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BrianDavion wrote: or maybe GW realizes cultists in CSM are a horriable idea and gets rid of them only to intorduce a L&D codex
Oh please. Like GW would remove a thematic and intrinsic part of the Chaos Space Marine line to turn it... into... another... army...
Spoiler:
... oh...
I just think cultists are wrong for codex CSMs for the same reason scouts being troops for LSMs where problematic
Cultists should have remained as Alpha Legion only. Their inclusion in all the legions was just another repercussion of gw sticking all of the legions in a blender and turning them into a bland paste of shared ingredients, same as letting all the legions take any of the cult marines, or marks. I miss 3.5.
right because ONLY the Alpha Legion uses hoards of disposable canon fodder
Disposable cannon fodder? No. But cultists? Probably. Most other legions would use other forms. Like L&D, R&H, etc. Sorry for agreeing with you. I'll try not to do that again.
my point is that cultists being for everyone is fine, the problem with cultists is more structural. the TLDR is that if you have a army that is moderatly elite, giving them access to cheap troops can be a problem. as I said it's the "Scout problem" Marines had.
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
BrianDavion wrote: or maybe GW realizes cultists in CSM are a horriable idea and gets rid of them only to intorduce a L&D codex
Oh please. Like GW would remove a thematic and intrinsic part of the Chaos Space Marine line to turn it... into... another... army...
... oh...
I just think cultists are wrong for codex CSMs for the same reason scouts being troops for LSMs where problematic
Cultists should have remained as Alpha Legion only. Their inclusion in all the legions was just another repercussion of gw sticking all of the legions in a blender and turning them into a bland paste of shared ingredients, same as letting all the legions take any of the cult marines, or marks. I miss 3.5.
right because ONLY the Alpha Legion uses hoards of disposable canon fodder
Disposable cannon fodder? No. But cultists? Probably. Most other legions would use other forms. Like L&D, R&H, etc. Sorry for agreeing with you. I'll try not to do that again.
my point is that cultists being for everyone is fine, the problem with cultists is more structural. the TLDR is that if you have a army that is moderatly elite, giving them access to cheap troops can be a problem. as I said it's the "Scout problem" Marines had.
So all the Legions having access to cultists is fine, but them having access to them in the csm codex isn't? You're giving me a headache Brian.
My point is that Alpha Legion should have access to cultists without allying in another codex, because using human agents heavily in their operations is their schtick. Other Legions should have to ally in some R&H or L&D (some form of which gw better be bringing back in some form or another) if they want access to cheap infantry. They would use such forces, but just like with knights, they wouldn't be a part of their basic legion structure, unlike Alpha Legion.
Edit: Fixed spoiler tags.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/10/24 08:05:43
basicly my point is alpha legion isn't special and doesn't need cultists as a "special only for us" thing. NO Legion should have cultists. rather cultists should be moved into a L&D codex.
Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two
BrianDavion wrote: or maybe GW realizes cultists in CSM are a horriable idea and gets rid of them only to intorduce a L&D codex
Oh please. Like GW would remove a thematic and intrinsic part of the Chaos Space Marine line to turn it... into... another... army...
... oh...
I just think cultists are wrong for codex CSMs for the same reason scouts being troops for LSMs where problematic
Cultists should have remained as Alpha Legion only. Their inclusion in all the legions was just another repercussion of gw sticking all of the legions in a blender and turning them into a bland paste of shared ingredients, same as letting all the legions take any of the cult marines, or marks. I miss 3.5.
right because ONLY the Alpha Legion uses hoards of disposable canon fodder
No, dragons use hoards - normally as a mattress.
The Alpha Legion uses hordes of disposable cannon fodder...
(Edit - I keep forgetting that the forum doesn't like nested spoiler tags)
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/10/24 08:04:31
Gamgee on Tau Players wrote:we all kill cats and sell our own families to the devil and eat live puppies.
Kanluwen wrote: This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.
Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army...
tneva82 wrote: You aren't even trying ty pretend for honest arqument. Open bad faith trolling.
- No reason to keep this here, unless people want to use it for something...
Why do people keep mistyping 'Word Bearers' as 'Alpha Legion'?
Also, anyone who wants to take away a Troops choice from an army that already only has 2 Troops choices, while leaving loyalist Space Marines with (IIRC) five different Troops choices (plus all the chapter-specific ones), can just feth right off.
I would accept cultists not being able to fill mandatory Troops slots except in WB detachments, but that's it.
A little bit of righteous anger now and then is good, actually. Don't trust a person who never gets angry.
We wouldn't be having this discussion if csm would not fething suck even more then cultists do, and cultists allready suck Hard.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
Duskweaver wrote:Why do people keep mistyping 'Word Bearers' as 'Alpha Legion'?
Because in 3.5 cultists were only an option for Alpha Legion. Word Bearers had csm and lesser daemons, though they could bring more than other Legions, at the expense of HS, FA, and elites slots.
Not Online!!! wrote:We wouldn't be having this discussion if csm would not fething suck even more then cultists do, and cultists allready suck Hard.
This is true. It's an indictment of gw's treatment of the Legions that people actually complain about using Chaos Space Marines in a Chaos Space Marines army.
right because ONLY the Alpha Legion uses hoards of disposable canon fodder
No, dragons use hoards - normally as a mattress.
The Alpha Legion uses hordes of disposable cannon fodder...
Let's be fair, the cultists are also canon fodder - considering their existence in Black Library, seemingly only to be mulched by movie Marines.
I'm all for a certain amount of homogenisation in the Chaos Codex - after all it makes sense for some other Legions and warbands to use cultists (pretty much anything Tzeentchian, for example) and it makes sense for some Legions to have access to cult troops (Black Legion can recruit virtually anyone, and Word Bearers would have their own cult troops as warriors decide to worship a particular god extra-hard).
"Hard pressed on my right. My centre is yielding. Impossible to manoeuvre. Situation excellent. I am attacking." - General Ferdinand Foch
right because ONLY the Alpha Legion uses hoards of disposable canon fodder
No, dragons use hoards - normally as a mattress.
The Alpha Legion uses hordes of disposable cannon fodder...
Let's be fair, the cultists are also canon fodder - considering their existence in Black Library, seemingly only to be mulched by movie Marines.
Ibram Gaunt, Ciaphas Cain, and both their regiments would like a word with you regarding cultists only being present in Black Library fiction to be mulched by Movie Marines...
Gamgee on Tau Players wrote:we all kill cats and sell our own families to the devil and eat live puppies.
Kanluwen wrote: This is, emphatically, why I will continue suggesting nuking Guard and starting over again. It's a legacy army that needs to be rebooted with a new focal point.
Confirmation of why no-one should listen to Kanluwen when it comes to the IG - he doesn't want the IG, he want's Kan's New Model Army...
tneva82 wrote: You aren't even trying ty pretend for honest arqument. Open bad faith trolling.
- No reason to keep this here, unless people want to use it for something...
right because ONLY the Alpha Legion uses hoards of disposable canon fodder
No, dragons use hoards - normally as a mattress.
The Alpha Legion uses hordes of disposable cannon fodder...
Let's be fair, the cultists are also canon fodder - considering their existence in Black Library, seemingly only to be mulched by movie Marines.
Ibram Gaunt, Ciaphas Cain, and both their regiments would like a word with you regarding cultists only being present in Black Library fiction to be mulched by Movie Marines...
TBF those in there in general aren't solely existing to be mulched on aswell, on occaision they become really threathening. Like the blood pact.
That said overall, yeah GW does indeed let most of these look bad on a lot of occaisions.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
right because ONLY the Alpha Legion uses hoards of disposable canon fodder
No, dragons use hoards - normally as a mattress.
The Alpha Legion uses hordes of disposable cannon fodder...
Let's be fair, the cultists are also canon fodder - considering their existence in Black Library, seemingly only to be mulched by movie Marines.
Ibram Gaunt, Ciaphas Cain, and both their regiments would like a word with you regarding cultists only being present in Black Library fiction to be mulched by Movie Marines...
TBF those in there in general aren't solely existing to be mulched on aswell, on occaision they become really threathening. Like the blood pact.
That said overall, yeah GW does indeed let most of these look bad on a lot of occaisions.
Well, TBF again, that's probably because we don't have any BL books where standard humans serving under the banner of chaos are the protagonists. Everyone is a badass in their own books. Just look what Honsou and friends did to all those guardsmen and whatever that loyalist chapter was. Or the Lords of Silence stomping all over another loyalist chapter, as well as a bunch of Word Bearers in their book. And Tenth Company smacked Blood Angels around like the sparkly Twilight Marines they are in their books, as well as killing a titan with one squad of csm. Yeah, it's always better to be the star of the story.
Add to wishlist, competent writer for BL that manages to make the opposing side of the protagonist not a meme?
Cultists for the potential CSM box.
How about an exodite box, high time to fix the eldar range up a bit...
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
I am also curious, as it will be probably my last purchase from a UK manufacturer before trade disruptions and price hikes kick in, at least until the dust settles down.
I'm kinda hoping that the economic disarray Brexit causes results in LOWER international prices.
I can imagine the pound getting pounded so to speak for a while, but GW being GW won't update their pricing abroad, it'll just be cheaper to order from the UK.
Which you will need to use reshipper seeing gw will forbid uk stores selling to eu once eu law preventing goes away.
BrianDavion wrote: or maybe GW realizes cultists in CSM are a horriable idea and gets rid of them only to intorduce a L&D codex
Oh please. Like GW would remove a thematic and intrinsic part of the Chaos Space Marine line to turn it... into... another... army...
Spoiler:
... oh...
I just think cultists are wrong for codex CSMs for the same reason scouts being troops for LSMs where problematic
Heaven forbid gw having to do work like professionals so both options are valid. Nooo! Let's not make things balanced and instead artificial limitations to bandaid thing like whole rule of 3 that was bad bandaid just so developers don't have to actually balance game. End result: 40k is unbalanced mess. That's what people glamouring for artificial restrictions like scouts in elite WANT.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/10/24 14:13:10
"Hard pressed on my right. My centre is yielding. Impossible to manoeuvre. Situation excellent. I am attacking." - General Ferdinand Foch 
