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2024/05/28 18:20:11
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
oh sweet, then I am good to bring those armigers I am painting. awesome!
and, I got the go ahead for using liber panoptica, the fan supplement / FAQ, so my list just grew exponentially with skitarii and cult mechanicus stuff. Pretty excited to try it all out!
413th Lucius Exterminaton Legion- 4,000pts
Atalurnos Fleetbreaker's Akhelian Corps- 2500pts
2024/05/28 18:59:03
Subject: Re:Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
Kothra wrote: It's all a bit confusing but after looking through the Liber and the Rules Commentary, it sure looks to me like the Archimandrite only applies to the "Allied Detachment."
If you are including the Maniple or Household detachments in addition to a primary detachment they aren't "Allied Detachments" and so don't need the Archimandrite.
From the Rules Commentary:
A Mechanicum army cannot include an Allied Detachment from any of the other Mechanicum Army Lists as these are not separate Factions or Sub-factions (with reference to the Divisio Tactica – these Detachments are ‘additional’ or ‘optional’ Detachments not an ‘Allied’ Detachments and can be included in any army, however any limitations on total points values of Lords of War units still apply unless another rule states otherwise).
I don't play 2nd edition but that's clearly stating that you cant ally Mechanicum with Mechanicum.
Divisio Tactica army lists count as having the Mechanicum faction for the purposes of levels of allegiance
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-px27tzAtVwZpZ4ljopV2w "ashtrays and teacups do not count as cover"
"jack of all trades, master of none; certainly better than a master of one"
The Ordo Reductor - the guy's who make wonderful things like the Landraider Achillies, but can't use them in battle..
2024/05/29 13:46:12
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
Well, either way it is just a small change for the list , so it's not a big deal either way to me. I just want to use them like robots in all honesty, run up and cut things
413th Lucius Exterminaton Legion- 4,000pts
Atalurnos Fleetbreaker's Akhelian Corps- 2500pts
2024/05/31 08:25:41
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
I'm looking at getting into Mechanicum and need advice on several things. (I have only played marines.)
This army looks like it plays very differently than what I'm used to. Marines are easy to see great units such as large lascannon or volkite squads to throw tons of dice.
AD MECH have a lot of low model count expensive squads. This is where it becomes very easy to make mistakes. All of it looks... useful, but I don't see where things really shine except:
Lots of Battlesmith
Karacnos 7" templates
Cheap tarpit techtralls
You can put autonima in here but they don't seem very good at shooting with BS 3, don't have volume of shots and limited weapon options.
What am I missing?
Thank you!
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2024/05/31 08:28:41
2024/05/31 09:34:44
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
Lots of chaff units, which are cheap in points and are for contesting and holding objectives. And with Feel No Pain are surprisingly resilient.
Thallaxi are your Warrior equivalents. Pretty flexible, plenty tough and able to deep strike. Whack a multi-melta in a squad, then drop in and slag a tank.
The bigger stuff, like Nids, is how you do your damage, and like Dreadnoughts have real staying power.
There’s also an element of Classical Undead, where you need to use your characters to enhance your units, and repair your Automata.
Fed up of Scalpers? But still want your Exclusives? Why not join us?
The automata are actually very good with the right support. You play around your bots with your HQ / Elite Magi. It's as Mad doc has pointed out like the WHFB Vampire counts that also relied on their characters.
An archimandrit f.e. grants increased options to the battlesmith rule, f.e. the targeted unit can use the models BS, combine that with cybertherugical ability to increase the BS of a unit of automatons by one and you can get BS 6 automatons.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
2024/05/31 14:56:44
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
The unit I am having trouble with is the ordo reductor tank battery. they seem so expensive for a unit of AV11 tanks, and the guns got nerfed. I love Ordo Reductor lore, so is there any way to make them work?
413th Lucius Exterminaton Legion- 4,000pts
Atalurnos Fleetbreaker's Akhelian Corps- 2500pts
2024/05/31 15:04:51
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
Tiger9gamer wrote: The unit I am having trouble with is the ordo reductor tank battery. they seem so expensive for a unit of AV11 tanks, and the guns got nerfed. I love Ordo Reductor lore, so is there any way to make them work?
Whirlwind seems the nobrainer here or go full melta array with an archimandrit with artifica machina for 12 " melta shenanigans at BS 5`?
Also it should be noted that the scoripus is also only a low AV unit that is marginally cheaper and get's used very often. This is a fair priced effective piece of artillery whilest the scorpious is underpriced by quite a bit.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Kothra wrote: Aren't they indirect fire artillery units?
I guess some of them aren't. It does seem pretty dicey for something that might have to get in close.
it's basically a balanced scorpious that can squad up decently for an accurate points niveau that also can be AA: It's honestly a decent tank that way. Also it's compared to the scorpious mobile since it doesn't need to stand still for it to get AP value on it's admittedly smaller template.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2024/05/31 15:28:57
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
2024/05/31 15:31:02
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
Tiger9gamer wrote: The unit I am having trouble with is the ordo reductor tank battery. they seem so expensive for a unit of AV11 tanks, and the guns got nerfed. I love Ordo Reductor lore, so is there any way to make them work?
Whirlwind seems the nobrainer here or go full melta array with an archimandrit with artifica machina for 12 " melta shenanigans at BS 5`?
Also it should be noted that the scoripus is also only a low AV unit that is marginally cheaper and get's used very often. This is a fair priced effective piece of artillery whilest the scorpious is underpriced by quite a bit.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Kothra wrote: Aren't they indirect fire artillery units?
I guess some of them aren't. It does seem pretty dicey for something that might have to get in close.
it's basically a balanced scorpious that can squad up decently for an accurate points niveau that also can be AA: It's honestly a decent tank that way. Also it's compared to the scorpious mobile since it doesn't need to stand still for it to get AP value on it's admittedly smaller template.
The small blast kinda gets me, but I can see it's use yea! I just question it's effectivity vs, say, a lightning cannon trios or venator trios.
would cannons like the medusa or baskilisk even be worth considering? or is the low AP way too bad?
413th Lucius Exterminaton Legion- 4,000pts
Atalurnos Fleetbreaker's Akhelian Corps- 2500pts
2024/05/31 16:04:36
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
Tiger9gamer wrote: The unit I am having trouble with is the ordo reductor tank battery. they seem so expensive for a unit of AV11 tanks, and the guns got nerfed. I love Ordo Reductor lore, so is there any way to make them work?
Whirlwind seems the nobrainer here or go full melta array with an archimandrit with artifica machina for 12 " melta shenanigans at BS 5`?
Also it should be noted that the scoripus is also only a low AV unit that is marginally cheaper and get's used very often. This is a fair priced effective piece of artillery whilest the scorpious is underpriced by quite a bit.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Kothra wrote: Aren't they indirect fire artillery units?
I guess some of them aren't. It does seem pretty dicey for something that might have to get in close.
it's basically a balanced scorpious that can squad up decently for an accurate points niveau that also can be AA: It's honestly a decent tank that way. Also it's compared to the scorpious mobile since it doesn't need to stand still for it to get AP value on it's admittedly smaller template.
The small blast kinda gets me, but I can see it's use yea! I just question it's effectivity vs, say, a lightning cannon trios or venator trios.
would cannons like the medusa or baskilisk even be worth considering? or is the low AP way too bad?
No. The earthshaker and medusa are not worth considering. Not at 50pts ever. The only time they are remotly worth it are with militia carriages for 75 pts and even here they are wasted HS slots.
Yes, if only to pad out your forces with indirect firepower, but overall for just "power gaming" no. But then again for pure powergaming i expect you'd skip the tanks entirely for more big siege bots.-
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
2024/05/31 17:29:37
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
The rules for HH are safe. None of the books have been replaced and likely won't be for some time.
At most one or two new units might crop up in a new campaign book but the core rules will remain the same.
2024/06/01 09:50:04
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
Tech Auxilia have several models that can perform Battlesmith inside the same unit.
Can each one perform a Battlesmith action in the same turn?
If yes, can each one perform a different action?
Yes. They all can if they meet the stipulatons of battlesmith. No. They all do the Battlesmith action. The result determines if you can pick an option that fits your needs and yes you can mix and match i assume.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Souleater wrote: Would two of the plastic battleforce be a reasonable buy in? I don’t have anything for HH yet, so starting from scratch.
From what I have read the Thralls are basically chaff to block charge lanes and tie stuff up.
Plus I would need at least one HQ.
And is the *Liber Mechanicum* book a safe purchase, or might it get an update when the plastics release?
There may be another book cue Solar auxilia liveguard beeing banished in a diffrent book but normally those rules are available from the download section.
As for the box.. honestly it's an odd one as in regardless seemingly which archetype you go there's a bit of it that is off.
Assuming you go for 2 boxes:
You got 12 Thallax, 4 castellax, 40 Thralls, 2 Triarios.
At best i rekon you'd go with primus Archmagos of the school of lacyraematra which is the undead cyborg shenanigans school of doctrine. Hand him a module and join him in with a large squad of thallax (6 atleast). Next i rekon you should get 1 dominus with machinator harness and artifica cybernetica, which is the babysitter of your 4 castellax which i'd upgrade to either have a MM or a Darkfire cannon.
Which leaves you with two triaros and 40 Thralls. Which i'd split into 2 squads of 20 naturally. For them i'd reccomend a squad of Techpriest auxilia with the lachrimallus upgrade to give them FNP 4+. And another triaros.
Total: 1991 pts. Which is 2/3rds into standard HH 2.0 pts levels which is 3000.
Which would require you to buy Atleast 2 Magi's, convert one into a jumpmodule user, an auxilia techpriest squad (5modells baseline) an additional triarios which i will assume will be quite commonly available.
Or we all just admit that the triarios is the odd unit out and skip it entirely and instead go with a big ball of doom instead and expand for that matter the auxilia techpriests and skip the dominus magos. Which would make the list more "sluggish" but allows for mor thallax and thralls, though you'd probably should have a backup for the unit OR consider Scyllax guardian automatons to keep the Auxilia up and running, which itself can field not inconsiderable ammounts of firepower if you wish to do so.
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2024/06/01 11:28:18
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
2024/06/01 13:09:36
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
Tech Auxilia have several models that can perform Battlesmith inside the same unit.
Can each one perform a Battlesmith action in the same turn?
If yes, can each one perform a different action?
Yes. They all can if they meet the stipulatons of battlesmith.
No. They all do the Battlesmith action. The result determines if you can pick an option that fits your needs and yes you can mix and match i assume.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Souleater wrote: Would two of the plastic battleforce be a reasonable buy in? I don’t have anything for HH yet, so starting from scratch.
From what I have read the Thralls are basically chaff to block charge lanes and tie stuff up.
Plus I would need at least one HQ.
And is the *Liber Mechanicum* book a safe purchase, or might it get an update when the plastics release?
There may be another book cue Solar auxilia liveguard beeing banished in a diffrent book but normally those rules are available from the download section.
As for the box.. honestly it's an odd one as in regardless seemingly which archetype you go there's a bit of it that is off.
Assuming you go for 2 boxes:
You got 12 Thallax, 4 castellax, 40 Thralls, 2 Triarios.
At best i rekon you'd go with primus Archmagos of the school of lacyraematra which is the undead cyborg shenanigans school of doctrine. Hand him a module and join him in with a large squad of thallax (6 atleast). Next i rekon you should get 1 dominus with machinator harness and artifica cybernetica, which is the babysitter of your 4 castellax which i'd upgrade to either have a MM or a Darkfire cannon.
Which leaves you with two triaros and 40 Thralls. Which i'd split into 2 squads of 20 naturally. For them i'd reccomend a squad of Techpriest auxilia with the lachrimallus upgrade to give them FNP 4+. And another triaros.
Total: 1991 pts. Which is 2/3rds into standard HH 2.0 pts levels which is 3000.
Which would require you to buy Atleast 2 Magi's, convert one into a jumpmodule user, an auxilia techpriest squad (5modells baseline) an additional triarios which i will assume will be quite commonly available.
Or we all just admit that the triarios is the odd unit out and skip it entirely and instead go with a big ball of doom instead and expand for that matter the auxilia techpriests and skip the dominus magos. Which would make the list more "sluggish" but allows for mor thallax and thralls, though you'd probably should have a backup for the unit OR consider Scyllax guardian automatons to keep the Auxilia up and running, which itself can field not inconsiderable ammounts of firepower if you wish to do so.
honestly I would just say to use the Trios tanks as the "main squad" and only drop off the thralls as needed, though this is guess work on my part. going to 3k, one could definitely get some myrmidons to fit in the trios, right?
413th Lucius Exterminaton Legion- 4,000pts
Atalurnos Fleetbreaker's Akhelian Corps- 2500pts
2024/06/01 20:42:18
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
Sure. Secutors with twin plasmatorches could be a fun Surprise unit and get a bit more out of the lacyrae cult. Though that list will be vulnerable against horde lists that can field "enough adequate firepower" like solar aux and milita. Also the meaner Space marine legion lists will have a field day, especially those that use nemisisboltguns, scorpious and good legion terminators.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2024/06/01 20:44:20
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
2024/06/01 20:48:37
Subject: Re:Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
Ordo Reductor Artillery Tank Battery [400Pts] . Whirlwind Artillery Tank: Whirlwind Artillery Tank, Whirlwind Artillery Tank, Whirlwind Artillery Tank
Ordo Reductor Artillery Tank Battery [295Pts] . Magna Laser Destroyer Artillery Tank: Magna Laser Destroyer Artillery Tank, Magna Laser Destroyer Artillery Tank
+ Lords of War Have Moved to "Lords of War Detachment" +
Lords of War Have Moved to "Lords of War Detachment"
++ 2. Lord of War Detachment (Mechanicum) ++
+ Expanded Army Lists +
Expanded Army List Profiles:: Exemplary Units On, Legacy Units On
Ordo Reductor Artillery Tank Battery [400Pts] . Whirlwind Artillery Tank: Whirlwind Artillery Tank, Whirlwind Artillery Tank, Whirlwind Artillery Tank
Ordo Reductor Artillery Tank Battery [295Pts] . Magna Laser Destroyer Artillery Tank: Magna Laser Destroyer Artillery Tank, Magna Laser Destroyer Artillery Tank
+ Lords of War Have Moved to "Lords of War Detachment" +
Lords of War Have Moved to "Lords of War Detachment"
++ 2. Lord of War Detachment (Mechanicum) ++
+ Expanded Army Lists +
Expanded Army List Profiles:: Exemplary Units On, Legacy Units On
Forcing myself to take some artillery when there are so many better options, but outside of that how does it look?
IMO, small units of Thralls aren't worth it- they're very squishy so in small amounts they'll be gone in a heart beat. Go big with them unless you're buying them to just get the vehicle. These are scoring units so they need to be hard to kill- a full 30 is still insanely cheap.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2024/06/02 05:53:05
2024/06/02 14:17:33
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
They also have a low leadership though, so unless you want to mitigate that by putting an Archmagos with them (or perhaps in an Astartes list with a Delegatus nearby) then pinning units can turn them into an expensive points sink.
Though guards may sleep and ships may lay at anchor, our foes know full well that big guns never tire.
yea, the resason why I have them seperate is because I don't want a baby sitter for them, I just want to put them behind a ruin or wall while the real things march forward. It seems like they would just run off the table way too easily to invest points into it.
I have a similar set up for my skitarii list I want to try with two squads of ten.
Other than that, how does the list look? are the thallax squads okay? I plan on running the magos in one 6 man squad to aid with his fire power and be annoying to the enemy
413th Lucius Exterminaton Legion- 4,000pts
Atalurnos Fleetbreaker's Akhelian Corps- 2500pts
2024/06/02 20:07:34
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
It looks decent though you may struggle with horde lists fielded by Solar Aux or militia. But against marines if they can't pin you down you may really dismantle them one by one if you manouver correctly.
I would split the laser destroyers though to get more targets and offer less targets as vehicle squadron rules are just bad.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
2024/09/05 09:46:31
Subject: Looking into HH2 mechanicum after a Haitus
Resurrecting the thread since I have my Mechanicum boxed sets and looking at filling out the army.
Myrmidon Destructor and Secutor's. They look good on paper (sorta) but do they perform?
The shooting seems to be handled by the durable/repairable autonoma and the low model count means they're not bringing the volume of shots that make a big difference (even with volkite).
Secutors might be ok as counter assault but that's (once again) iffy due to low model count.
Has anyone made these work, and what Cyberthurgy were you using?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2024/09/05 09:47:14
413th Lucius Exterminaton Legion- 4,000pts 
