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So, never? It really takes the cake to think a faction that ranged from OP gak (sixth edition) to mountain of cheese more broken than the arms of Abby the Armless (seventh) to OP cheese gak on steroids (eight, especially getting double turns all the time and models costing less than IG trooper in points while being better than SM) was wOrSt. If you want a faction that naturally attracts thatguys, meta chasers, people who like to stomp newbies, and generally make life of everyone else unpleasant, it's the eldar. Always had been. Pretending they were ever bad and/or underdogs somehow takes more revisionism than Eastasia and Oceania managed to produce together
And yeah, I really like comically stupid "it's just T3" deflection above. Out of the most broken 9th edition armies, DE, Harlequins, Admech, and even the lagging behind Sisters, are all T3. It's almost as if paying as little as possible for defensive statlines made more and more irrelevant by damage inflation was a good, not bad thing...
So, never? It really takes the cake to think a faction that ranged from OP gak (sixth edition) to mountain of cheese more broken than the arms of Abby the Armless (seventh) to OP cheese gak on steroids (eight, especially getting double turns all the time and models costing less than IG trooper in points while being better than SM) was wOrSt. If you want a faction that naturally attracts thatguys, meta chasers, people who like to stomp newbies, and generally make life of everyone else unpleasant, it's the eldar. Always had been. Pretending they were ever bad and/or underdogs somehow takes more revisionism than Eastasia and Oceania managed to produce together
He must be talking about 5th edition. You are perhaps too young to know Eldar went through that edition on a 4th edition codex. Everything was overpriced and inefficient compared to the armies that worked then: leafblower IG, all the SM flavors (wolfy mcwolfs, bloody blood bloods, salamanders), necrons and grey kniggits.
I think everyone likes being a special snowflake - but as said, over any long consideration, Eldar are the 2nd most popular faction after Marines, and have been shaping the meta for the vast majority of the years since their 2nd edition codex was released in 1994.
They were a bit rubbish in the second half of 5th. That was a decade ago.
My best advice is to just ignore all of that, frankly, nonsense. Other people collecting the same army as yourself shouldn't impact your enjoyment in the first place. If it does, I believe that would make you a hipster XD
As for the meta chaser issue, how many people actually make that accusation in real life? I know it's a thing online, but that's easily ignored or countered, if necessary, by showing your old stuff. At the point where people seriously hamper your enjoyment with this, just get rid of them. Block/Ignore them in online spaces and stop engaging with them in real life if they won't stop.
It also might not be a problem in the first place, if GW feths their codex up, which is reasonably likely.
Don't let other people dictate the way you do your hobby.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/04 20:51:44
So, never? It really takes the cake to think a faction that ranged from OP gak (sixth edition) to mountain of cheese more broken than the arms of Abby the Armless (seventh) to OP cheese gak on steroids (eight, especially getting double turns all the time and models costing less than IG trooper in points while being better than SM) was wOrSt. If you want a faction that naturally attracts thatguys, meta chasers, people who like to stomp newbies, and generally make life of everyone else unpleasant, it's the eldar. Always had been. Pretending they were ever bad and/or underdogs somehow takes more revisionism than Eastasia and Oceania managed to produce together
He must be talking about 5th edition. You are perhaps too young to know Eldar went through that edition on a 4th edition codex. Everything was overpriced and inefficient compared to the armies that worked then: leafblower IG, all the SM flavors (wolfy mcwolfs, bloody blood bloods, salamanders), necrons and grey kniggits.
Only because they didn't get an update that edition.
I had a similar thing when they redid the sisters. Lotta people piping up saying they've always loved sisters and been huge fans but never collected them "because cost" even though the plastic models are the same cost as the old metal ones; or "because metal", yeah sure, whatever plastic elitist. Either you like the army and collect it, or you don't.
Eventually you'll stop caring. The legitimate likes of the army will show themselves as they'll stick around and paint their army. The chasers will have grey plastic that they'll dump when the next army gets its update. The vets will be identified by a predominantly metal army.
Don't worry about the chasers; embrace and guide the new generation of eldar players.
ZebioLizard2 wrote:Only because they didn't get an update that edition.
Well, yeah. That's kinda the point OP was making.
Tyel wrote:
Eldar are the 2nd most popular faction after Marines
Do you have any actual data on that or are you just blowing smoke? It seems to me that if Eldar really were the second most popular faction, they wouldn't be languishing with models nearing 30 years old and I would have seen a lot more of them on the tabletop.
They were a bit rubbish in the second half of 5th. That was a decade ago.
It was the whole of 5th edition. They weren't competitive from the start when the SM codex released. It wasn't just the power creep of the necrons and GK that made them that way. They weren't bad, just everything was overpriced in comparison to actual 5th edition armies.
Oh I feel you. I've been playing Death Guard before it was cool. Converted all those marks of Nurgle myself and of course still use my old Plague Marines from 3rd to 7th Edition side by side with the new much larger tentacle guys.
However, since GW turned them into a main faction DG gets much more fluff than before, which is nice.
I always planned to start some Sisters when they were the last metal faction but never got around doing it. With the new plastics I somehow have no desire anymore to start them. I guess sometimes we just want to be the special snowflakes
40k in general is going through a growth spurt, and the OG popular armies will see more excitement with new books than more niche armies, unless that army becomes red hot, power wise. eldar is a weird army, because while it's always gotten a steady stream of updates, it's never gotten a massive update, and since it's a big range, that leaves some real antiques in the collection.
But if your first reaction to your main army getting new models is to lament that others will be collecting them, and you will be less special, then nobody can really help you.
Arschbombe wrote: Do you have any actual data on that or are you just blowing smoke? It seems to me that if Eldar really were the second most popular faction, they wouldn't be languishing with models nearing 30 years old and I would have seen a lot more of them on the tabletop.
Playing games on and off for a reasonable period of time?
Maybe in your corner of the world no one plays Eldar - but in my experience at both FLGS and Tournaments, they were everywhere for 6th through 8th, and that was what, about 8 years?
Unsurprisingly have dipped somewhat over the last 18 months due to being off the pace. But I suspect that is a blip - and many Eldar armies are ready to be dusted off if they get an S-tier codex release in a few months time.
I guess the obvious question is if you don't think its Eldar, who is second?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/05 13:08:22
Anybody else ever get like this? Pre-cursor; big whiny rant ahead
I'm a long time Eldar player. Been in and out of the hobby a couple of times but have always had a soft spot for the space elves.
I've trawled eBay for metal sculpts over the years and made the best of fine cast. I've lived with 20+ year old sculpts for quite some time - and never had an issue with that fact.
I have quite liked being one of the only Eldar players I know because frankly, there are other armies out there than have been updated many times since. Eldar have been left behind.
AND THEN... GW announce a nice new spangly Eldar set and suddenly every man and his dog plans to collect them.
There should be a tax that if you want to start playing Eldar you have to fully paint and play with the old sculpts first
In all seriousness now... I guess what I don't want, more than anything, is to be thought of as a meta chaser because I have the 'in' army.
Hate the idea of people assuming I only play my beloved Craftworld minis because they're new or top tier (assuming they will be).
I've played them at their worst and hopefully look forward to also playing them at their best, but I have to be honest, if Craftworld players start popping up everywhere, I won't want to be among them. I'll end up packing them away until the hype wears off.
What kind of person does that make me? I know it's super salty of me, and I don't want to feel like that... I know i'm being daft! But If i'm being honest, I have to admit, it will bug me a bit.
Here's hoping that everybody gets too persuaded by the new T'au Rail Gun instead...
You are walking into a rather unique problem. Eldar are officially the oldest model line and now with a new kit you are definitely going to see a lot of new Eldar players. I mean hell, I used to go to tournaments 16-30 people and I would be the ONLY Ork player. Last one I went to was 18 strong and we had not 1, not 2 but 4 Ork players.
The big difference is that Eldar have gone through entire decades of being OP and as such have a rather large base of players who "Love the faction" so you tend to get a lot less love then other factions in regards to moaning but if you are being honest and you are an OG of the eldar...just let it roll off your back. Some people just get happy when other people get mad, don't let them get to you If you have an old army, rock it with pride bud.
So, never? It really takes the cake to think a faction that ranged from OP gak (sixth edition) to mountain of cheese more broken than the arms of Abby the Armless (seventh) to OP cheese gak on steroids (eight, especially getting double turns all the time and models costing less than IG trooper in points while being better than SM) was wOrSt. If you want a faction that naturally attracts thatguys, meta chasers, people who like to stomp newbies, and generally make life of everyone else unpleasant, it's the eldar. Always had been. Pretending they were ever bad and/or underdogs somehow takes more revisionism than Eastasia and Oceania managed to produce together
And yeah, I really like comically stupid "it's just T3" deflection above. Out of the most broken 9th edition armies, DE, Harlequins, Admech, and even the lagging behind Sisters, are all T3. It's almost as if paying as little as possible for defensive statlines made more and more irrelevant by damage inflation was a good, not bad thing...
Judging from your choice of words you must have played against the epitome of garbage people in your store. Don´t do that. Play with friends at home.
I don't care what others say anymore I'm too old for that now. I've played them when they were good and not so good and I don't care for result I just want to get my models used.
If people want to go eldar due to the new models then great. Once said meta chasers are gone then I'll hoover up the cheap e-bay deals.
When they dump them on e-bay, they’ll be much cheaper then.
I’m just miffed that it took them so damn long to finally get around to addressing the Eldar models at all. I’ve got enough existing models now that it’s silly to rebuy them at the absurd prices they will be.
And as for Tau, I never stopped using my hammerhead in the games I played.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/05 15:55:13
Don't worry about it. If your army looks cool/thematic enough, no player will think you are just chasing FOTM. And even if they are, flock what they think anyways. It's a game of toy soldiers FFS
"The larger point though, is that as players, we have more control over what the game looks and feels like than most of us are willing to use in order to solve our own problems"
The only thing I'm bitter about is they've started this out with plastic guardians. Plastic Guardians were like the last new kit Eldar got.
And who needs more Guardians anyway? Doesn't everyone have enough lead Guardians from 30 years ago like me?
"'players must agree how they are going to select their armies, and if any restrictions apply to the number and type of models they can use."
This is an actual rule in the actual rulebook. Quit whining about how you can imagine someone's army touching you in a bad place and play by the actual rules.
Freelance Ontologist
When people ask, "What's the point in understanding everything?" they've just disqualified themselves from using questions and should disappear in a puff of paradox. But they don't understand and just continue existing, which are also their only two strategies for life.
Gert wrote: And here's me thinking that a Craftworlds range refresh would make Eldar players happy.
I'm disappointed but not surprised.
The only thing right now that 99% of Eldar players are unhappy about is the lack of release date Really, this is the most annoying thing with the Rountree's GW - having to wait an unspecified amount of time between the rumour/sneak peek/preview and the preorder. This was actually done better in the past, when models just showed up in WD and on the shelves pretty much at the same time. We already know there is an Avatar remake, we already know there is Maugan, we saw new Guardians, Rangers on foot and on bikes, the new Autarch and we want to buy them right this instant
Oh, no - it was not done “better in the past” with last-minute drops. I joined Dakka because GW was so tight-lipped with its release schedule, whereas my main hobby (D&D) had a catalog that told what was coming out for the next 12 months at a time.
If anything, the uncertainty of shipping right now makes it difficult, if not impossible to tack on a release date at this time. I don’t want them to stop showing us what’s coming down the pipe - I want to see more of what they’re working on, out to 12 months or more, if I could!
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/05 22:03:55
Crafter91 wrote: Anybody else ever get like this? Pre-cursor; big whiny rant ahead
I'm a long time Eldar player. Been in and out of the hobby a couple of times but have always had a soft spot for the space elves.
I've trawled eBay for metal sculpts over the years and made the best of fine cast. I've lived with 20+ year old sculpts for quite some time - and never had an issue with that fact.
I have quite liked being one of the only Eldar players I know because frankly, there are other armies out there than have been updated many times since. Eldar have been left behind.
AND THEN... GW announce a nice new spangly Eldar set and suddenly every man and his dog plans to collect them.
There should be a tax that if you want to start playing Eldar you have to fully paint and play with the old sculpts first
In all seriousness now... I guess what I don't want, more than anything, is to be thought of as a meta chaser because I have the 'in' army.
Hate the idea of people assuming I only play my beloved Craftworld minis because they're new or top tier (assuming they will be).
I've played them at their worst and hopefully look forward to also playing them at their best, but I have to be honest, if Craftworld players start popping up everywhere, I won't want to be among them. I'll end up packing them away until the hype wears off.
What kind of person does that make me? I know it's super salty of me, and I don't want to feel like that... I know i'm being daft! But If i'm being honest, I have to admit, it will bug me a bit.
Here's hoping that everybody gets too persuaded by the new T'au Rail Gun instead...
Well I have been an eldar player for over twenty years, I played them in the brightest and darkest moments, I played them despite the fact that the miniatures were dated, now that new models will come out that I have been waiting for a lifetime I can only be happy .
I honestly can't care less about what other players might tell me, if you have been playing eldar for years you should know that we are hated and envied: D
Then even if one decides to start them now that the codex comes out with brand new miniatures, I don't see anything wrong with it, they will be very cool puppets it is normal that they will attract many new players, what is the problem?
Crafter91 wrote: Anybody else ever get like this? Pre-cursor; big whiny rant ahead
I'm a long time Eldar player. Been in and out of the hobby a couple of times but have always had a soft spot for the space elves.
I've trawled eBay for metal sculpts over the years and made the best of fine cast. I've lived with 20+ year old sculpts for quite some time - and never had an issue with that fact.
I have quite liked being one of the only Eldar players I know because frankly, there are other armies out there than have been updated many times since. Eldar have been left behind.
AND THEN... GW announce a nice new spangly Eldar set and suddenly every man and his dog plans to collect them.
There should be a tax that if you want to start playing Eldar you have to fully paint and play with the old sculpts first
In all seriousness now... I guess what I don't want, more than anything, is to be thought of as a meta chaser because I have the 'in' army.
Hate the idea of people assuming I only play my beloved Craftworld minis because they're new or top tier (assuming they will be).
I've played them at their worst and hopefully look forward to also playing them at their best, but I have to be honest, if Craftworld players start popping up everywhere, I won't want to be among them. I'll end up packing them away until the hype wears off.
What kind of person does that make me? I know it's super salty of me, and I don't want to feel like that... I know i'm being daft! But If i'm being honest, I have to admit, it will bug me a bit.
Here's hoping that everybody gets too persuaded by the new T'au Rail Gun instead...
Eldar is already one of, if not the most popular Xenos army, you are just in a small bubble of non Eldar players, or many of them are just waiting for new units and rules (many players are tired of Finecast crappy units). Who cares what people assume about you, if you are in a local and everyone knows you why would they think you jump onto them?
It makes you a bitter salty player that wants to gatekeep others from having fun.
In all seriousness now... I guess what I don't want, more than anything, is to be thought of as a meta chaser because I have the 'in' army.
News flash: Eldar have been top tier in almost every edition of the game.
YOU ARE THAT GUY. You always were that guy. Those Tau players everyone hated in 6th? You're them, only WORSE. Everyone hates you, they have hated you forever, and will hate you until the sun dies out, because you are an Eldar player, your army is unfair and an enemy to balance and fun. Even worse, your 20+ year old models look better than most modern sculpts and the modern Eldar sculpts will build on that genius and make your army look even better than ever. You and people like you complain about having to use ancient gorgeous metal models with awesome statlines that make other players weep with jealousy. You have no idea what it is to be trash tier and lose every game because the game designers don't give a toss about your faction, because there's always somebody at GW who is squee-ing over the Eldar range. And who can blame them, the range is gorgeous.
The sole complaint that you could make is that way, way back in the day that the metal Eldar War Walker was an affront to sanity because it could not be built without employing pacts with dark gods to get the damn thing to go together or stay together even with pins and the best adhesives money could buy. But GW fixed that, made beautiful plastic war walkers and even sold the things in boxes of three, because only Eldar players get nice things.
You're BITTER? Buddy, you don't know bitter. You don't even have taste buds capable of tasting bitter. Bitter is a fantasy you cannot even conceive of, you have lived a life of sunshine and roses and puppies. You are the chosen son, the favored child, the glorious golden boy and you don't even know it. Those people you're worried about? DON'T. They will buy the new Eldar, and then realize that their painting skills are not good enough for such glorious models and they were only making excuses for not buying metal/finecast models to cover their inherent insecurity over painting such beauty. You will buy their stuff for cheap a year or two later after they give up and post them on eBay, where your your decade of eBay experience awaits them. You will win again because that's all you've ever done, is win.
So shed your perfect glorious tears somewhere else, nobody wants to hear it. You're not a meta chaser, the META CHASES YOU.
I love this
I'm looking forward to the new stuff but I've already got my fully painted Biel-Tan Aspect Warrior Army which I'm very happy with. I don't plan to buy anything other than characters or brand new units (really looking forward to the new Avatar of Khaine).
The main thing putting me off the new stuff is the different scale between the old and new line.
As for new players starting to collect Eldar, who cares. I've ran my Eldar the same way since 3rd and it's never been particularly competitive (1 of every Aspect Warrior Unit + Transports + Characters) nobody's ever accused me of chasing the meta.
Space Wolves - Alpha Legion - Biel-Tan - Reikland - Lizardmen of Hexoatl - Slaaneshi Daemons
AngryAngel80 wrote: I don't know, when I see awesome rules, I'm like " Baby, your rules looking so fine. Maybe I gotta add you to my first strike battalion eh ? "
In all seriousness now... I guess what I don't want, more than anything, is to be thought of as a meta chaser because I have the 'in' army.
News flash: Eldar have been top tier in almost every edition of the game.
YOU ARE THAT GUY. You always were that guy. Those Tau players everyone hated in 6th? You're them, only WORSE. Everyone hates you, they have hated you forever, and will hate you until the sun dies out, because you are an Eldar player, your army is unfair and an enemy to balance and fun. Even worse, your 20+ year old models look better than most modern sculpts and the modern Eldar sculpts will build on that genius and make your army look even better than ever. You and people like you complain about having to use ancient gorgeous metal models with awesome statlines that make other players weep with jealousy. You have no idea what it is to be trash tier and lose every game because the game designers don't give a toss about your faction, because there's always somebody at GW who is squee-ing over the Eldar range. And who can blame them, the range is gorgeous.
The sole complaint that you could make is that way, way back in the day that the metal Eldar War Walker was an affront to sanity because it could not be built without employing pacts with dark gods to get the damn thing to go together or stay together even with pins and the best adhesives money could buy. But GW fixed that, made beautiful plastic war walkers and even sold the things in boxes of three, because only Eldar players get nice things.
You're BITTER? Buddy, you don't know bitter. You don't even have taste buds capable of tasting bitter. Bitter is a fantasy you cannot even conceive of, you have lived a life of sunshine and roses and puppies. You are the chosen son, the favored child, the glorious golden boy and you don't even know it. Those people you're worried about? DON'T. They will buy the new Eldar, and then realize that their painting skills are not good enough for such glorious models and they were only making excuses for not buying metal/finecast models to cover their inherent insecurity over painting such beauty. You will buy their stuff for cheap a year or two later after they give up and post them on eBay, where your your decade of eBay experience awaits them. You will win again because that's all you've ever done, is win.
So shed your perfect glorious tears somewhere else, nobody wants to hear it. You're not a meta chaser, the META CHASES YOU.
This is a really funny post and I thank you for making it. Have an exalt.
To the OP; I don't really understand your mindset, just play the models you like with the faction you like. People worth playing with won't hate you for playing eldar, they'll only hate you if they think you're a dick. It would be good for everyone if the eldar release is super successful as it will show GW that it's worth investing in factions besides SM in the way that matters to them, in sales!
a_typical_hero wrote: I imagine I'm not the only one who always wanted to collect Eldar, but didn't because of ancient sculpts.
Being in for the models is better than people who just jump in for the rules, innit?
I was this....15 years ago when I started playing 40k, lol
Theyre still the same sculpts XD
"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"
"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"
"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"
"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"
Maybe in your corner of the world no one plays Eldar -
Not no one, but not nearly in the numbers in your corner apparently.
I guess the obvious question is if you don't think its Eldar, who is second?
Great question. I never thought about it before. In my mind there are marines as a clear number 1 and then there is everybody else. Which is why I asked if you had data that would show Eldar as second. Because that would be very interesting.
If Eldar are second overall why have they languished with some of the oldest models in metal and then finecast for so long? We often hear that marines are the most supported because they sell the most and it is often pointed out that one of the reasons they sell the most is that they get the most support in kits and codices. Why wouldn't the same thing apply to Eldar if they are the second most popular faction?
Anyway, how would we even begin to determine who is second? What are the criteria? Is it gross sales? Tournament participation? Who counts as an Eldar player? Does it have to be someone whose main army is Eldar or anybody who ever used an Eldar detachment as part of a different army?
I went looking for some data as a starting point for discussion. I found 40kstats.com has a faction breakdown report of 4426 lists. It appears to be from 8th edition. Obviously it's not a complete and definitive source. Lots of caveats: tournament data, previous edition, voluntary submission etc.
Their breakdown of lists shows SM in 849 total lists split between 9 chapters and Deathwatch (GK is another 243 lists). In 834 of those lists the SM were the primary faction. Eldar were in just 128 lists total and 91 lists where they were the primary faction. There were 5 Ynnari lists. Harlequins were in 93 lists with 69 as primary.
In this dataset the most popular single faction after all the marines was Dark Eldar with 355 total lists, 343 of which included them as the primary faction. They were followed by Death Guard at 324 (296), Orks at 286 (286) and Necrons at 255 (255).
I am not sure that we can use this information as representative of global 40k army popularity, but I think it's worth looking at.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/06 15:09:41
Maybe in your corner of the world no one plays Eldar -
Not no one, but not nearly in the numbers in your corner apparently.
I guess the obvious question is if you don't think its Eldar, who is second?
Great question. I never thought about it before. In my mind there are marines as a clear number 1 and then there is everybody else. Which is why I asked if you had data that would show Eldar as second. Because that would be very interesting.
If Eldar are second overall why have they languished with some of the oldest models in metal and then finecast for so long? We often hear that marines are the most supported because they sell the most and it is often pointed out that one of the reasons they sell the most is that they get the most support in kits and codices. Why wouldn't the same thing apply to Eldar if they are the second most popular faction?
Anyway, how would we even begin to determine who is second? What are the criteria? Is it gross sales? Tournament participation? Who counts as an Eldar player? Does it have to be someone whose main army is Eldar or anybody who ever used an Eldar detachment as part of a different army?
I went looking for some data as a starting point for discussion. I found 40kstats.com has a faction breakdown report of 4426 lists. It appears to be from 8th edition. Obviously it's not a complete and definitive source. Lots of caveats: tournament data, previous edition, voluntary submission etc.
Their breakdown of lists shows SM in 849 total lists split between 9 chapters and Deathwatch (GK is another 243 lists). In 834 of those lists the SM were the primary faction. Eldar were in just 128 lists total and 91 lists where they were the primary faction. There were 5 Ynnari lists. Harlequins were in 93 lists with 69 as primary.
In this dataset the most popular single faction after all the marines was Dark Eldar with 355 total lists, 343 of which included them as the primary faction. They were followed by Death Guard at 324 (296), Orks at 286 (286) and Necrons at 255 (255).
I am not sure that we can use this information as representative of global 40k army popularity, but I think it's worth looking at.
If you treat SM as a single faction divided between 9 chapters, then it is only fair to treat Eldar flavours the same. It is then 581 lists total, divided among all Eldar flavours, which, especially since Ynnari, are officially combined into one meta-faction. So a clear second.
The reason why their line is so dated IMHO is because of how good 2nd ed concepts were. Just look at how ugly and short lived 3rd ed sculpts were and how 4th ed sculpts are a return to 2nd ed overall design cues. No one in GW except for Jes Goodwin seems to understand how to design them and I wouldn't be surprised if there was a long line of rejected designs in GW archives. SM design is easy - just take a basic "skeleton" and slap the same, common elements in different places and configurations and you can design 100 Primaris Lt in no time. Designing different Aspects is more akin to designing Chaos Marines of various gods than different chapters of SMs, other than maybe Wolfy Wolfs. DAs? Just slap some robes onto PA, change the pauldrons and call it a day. Chapter upgrade kits are a thing exactly because of how similar various chapters are. Even the newest BT are a mashup of DA, BA and some vanilla design snippets. This of course does not mean, that SM range is bad and is a bit of an oversimplification, just wanted to point out that with digital repository of elements you can design new models and chapters relatively fast. With Aspects you have to design distinctive look for a single unit and a single character and you won't be able to reuse it for anything else. Wraith constructs and guardian equipment has a clear, common look. Howling Banshees vs Dark Reapers is like PA marines vs Terminator marines - almost no shared elements. HBs, Hawks and Guardians at least have the same light armour, but other aspects need one-and-done approach to entire miniature.
I'm happy to say CWE are not the 2nd most played faction in 9th. I'm not sure they are the 10th most played faction. This is because CWE have been quite bad since 9th dropped. And while it may not appear so much in garagehammer, it undoubtedly impacts tournaments, and I think (with some lag) FLGS players. Because no one likes turning up and just losing every week.
So you can see with Goonhammer how factions have become far more common in 9th as their power has waxed and waned. They get this data from things like the ITC Battle App.
But it works both ways. Eldar were the best faction in 7th, by some distance. They were generally valid throughout 8th - with Ynnari, Alaitoc Flyer Spam and other things even as Marine dominance went supernova. Wave Serpents were tediously abusive in 6th. This long run of dominance is why - at least in my experience - they were the second most played faction after Marines. But hard data is hard to come by. I think for instance they were the 2nd most popular faction in the 2020 LVO, +/- with CSM (soup sort of confuses these counts). But that was when a frankly ludicrous number of players ran Marines. I'm not sure what the dataset of 2019 looked like - I can't immediately find it.
If you treat SM as a single faction divided between 9 chapters, then it is only fair to treat Eldar flavours the same. It is then 581 lists total, divided among all Eldar flavours, which, especially since Ynnari, are officially combined into one meta-faction. So a clear second.
How else are you supposed to look at the SM? If you keep them separate, then they aren't even number 1. Dark Eldar are. Still if we're going to group factions then Chaos Marines get the second spot with 699 total lists combining CSM proper, TS, and DG. In any case, I thought we were talking about CWE which is what I think most people mean when they say Eldar.
The reason why their line is so dated IMHO is because of how good 2nd ed concepts were. Just look at how ugly and short lived 3rd ed sculpts were and how 4th ed sculpts are a return to 2nd ed overall design cues. No one in GW except for Jes Goodwin seems to understand how to design them and I wouldn't be surprised if there was a long line of rejected designs in GW archives.
That's a new and different take at least. 4th edition Banshees and Fire Dragons were sculpted by Juan Diaz. So Jes isn't the only one who could pull off a good Eldar sculpt. The current plastic Banshees are very close to the 4th edition Diaz sculpts so I don't see how updating the aspects to plastic is totally dependent on Jes.
SM design is easy - just take a basic "skeleton" and slap the same, common elements in different places and configurations and you can design 100 Primaris Lt in no time. Designing different Aspects is more akin to designing Chaos Marines of various gods than different chapters of SMs, other than maybe Wolfy Wolfs. DAs? Just slap some robes onto PA, change the pauldrons and call it a day. Chapter upgrade kits are a thing exactly because of how similar various chapters are. Even the newest BT are a mashup of DA, BA and some vanilla design snippets. This of course does not mean, that SM range is bad and is a bit of an oversimplification, just wanted to point out that with digital repository of elements you can design new models and chapters relatively fast. With Aspects you have to design distinctive look for a single unit and a single character and you won't be able to reuse it for anything else. Wraith constructs and guardian equipment has a clear, common look. Howling Banshees vs Dark Reapers is like PA marines vs Terminator marines - almost no shared elements. HBs, Hawks and Guardians at least have the same light armour, but other aspects need one-and-done approach to entire miniature.
So it's too hard? Is that it? Maybe it's really sabotage. Eldar are so close to marines that one solid release could put them over the top and we can't have space faeries as the poster children....
I think you hint at the real reason in there. Plastic aspects are not going to be huge sellers because of how they work in an army. You don't spam them, generally, because of their specialized nature. So their demand is inherently self-limiting and therefore less profitable. That would explain why wraithguard got plastics before any of them. The Iyanden supplement in 6th let you use them as troops so buying multiple boxes made sense. And probably also because they were cost prohibitive in metal before that.
I think you hint at the real reason in there. Plastic aspects are not going to be huge sellers because of how they work in an army. You don't spam them, generally, because of their specialized nature. So their demand is inherently self-limiting and therefore less profitable.
I tend to agree with this point, and you can look at Howling Banshees and Dire Avengers to see how 'popular' plastic Aspect Warriors have been so far (though the stupid prices don't help, GW).
OTOH I think Fire Dragons, Warp Spiders, Dark Reapers and maybe even Swooping Hawks (aka Tipping Hawks) would be a lot more popular if they were in plastic because of the roles they have in an Eldar army. And Eldar Rangers in plastic...holy smokes those should sell like hotcakes. Like three squads per Eldar player minimum.
I remember back in 5th when me and a friend were toying with the idea of a 5x10 Fire Dragon Army (led by Feugan and riding around in Wave Serpents) that would have been hilarious but building 50 (metal) Fire Dragons was seriously off-putting.
DarknessEternal wrote: The only thing I'm bitter about is they've started this out with plastic guardians. Plastic Guardians were like the last new kit Eldar got.
And who needs more Guardians anyway? Doesn't everyone have enough lead Guardians from 30 years ago like me?
Those who started the hobby since 8th or 9th edition, or want to start now, and avoided eldar because of their dated models, maybe?
Many hobbists love updated models as well, even if they don't need them gamewise.
It really takes the cake to think a faction that ranged from 
but if you are being honest and you are an OG of the eldar...just let it roll off your back. Some people just get happy when other people get mad, don't let them get to you 
15k+
Emperor's Spears 2500
Beastmen 10k
Eldar- 4436 pts
