4+ if they don't move (Gitfinda) so what did GW do? Not a damned thing, they got rid of gitfindas and made the unit BS4+ in general, but then made the gunz Heavy so we can't move and shoot or be in a transport and shoot. So again we are back to a heavily over priced unit that can't move and shoot with good BS and has to be in a vehicle because they are still 6+ armor.

I really hope I am wrong and GW does a 180 and finds someone who knows orkz and buffs us back to the top tier or hell even the mid tier, but from what i have seen from 5th, 6th, 7th and now over a year into 8th, I am not impressed nor holding my breath for that outcome.

Orks were fine in 5th. Go search for DashOfPepper's battle reports here on dakka, he regularly trashed tournaments with his battlewagon bash - the only reason he never finished first is that he always took his freeboota buddy Kaptin Morgan to every tournament and was usually completely drunk by the final game.

Guys, I know we're talking about GW, but a nerf to Boyz is highly unlikely...

When things like Bloodletters and Tzaangors exist and cost 7pts, Boyz cannot be made more costly or weaker. They either have less damage output (BL have 2 attacks at S5 and AP-3 with D2 on 6+) or less toughness (Gors are T4 with 5++ and access to many defensive buffs).
I'm confident that both Sluggas and Shootas will stay exactly like they are atm.

I do hope though that Flash Gitz will make a big come back, as I love this unit. If Gitfinda made them work like Dark Reapers (always hitting on 4+), I would be delighted.

 Jidmah wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
It shows GW doesn't consider traits, strategems etc have point costs. Marines didn't get price hike with codex either. Nor did IG. So idea that orks would get price hike because they get clan traits and strategems is either silly or wanting orks get shafted by being the only codex where models get price hike on those.

1. Neither of us can predict what GW will do.
2. I said boyz could get a price hike because they might turn out too strong during testing.

Gw can't predict what gw doez... i'm half convinced there are no rule writers and it's just a robot that glitches out. But it's Japanese robot because of all the spelling mistakes (I picked Japan because they make robots not because they're bad at spelling).


Automatically Appended Next Post:

SemperMortis wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
It shows GW doesn't consider traits, strategems etc have point costs. Marines didn't get price hike with codex either. Nor did IG. So idea that orks would get price hike because they get clan traits and strategems is either silly or wanting orks get shafted by being the only codex where models get price hike on those.

1. Neither of us can predict what GW will do.
2. I said boyz could get a price hike because they might turn out too strong during testing.

Jidmah is right, we can't predict and realistically if they do playtest (I still refuse to believe they do) then they will most assuredly nerf boyz because we can't have a good unit ffs, we are supposed to lose not win. That is a bit of sarcasm but really I do agree with Jidmah, they will playtest (Maybe) and find that boyz do well in general so giving them any kind of buff will make them better and they don't want a horde to dominate the table because most of the META right now is big scary primarch sized monsters.

I really do see a NERF for Boyz coming and minor buffs for units that are in bad need of a HUGE buff. I also see clan tactics and strategems being lackluster like what they pushed out in the Chapter Approved. Nobody at GW from what I have seen, knows what to do with orkz nor how to synergize them. So many obvious choices could have been made to have some kind of synergy between units and instead they nerfed them into the ground or gave them a BUFF while taking away something else that defeats the purpose of the buff. Look at Flashgitz, a utterly useless unit because of the prohibitive cost and lack of range and the fact that they only have BS4+ if they don't move (Gitfinda) so what did GW do? Not a damned thing, they got rid of gitfindas and made the unit BS4+ in general, but then made the gunz Heavy so we can't move and shoot or be in a transport and shoot. So again we are back to a heavily over priced unit that can't move and shoot with good BS and has to be in a vehicle because they are still 6+ armor.

I really hope I am wrong and GW does a 180 and finds someone who knows orkz and buffs us back to the top tier or hell even the mid tier, but from what i have seen from 5th, 6th, 7th and now over a year into 8th, I am not impressed nor holding my breath for that outcome.

I don't know... in my play testing Boyz don't even perform that well. I did them vs IG (conscripts and guardsmen) even after nerfs and they decimated them in a turn. I then did them vs other factions and with the correct weaponry they all destroyed Orks. Only difficulty was vs marines but once I added girlfriendman that solved that problem. Although I also solved the problem with dreadnoughts. 1 contemptor buffed by a librarian walked up to a Gorkanaut and destroyed him only to turn around and also take out 30 next turn (not allmin 1 turn but he took out like 4 with shooting then 4 with cc. Received no damage and after a while the orks were forced to take moral). I have a feeling people are using a lot of anti tank low T models vs Ork Boyz because I was always ble to defeat them easily even when I fought a 100 or so.

I agree, right now there is no need for that. But try adding any craftworld/legion trait/hive fleet/daemon locus or whatever to them.
Some of them could outright make them bonkers (Allaitoc or BloodAngels, for example).

Id gladly pay the +1 point for Ard'boyz back, or for a strategem that works before the game to turn boyz into ard'boyz

Hahahahaha *wipes away a tear* you think they'll give orks something good?

 davou wrote:


Theres no way GW hasnt listened and heard that not every ork player wants to play spamm horde boys. Small squads need to be viable, and for that we need trukks to be a good unit.

No offense, but you must be really new to playing orks if you think geedubz listens to us.

For top units, hrmm. I'd disagree with the OP, I think ghaz is amazing just as-is, though a reroll aura would be pretty sweet.

I'd like for flash gitz to be nice, but even when the new kit came out in 7th, they were still kind of terrible. That was their time to push the model, and it didn't happen then, and probably won't happen now. Ditto for meganobz.

But optimistically, I'm going to call warbossi, mega / nobz, deff dreads, and orkanauts, just because I enjoy them.

It's been very clear for years that orks have no champion in the dev team.

Right naysayers, chill out. We've just been buffed in the big FAQ. Keep the faith!

1. Mob rule clarified to include size of units within 6".
2. Stormboyz can advance and charge if a warboss is within 6" without penalty.
3. WAAAAAAGGGHH!!! WORKS ON BIKES NOW?!!?

I'd say we did pretty well outta the FAQ.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:
Right naysayers, chill out. We've just been buffed in the big FAQ. Keep the faith!

1. Mob rule clarified to include size of units within 6".
2. Stormboyz can advance and charge if a warboss is within 6" without penalty.
3. WAAAAAAGGGHH!!! WORKS ON BIKES NOW?!!?

I'd say we did pretty well outta the FAQ.

Sarcasm or do you really think any of those will impact orkz in a competitive environment?