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Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




Looks like the game is going to be a lot about rushing objectives turn one, and trying to win on secondaries. I just hope it is not going to end with one or two gigantic mosh pits, in most games.


If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain. 
   
Made in dk
Discriminating Deathmark Assassin






 Aaranis wrote:
I don't understand what makes Custodes so good. To me they look like they always had a codex problem, not only points. Has their PA book changed that much how they play ? Or are their lists half soup ?

Also, if this goes on SM players will have to to their own SM tournaments if the other factions want to have any fun, looks like they're still not playing the same game as the others. Genuinely concerned about their first 9th Ed. codex coming October. I hope they'll tone every faction down in the lethality section, I mean the ones that need it of course. So that 9th has everyone on a lower basis for lethality to reduce codex creep a little.

The relation between costs and battlefield effect determines whether a unit is good or bad. Custodes have relatively low costs in 9th because they received few nerfs while most factions received many nerfs.

I am super happy to see soup, I was afraid it was as dead as can be. Other than that I don't think there is too much to be excited about with the results or participants.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/08/01 14:33:34


 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut





Fargo, ND USA

a_typical_hero wrote:

How are the participants chosen for this kind of events?


They sign up, pay their fee, then show up. MTG Invitational style tournament circuits aren't really a thing for 40K.

You know you're really doing something when you can make strangers hate you over the Internet. - Mauleed
Just remember folks. Panic. Panic all the time. It's the only way to survive, other than just being mindful, of course-but geez, that's so friggin' boring. - Aegis Grimm
Hallowed is the All Pie
The Before Times: A Place That Celebrates The World That Was 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




a_typical_hero wrote:
This is how the factions were distributed:

6x Custodes
4x Space Marines Soup or Successor
3x Imperial Soup
3x Chaos Soup
2x Grey Knights
2x Blood Angels
2x Nurgle (?)
2x Death Guard
1x Eldar
1x Ultramarines
1x White Scars
1x Chaos Knights
1x Sororitas
1x Tyranids
1x Tau

How are the participants chosen for this kind of events? Do they have to qualify in local tournaments first?

Chaos overall has a good representation, but barely any Xenos showed up.

Nobody is taking Xenos because no-one really feels they can win an event at the moment and non of the pundits or playtesters are upbeat about them alot of it is wait till you see the new codex which is sometime in 2021 at the earliest.
   
Made in it
Longtime Dakkanaut





This was an 8th edition tournament which got hijacked at the last second into 9th edition.

Most of the partecipants were ready for 8th edition, and in 8th most players didn't bring xenos. After the hijack many switched to another list or faction, but switching to marines and custodes is easy. Switching to xenos is much harder.
   
Made in dk
Discriminating Deathmark Assassin






Spoletta wrote:
This was an 8th edition tournament which got hijacked at the last second into 9th edition.

Most of the partecipants were ready for 8th edition, and in 8th most players didn't bring xenos. After the hijack many switched to another list or faction, but switching to marines and custodes is easy. Switching to xenos is much harder.

If Custodes Troops got the 50% increase Drukhari got and Drukhari got no increase you bet your ass we would be seeing the Drukhari raiding the tournament silly.
   
Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut




 vict0988 wrote:
Spoletta wrote:
This was an 8th edition tournament which got hijacked at the last second into 9th edition.

Most of the partecipants were ready for 8th edition, and in 8th most players didn't bring xenos. After the hijack many switched to another list or faction, but switching to marines and custodes is easy. Switching to xenos is much harder.

If Custodes Troops got the 50% increase Drukhari got and Drukhari got no increase you bet your ass we would be seeing the Drukhari raiding the tournament silly.


Yeah. No way some 8th Edition tournament would've had a quarter of the people bring foot-heavy Custodes lists.

The lists and faction spread screams "9th Ed. winners" and that's what people brought.
   
Made in us
Mutated Chosen Chaos Marine




The dark hollows of Kentucky

vict0988 wrote:
Spoiler:
Spoletta wrote:
This was an 8th edition tournament which got hijacked at the last second into 9th edition.

Most of the partecipants were ready for 8th edition, and in 8th most players didn't bring xenos. After the hijack many switched to another list or faction, but switching to marines and custodes is easy. Switching to xenos is much harder.

If Custodes Troops got the 50% increase Drukhari got and Drukhari got no increase you bet your ass we would be seeing the Drukhari raiding the tournament silly.

But they didn't. They got one of the smallest points increases, along with +1 to their invuls, their own version of transhuman physiology, and a stratagem that negates ap -1 and -2. So an army with obsec on everything, 2+, 4++, T5, 3W troops, even better stats on their elites, and a dreadnought that's tougher than a leviathan but cheaper. Yikes. Did I miss anything? Guess loyalist marines should start sweating.

Karol wrote:Looks like the game is going to be a lot about rushing objectives turn one, and trying to win on secondaries. I just hope it is not going to end with one or two gigantic mosh pits, in most games.


What's wrong with mosh pits? I love mosh pits.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/08/01 15:38:53


 
   
Made in de
Ladies Love the Vibro-Cannon Operator






Hamburg

What's wrong with mosh pits? I love mosh pits.

Could be a protracted melee which is not what I'm looking for with my armies.

Former moderator 40kOnline

Lanchester's square law - please obey in list building!

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Armies: Eldar, Necrons, Blood Angels, Grey Knights; World Eaters (30k); Bloodbound; Cryx, Circle, Cyriss 
   
Made in de
Regular Dakkanaut




Of all the Xenos factions I think only Tau have it really rough with the new scoring system.

Eldar, Orks and Tyranids could have solutions in the form of Wraithguard, mass boys and mass gaunts maybe.

Custodes, Marines and Death Guard is the safe bet though and have a relative low cost / entry barrier.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Gadzilla666 wrote:
vict0988 wrote:
Spoiler:
Spoletta wrote:
This was an 8th edition tournament which got hijacked at the last second into 9th edition.

Most of the partecipants were ready for 8th edition, and in 8th most players didn't bring xenos. After the hijack many switched to another list or faction, but switching to marines and custodes is easy. Switching to xenos is much harder.

If Custodes Troops got the 50% increase Drukhari got and Drukhari got no increase you bet your ass we would be seeing the Drukhari raiding the tournament silly.

But they didn't. They got one of the smallest points increases, along with +1 to their invuls, their own version of transhuman physiology, and a stratagem that negates ap -1 and -2. So an army with obsec on everything, 2+, 4++, T5, 3W troops, even better stats on their elites, and a dreadnought that's tougher than a leviathan but cheaper. Yikes. Did I miss anything? Guess loyalist marines should start sweating.


2+ 4++ is the profile Custodes have had for all of 8th, that +1 to invulns is not new. Also, their strat to ignore Ap 1 and Ap 2 is only for Terminators. That's very good for them, but there's still a lot of Ap 3+ that ignores it. ...and that strat doesn't have anything to do with the faq/ca adjustment into 9th, that was in the War of the Spider.

I'm not defending them getting such a small points adjustment (relatively speaking), the points adjustments are all over the place. Custodes probably got the only set of changes that were appropriate compared to Marines, but that's an indictment of the Marine increases more than anything else.

   
Made in us
Mutated Chosen Chaos Marine




The dark hollows of Kentucky

The Newman wrote:
Spoiler:
 Gadzilla666 wrote:
vict0988 wrote:
Spoletta wrote:
This was an 8th edition tournament which got hijacked at the last second into 9th edition.

Most of the partecipants were ready for 8th edition, and in 8th most players didn't bring xenos. After the hijack many switched to another list or faction, but switching to marines and custodes is easy. Switching to xenos is much harder.

If Custodes Troops got the 50% increase Drukhari got and Drukhari got no increase you bet your ass we would be seeing the Drukhari raiding the tournament silly.

But they didn't. They got one of the smallest points increases, along with +1 to their invuls, their own version of transhuman physiology, and a stratagem that negates ap -1 and -2. So an army with obsec on everything, 2+, 4++, T5, 3W troops, even better stats on their elites, and a dreadnought that's tougher than a leviathan but cheaper. Yikes. Did I miss anything? Guess loyalist marines should start sweating.


2+ 4++ is the profile Custodes have had for all of 8th, that +1 to invulns is not new. Also, their strat to ignore Ap 1 and Ap 2 is only for Terminators. That's very good for them, but there's still a lot of Ap 3+ that ignores it. ...and that strat doesn't have anything to do with the faq/ca adjustment into 9th, that was in the War of the Spider.

I'm not defending them getting such a small points adjustment (relatively speaking), the points adjustments are all over the place. Custodes probably got the only set of changes that were appropriate compared to Marines, but that's an indictment of the Marine increases more than anything else.

It isn't? Sorry, news to me, not a lot of Custodes players around here (though that may change now). I knew the AP strat was from pa but didn't realize it only works on termis, that's a little less bonkers. Agreed on the points, but looking at the price and stats on the Telemon and then looking at my Hellforged Leviathan stings a bit. You gotta agree though, Custodes are looking pretty good.
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka







 Gadzilla666 wrote:
You gotta agree though, Custodes are looking pretty good.


It's all that gold...

2019 Plog - Dysartes Twitches - 2019 Output

My Twitch stream - going live at 7pm GMT Tuesday & Thursday, 12pm Sunday (work permitting).

Gamgee on Tau Players wrote:we all kill cats and sell our own families to the devil and eat live puppies.
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut



NE Ohio, USA

 Dysartes wrote:
...am I the only person flabbergasted at the blatant stupidity in running a GT at the moment? Especially in the US?


No.
   
Made in ca
Been Around the Block



So Cal

Sunny Side Up wrote:
Also, on the other hand, there're tons of TTS tournament results if you're looking for high-performing lists.

It's kinda cool to see an actual GT getting off the ground, but for scrying the meta, it's not that relevant.

Custodes and Death Guard tend to dominate and probably need a healthy nerf. Marines continue to be super good and hopefully get toned down in their 9th Ed. codex. AdMech are good at tabling people. Sisters are good at raking up mission points before getting tabled. Etc..



Where can I find TTS results and lists?

 
   
Made in us
Mutated Chosen Chaos Marine




The dark hollows of Kentucky

Dysartes wrote:
 Gadzilla666 wrote:
You gotta agree though, Custodes are looking pretty good.


It's all that gold...

Personally I prefer the ones in Black, Shadow Keepers right? As for your earlier question:

Dysartes wrote:...am I the only person flabbergasted at the blatant stupidity in running a GT at the moment? Especially in the US?

Nope, not really. I stopped being surprised by general human stupidity a long time ago. Doesn't mean it doesn't make me want to smack them though.
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




 wuestenfux wrote:
What's wrong with mosh pits? I love mosh pits.

Could be a protracted melee which is not what I'm looking for with my armies.

yeah, playing something that turns in to a random dice rolling simulator with no movment involved on turn 2 isn't very fun.

If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain. 
   
Made in nl
Longtime Dakkanaut





Wayniac wrote:
Oh but soups supposed to be dead right?
Soup now has a cost (in CP) instead of being a benefit by giving you more CP.
That is fine and how it should be.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
a_typical_hero wrote:
Of all the Xenos factions I think only Tau have it really rough with the new scoring system.

Eldar, Orks and Tyranids could have solutions in the form of Wraithguard, mass boys and mass gaunts maybe.

Custodes, Marines and Death Guard is the safe bet though and have a relative low cost / entry barrier.
For Tau I would look more towards the European lists from 8th that had a lot more mobility to get on objectives instead of the US style fire bases that sit in their deployment zone waiting for the game to end.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/08/01 17:59:49


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Gadzilla666 wrote:
Dysartes wrote:
Dysartes wrote:...am I the only person flabbergasted at the blatant stupidity in running a GT at the moment? Especially in the US?

Nope, not really. I stopped being surprised by general human stupidity a long time ago. Doesn't mean it doesn't make me want to smack them though.

Yeah, but it's a special kind of stupid when we do it here in the US. It's one thing to see someplace like El Salvadore make bad choices, there's always the tacit understanding that if wasn't for bad options they wouldn't have any options at all. The US doing it is "watching a man with every advantage in the world calmly, deliberately, and decisively stick his todger in a pan of hot bleach".


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Karol wrote:
 wuestenfux wrote:
What's wrong with mosh pits? I love mosh pits.

Could be a protracted melee which is not what I'm looking for with my armies.

yeah, playing something that turns in to a random dice rolling simulator with no movment involved on turn 2 isn't very fun.

I've had a game look like it was going to get locked up like that, but the mechanics of Pile In and Morale made trying to make the most of that 3" move fairly engaging.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/08/01 18:43:28


   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Ordana wrote:
Wayniac wrote:
Oh but soups supposed to be dead right?
Soup now has a cost (in CP) instead of being a benefit by giving you more CP.
That is fine and how it should be.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
a_typical_hero wrote:
Of all the Xenos factions I think only Tau have it really rough with the new scoring system.

Eldar, Orks and Tyranids could have solutions in the form of Wraithguard, mass boys and mass gaunts maybe.

Custodes, Marines and Death Guard is the safe bet though and have a relative low cost / entry barrier.
For Tau I would look more towards the European lists from 8th that had a lot more mobility to get on objectives instead of the US style fire bases that sit in their deployment zone waiting for the game to end.

This issue is those lists also pretty much died with marines as they just don't have the staying power to not just get tabled.

The old 4th edition devilfish and firewarrior spam might just work as Tau sept but it's got the killing power of wet noodles.
   
Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut




Westeros RTT winning list
[Thumb - 883A17C1-7E3F-445F-A1B8-197F46A16FC9.jpeg]

   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





The Galatus? That's on that hasn't seen the table in a long time (or ever, really).
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut




Sunny Side Up wrote:
Westeros RTT winning list

Thanks for that, that's just pure filth seems almost primed to pray on Marine lists though, while being also strong vrs Custodes and a number of other fly keyword based armies.
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




Is the Galatus the one with the shield?

Also how many people actually attended? The healthcare worker in me is concerned.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Ice_can wrote:
Sunny Side Up wrote:
Westeros RTT winning list

Thanks for that, that's just pure filth seems almost primed to pray on Marine lists though, while being also strong vrs Custodes and a number of other fly keyword based armies.


For real, the entire marine detachment is built just to kill Primaris. Teeth of Terra, Stalker Intercessors, Grav-cannons. They all mulch primaris pretty hard, although I'm curious he put the strength WLT on his captain instead of imperium's sword.
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Aaranis wrote:
Also, if this goes on SM players will have to to their own SM tournaments if the other factions want to have any fun, looks like they're still not playing the same game as the others. Genuinely concerned about their first 9th Ed. codex coming October. I hope they'll tone every faction down in the lethality section, I mean the ones that need it of course. So that 9th has everyone on a lower basis for lethality to reduce codex creep a little.

I like how people still whine about SM when out of 31 lists, this tournament saw grand total of TWO marine list. TWO. That's 6.5%, oh no, look at the spam!

There are also 4 half SM soups (I wonder why, when SM are sooo much better than anyone else?), 3 Imperial soups that maybe had SM, and a Blood Angels list. So, at WORST, less than 1/3 of the armies contained SM, and only half of that contained enough SM to have them as main component. Even a Fox News scaretainment show would find it hard to spin these numbers into "force them to have SM tournaments only". Seriously?

Except it gets even worse. Let's look at the winning list. The Sister/Marine one. Except ""Marines"" on it consists mostly of broken Forge World gak spam. This list features almost no actual SM from their own Codex. Gee, that sure sounds like the SM book is OP and everyone will spam it to exclusion of everything else!

Incidentally, same is true for most of Custode lists - broken FW junk for days, with few lists featuring all plastic army (but a lot of all-resin FW ones) - I really hope GW finally publishes Index FW smashing that pay to win nonsense if only because then maybe we'll have less whining about people wanting to play these armies with underpowered plastic models, not cherrypicked resin crap the books get bad rap for even though they don't actually contain these to begin with...
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




Wow the good ol' "Forge Wolrd IS bRoken!!!!1!" that I haven't seen in a while.

I got a spoiler alert for ya. Custodes have almost NOTHING without FW giving them anything. They might as well not exist as an army.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka







Sunny Side Up wrote:
Westeros RTT winning list


Was this an IRL event, SSU, or one run on TTS?

2019 Plog - Dysartes Twitches - 2019 Output

My Twitch stream - going live at 7pm GMT Tuesday & Thursday, 12pm Sunday (work permitting).

Gamgee on Tau Players wrote:we all kill cats and sell our own families to the devil and eat live puppies.
 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





 Dysartes wrote:
...am I the only person flabbergasted at the blatant stupidity in running a GT at the moment? Especially in the US?


You are not. Kansas is also in the top quartile of case growth.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Nitro Zeus wrote:
6 Eradicators in #1 list. Color me surprised


And there are 9 Eliminators in 28th place.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Wayniac wrote:
Oh but soups supposed to be dead right?


No, its supposed to have a penalty, which is does. Most people didn't want soup to go away. Especially CSM.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2020/08/01 20:42:03


   
Made in ca
Legendary Master of the Chapter





eliminators are good yeah, but you'll not be able to win a game by spamming them.

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
 
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