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So, I just started playing 40k, I bought the Battleforce, and am seeking to expand my army a bit.

I was thinking my next purchase would be a Tyrant and two Tyrand Guards. My question to you, is: would a Tyrant with a Venom Cannon and Devourers be good? And, if not, what should I do if I'm looking for a Tyrant with guns?

If you are looking for a shooty Tyrant i would recommend only using two TL Devourers. Excellent shooty, strong enough to worry most light to mid level tanks, and is awesome for scything down infantry. Anything else is a waste of points, as other units in the army shoot and kill tanks or infantry better.

You may want to try a prime at the points level you are playing at however, as a tyrant added to a battle force is almost a third of its possible points...a prime is an easier investment. just convert one from a warrior or broodlord.

I would say your next purchase should depend on how much more you plan on spending in the near future. Like the above post said, Hive Tyrants are expensive points wise, and will be out of proportion if the rest of the army is too small. However, if you plan on loading up on more troops (like another battleforce to double everything) then youre going to start reaching hive tyrant points levels.

Be warned though that youre going to need Hive Guard and Zoanthropes in your Elites slots if you want to stand a chance against mechanized armies. Simply playing with the battleforce will leave you with virtually no way to handle tanks. These guys are expensive, being around $20 buck each (when you need atleast 6).

To answer your Hive Tyrant question:

That combination probably isnt the best for a couple of reasons:

-One is long range and potentially anti tank (not great, but it can slow vehicles), while the other is about killing infantry at short range, so there are conflicting roles.
-You can either use two guns a turn, or one gun and one psychic power. Since he comes with two psychic powers (one being absolutely crushing on your opponent), you can see the problem with wasted potential.
-You lose a close combat weapon if you take two guns.

you lose a close combat biomorph, tyranids do not use close combat weapons

More precisely, take Hive Guard *or* Zoanthroapes. And try to supplement that choice in another FoC; taking both in the same list leads to a loss of unit redundancy. Depending on FAQ rulings Mawloc-wise, Lictors *might* be useful...

You can convert Hive Guard up from old Tyrant Guard, or even do *very* extensive Warrior Conversions (Go to town!).

No, take Zoanthropes *AND* Hive Guard. Redundancy does not mean better in a tyranid list. There is no unit that can do everything. There is absolutely no benefit to having 3 of one kind and zero of the other, as both have their own weaknesses.

Take 2 of one and 1 of the other. Which one you decide to double up on is up to you.

Land Raiders come in pairs in many armies. Guess which unit gets focus-fired first if that's your only unit that can reliably kill Raiders...

MagicJuggler wrote:Land Raiders come in pairs in many armies. Guess which unit gets focus-fired first if that's your only unit that can reliably kill Raiders...

not the one in the drop pods that are the only real threat to LR's

So they take *a* Raider out (assuming no issues with cover, Hoods/etc...did you bring Deathleaper, or a backup Zoanthroape unit?). *Then* they're focus-fired.

If I where you and I didn't mind people complaining I'd get a Zoanthrope and convert em into the Doom of Malan'tai. Then do some kinda conversion to get em a Mycetic Spore and for 130-150 pts (depending on spore's gun) you have a model that can drop in and wipe out half his army in one turn if your lucky. And it forces him to target your 3+ invul save guy or you get to do it again next turn.

Magnets are your friend. Your Hive Tyrant can effectively be fielded in several configurations, with or without wings -- including as the Swarmlord if you like -- but you only get that versatility if you magnetise all 4 of his arms.

A web search for "magnetise" and "40k" will turn up loads of how-tos and tutorials.

Basically you want to at least be able to do the following configurations:

Swarmlord
Hive Tyrant with Heavy Venom Cannon, Lash Whip & Bone Sword
Hive Tyrant with 2 sets of twin-linked devourers

and if possible

Hive Tyrant with wings & 2 sets of scything talons (I would incorporate one of them into the wings)

MagicJuggler wrote:Land Raiders come in pairs in many armies. Guess which unit gets focus-fired first if that's your only unit that can reliably kill Raiders...

Cool, armies also come with 10 (fast) transports and hoods, so guess what will happen if you bring only Zoanthropes?

First off, thank you for all the feedback!

I currently have a Tyranid Prime as my HQ (it really was my only choice...) upgraded with a Deathspitter. I'm mostly looking toward the future with my next purchases, as my friends (most of them, anyways) just started up as well, and also purchased battleforces. I was told to get my Tyrant purchase out of the way right after the battleforce, but I am also willing to take other suggestions.

As a side note, it probably should be mentioned that I'm not only into Warhammer for the gameplay, as nerdy as it is, I love the aesthetic appeal of the models, so even though I know it's bad gamewise, but how good a model is is not the only factor that makes it a priority, how awesome looking it is also plays a large part.

Night Lords wrote:

MagicJuggler wrote:Land Raiders come in pairs in many armies. Guess which unit gets focus-fired first if that's your only unit that can reliably kill Raiders...

Cool, armies also come with 10 (fast) transports and hoods, so guess what will happen if you bring only Zoanthropes?

This is not what I am saying. The Elites are Tyranid's most reliable antitank. This does not mean "only" AT. 3 slots vs 11 will lose by attrition whether you go all-out or otherwise, likewise, relying on a solo Zoanthroape unit for dealing with Land Raiders, when a textbook example of such a lists (the Vulkan Redeemer List) takes them in pairs, is wishful thinking; adding AT in the other slots to disable vehicles, or draw fire away/act as backup becomes critical at higher point levels.

MagicJuggler wrote:

Night Lords wrote:

MagicJuggler wrote:Land Raiders come in pairs in many armies. Guess which unit gets focus-fired first if that's your only unit that can reliably kill Raiders...

Cool, armies also come with 10 (fast) transports and hoods, so guess what will happen if you bring only Zoanthropes?

This is not what I am saying. The Elites are Tyranid's most reliable antitank. This does not mean "only" AT. 3 slots vs 11 will lose by attrition whether you go all-out or otherwise, likewise, relying on a solo Zoanthroape unit for dealing with Land Raiders, when a textbook example of such a lists (the Vulkan Redeemer List) takes them in pairs, is wishful thinking; adding AT in the other slots to disable vehicles, or draw fire away/act as backup becomes critical at higher point levels.

And what does this have to do with helping the original poster out with his purchases? The point stands, there should be a healthy mix between Zoanthropes and Hive Guard for elites. If he wants a T-Fex for heavy support that's a whole different issue...but Hive Guard and Zoans always come first (*and*, not *or*)

MagicJuggler wrote:So they take *a* Raider out (assuming no issues with cover, Hoods/etc...did you bring Deathleaper, or a backup Zoanthroape unit?). *Then* they're focus-fired.

Dear god you are right! I should field an army without a single powerful unit so my opponent will be forced to spread his fire evenly! Surely this will save me from the dreaded focus fire!

For original poster:
Why not get ahold of warriors and convert them into hive guard or zoans? (big head or big gun)
It's cheaper, and with clever magneting you can have each be either or both.

I...really don't do converting.

I'm thinking, as I'm looking to spend around ninety dollars with my next purchase, I might buy two Zoes (for use in near games) and the Tyrant (for future games).

Thoughts?

Not a bad idea. In an army building sense, it will give you a fair amount of variety in your firepower.

Like the above posters have said, you need some sort of anti-tank firepower in your list. Whether that comes from Zoanthropes, Hive Guard, Tyrannofexes, or just getting MCs up close and personal as fast as possible, you need some sort of plan.

Of course, there's always the list design where you focus on hordes of smaller, lighter units, and take out everything else in his army so his Land Raider doesn't matter. It's really up to personal preference. I've seen all Genestealer armies do incredibly well... heck with Adrenal Glands they can glance Land Raiders to death.

So I'd go with what looks cool. Personally, I like the look of Hive Guard, and I love Monstrous creatures. I'd build a list around that. Others love Hordes. The Battleforce gives you the basics... now you have to start thinking in the big picture before you start buying.

Write up a few army lists in the 2000 point range. Decide what you like best. Then make your purchases. Don't buy piecemeal or an effective army will be very difficult to assemble... That said, make sure you have SOME anti-tank units. Many swear by Zoanthropes in a mycetic spore. Maybe if you want Zoans you can try and search online how to get one of those? I'd also search for how to convert up a Tervigon, possibly the best unit in the codex (6 wound MC that can score and make more scoring units. O.o)

I'm more into the forces of MCs. I love Hive Guard, but the idea and look of Zoanthropes make them one of my favorites, so I definitely want to go with them.

Well, i personaly run with 3 zoans and 2 hive guard in my lists, solid elite choices because i just don't like lictors (they look cool, and sound cool, but ive never had them work because they can't charge when they arrive and don't reliably kill).

If your playing small games, i think the hive tyrant is a no no for now, he can be a massive point sink aswell as a fire magnet (for him to play, he effectively HAS to have either wings or guards to protect him).

Looking more at the future, trygon prime is made of win Assault 12 Str 6 Lightning barrage!?!? Give him regenerate and he takes a serious pounding to bring down.

The second reason to get a trygon is that using some of the spare spines / gribbly bits on that kit, you can convert up a really nice doom of malan'tai with a spare zoanthrope. Use some of the spare claws on his sides affixed with a little greenstuff to make him look bigger than regular zoans and then go to town giving him a crown of spines / pointy bits all over his head. It's how i made mine and ive never had complaints about using him.