Love the model. Loathe the rules.

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**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

ccs wrote:
lord_blackfang wrote:
I nominate all of 40k

But Flyers is a good one as it is and will be true in every edition, you simply can't write functional rules for something moving supersonic above an area the size of a soccer field.

And yet FW did write functional flyer rules back in 4th(? think it was 4th).....

True, but those rules barely required a model. So I think I’d still have them as Love Models, Loathed Rules.

Now. Full scale Aeronautica is a game I’d always get behind, regardless that most would struggle to arrange a big enough playing space!

**Amishprn86**

vipoid wrote:
Necron Destroyer Lords (or Lokhust Lords or whatever stupid name they're going by these days) certainly come to mind.

The advantages they once boasted have gradually been whittled away, to the point where there's really no role they fulfil that isn't fulfilled better by other units. Even their trademark speed has been reduced to a pathetic 8".

Imagine if you bought a Bike for a SM Captain just to upgrade his speed from 6" to 9". Oh and the bike comes with no weapons. And his aura is replaced with one that only works on biker units. And he gets -1WS and -1BS. And a bunch of stratagems no longer work on him. etc. etc.

Then there's Dark Eldar. The entire HQ section, sans Drazhar, suffers from this. All have great models (or at least had great models at some point, until they were "upgraded" with newer ones), but their rules are universally awful. Take the Archon - each one is a tactical mastermind with access to a personal armoury of the best possible equipment. This is represented by a choice of butter knives and two different water pistols, complimented by a bog-standard aura that doesn't even work in the transports that form the core of the faction. Then you have stuff like Lelith being a master duellist, whose abilities are best suited to fighting hordes. Sigh.

There's also Scourges, which have fantastic models but can't escape the fact that, in true GW style, they're mobile models touting a selection of weapons that all demand they remain stationary.

Mandrakes have models that (IMO at least) hold up exceptionally well, given their age. However, while they're currently useful for scoring some secondary objectives, they've never really managed to capture the fluff of being terrifying assassins that appear from an opponent's shadow. At most they tend to appear far away from any shadows and then sort of faff about for the rest of the game.

Lastly, Beasts. Cool concepts (price tags notwithstanding) but always come across like half their rules are missing. Oh, and on top of being generally bad, you also need a 40pt babysitter if you want to include them at all.

Yep Beasts... their rules are terrible. I used to run Beast/stars in 5th and 7th, at least in 8th Ynnari buffed them. Now they are just used as objective grabbers like Stranglehold but with that rumored to go away it is pointless to even take them now.

**aphyon**

Primaris marines...they look like an attempt at true scale MK IV maximus armor. i like maximus armor, i own quite a few of the heresy MK IV minis from FW, everything else about primaris i hate. had they just released 8th ed and said here is the new mark of space marine armor (we can copywrite) and just replaced tacs, devs, assaults etc. with the new model i would have been cool with it, the story retcon and turning primaris into pseudo aspect warriors, not so hot on. and that is not even mentioning the way the game has become a dumpster fire in my book with the current edition.

**Tyel**

Possibly a very specific one - but I love the Heavy Blight Launcher Bloat Drone.

Shame it sucks, but there we go.

**Unit1126PLL**

Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
ccs wrote:
lord_blackfang wrote:
I nominate all of 40k

But Flyers is a good one as it is and will be true in every edition, you simply can't write functional rules for something moving supersonic above an area the size of a soccer field.

And yet FW did write functional flyer rules back in 4th(? think it was 4th).....

True, but those rules barely required a model. So I think I’d still have them as Love Models, Loathed Rules.

Now. Full scale Aeronautica is a game I’d always get behind, regardless that most would struggle to arrange a big enough playing space!

I mean with Flyers, the FW rules are the best you are going to get, unfortunately. You needed the model pretty much for aesthetic purposes only, true, because it zipped on, blasted away (and was blasted in return), and then zoomed away.

What more can you expect from a fighter on a football field sized battle?

**NoiseMarine with Tinnitus**

Fabius Bile for me. He brings nice buffs, granted, but other than that...considering his place in lore...brings almost nothing to the table as a Chaos Lord.

**ZergSmasher**

Another one I could mention: Cypher. His recent model (well not that recent anymore, is it?) is absolutely gorgeous, but his rules, and indeed the rules for the Fallen in general, are utter crap. I would hope that whenever the CSM codex drops Fallen are given some better rules, but I'm expecting them to be dropped completely and possibly moved to Legends or something.

**Just Tony**

40K from about midway through 5th Ed. on...

**Aelyn**

Knight Castellan / Tyrant. For me it marks the point where Knights stop being big walkers and start being small titans - mainly because it's bristling with guns but doesn't look too busy.

However, it's just a tad too expensive to justify in most cases. It's almost too large to be used as an ally (generally a smaller knight feels like a better call there), but it's also held back by the CP refund rules, which make it difficult to fit into a pure Knight army.

I want to like it and use it, I really do, but it's extremely difficult to use in anything less than 2.5K without it feeling shoehorned in.

**Blndmage**

The old Monolith!

**G00fySmiley**

I love the ork mega-dred and meka-dred, have 3 of each. I also love the gargantun squigoth and regular squigoths because ork dinosaurs are awesome. have 2 gargantun ones and 5 regulars. painted all up and love how they look... on the shelf. they have never had good rules and are basically points sinks

**Insectum7**

Blndmage wrote:
The old Monolith!

T'was glorious in its day.

It's still very strange to me that the new model is actually smaller too.

**ArcaneHorror**

Fergie0044 wrote:
Thankfully the 9th edition DG codex has only one entry for this; the Noxious Blightbringer. I think we can all agree its a gorgeous model, with rules that give it no clear purpose instead having 2 or 3 incredibly minor buffs that would all want to be applied in different situations.
Instead he needs to be the DG version of a chaplain, ringing out different tunes on his bell to provide debuffs to nearby enemy units.

I was going to mention this as well. The model is awesome, and his actual power in the lore is quite horrifying from what we saw in Dark Imperium. But on the table, he's just not worth it most of the time. I will say, he could have a use in a Terminus Est list as a way to get units up from the edge of the board. Also, his usefulness could go up greatly if the the Death Guard possessed get some of the abilities of the new CSM possessed. It would be great if his bell increased the movement of all units within six inches, not just one. That might almost make him an auto-include.

**Sunny Side Up**

Space Marine Centurions.

Love the models. Made me finally give in and play Mareenz.

But they really gutted the rules for my poor boys.

**Us3Less**

Sisters of Battle Imagifier. I've really liked the model since it was first shown. The rules in 8th were good and I used it a fair amount. Now it just stands in my display cabinet... damn it sucks a lot in the 9th edition codex :(.

**Sureshot05**

Deathstrike is definitely top of the list. It's such a disappointing setof rules, both in the delay to firing and the rubbish damage it does after firing.
And yes, flyers are also poor, but I would put necron flyers top of the list for being so utterly disappointing.
Last on my list was be termagaunt swarms. I they should be weaker and cheaper.

**Mad Doc Grotsnik**

Chaos Terminators.

I keep seeing them in the CSM previews, and they’re just so bloody cool looking. A definite feel of menace Loyalist terminators are largely missing.

But Terminators rules wise just haven’t tickled my pickle since 2nd Ed ended. They used to be a worrying, if not outright terrifying prospect to face.