Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hi,

I am playing my friends orks soon and need some suggestions on who to use tips etc.

I have 2 terminator squads, a crusader, Whirl wind, 30 tactical marines, command squad, 5 assault marines, a rhino, dreadnought, And a bunch of landspeeders.

He runs normally ALOT of boys a big nob squad trucks and bikerz and 2 warbosses pain boy and flash gitz plus some grotz.

I play an Iron Hands army so I always use my dreadnought with varying load outs to deal with his numbers.

I make a small gun line out of my tactical squads right outside a choke point I created, in this case flanking him

with your terminators/crusader with the support of a whirl wind can eliminate a good chunk of the board.

Here is the strategy, eliminate a good portion of the board and force his numbers into a smaller area where you

can blast them with template weapons. Then over power the objectives or his warbosses with fire power and use

your assault marines to clean up the rest. Avoid his Waaghs!!! and keep him at arms distance so you can assault them

before it is too late. Landspeeders should be great at harassing him away from you.

hmmm seems like good ideas!

One question would you teleport the termies or one in the crusader and one on foot? also should i take devastators instead of assault marines i have plasma cannons on the devs so they might be better.

Yes, go with the devs, and you don't have to use plasma cannons, I once sent 30 boys to their grave in the first turn with 4 frag missiles.
Plus after your done with them you can switch to krak and take out his 'amour'. I personally love plasma but missles are cheaper if thats
a problem. Don't take a full squad unless your worried he can assault them early in which case you can combat squad them and use the
other five to defend the missile launchers.

I must admit that I have awful luck with deep striking termies so I would march them fearlessly toward the green wall while putting the others in the crusader
and collapsing one of his flanks. But a lot of it depends on how he deploys. Image the look on his face when he places most of his points on one flank
and then you role up with a crusader full of termies with another group deep striking with whirl wind and devs templates flying everywhere...that's a good feeling
I assure you.

I play orks. What you're describing is an 'unfocused' army. All ork armies that are unfocused run into the same problem. Here they are, in no particular order:

Trukks - trukks are all or nothing. If they have 1-2, just shoot them off the board first thing. If you're lucky, they'll go flying into some annoying location, if you're unlucky, they'll go flying at you. Either way, 12 boys breaks as soon as they take a handful of casualties, so just keep shooting them to make them take leadership tests. Either the nob will kill them all with his own bosspole, or they'll break and run off the table.

Nobs are squishy and harmless against the might of terminators. Send the termies into the nobs. The Empire's finest will get cut up. Some will die. All of the nobz will die, FNP is useless, and any Big Choppas or Choppas in the squad doesn't hurt termies in the same way other non-power weapons don't hurt termies.

Flash gits are overpriced and just nobs without power claws. Introduce them to Assault Marines or Terminators, they won't survive the introduction. Alternatively, shoot them off the board. At 35+ per model, they are a fine target for missiles, lasers, and other anti-tank that isn't doing anything.

Warbikers are fast power claws. Get them tied up with one squad of terminators.

On the basis of what you're describing

Nobs mob - get them in CC with Termies. If you avoid getting charged, you're winning that one.

Flash Gitz - shoot them with anti-tank. Landspeeders may or may not have it, dunno the load out. Anything with Strength 8+, to negate FNP (AP 4 or less preferred, but not necessary, as they probably have cover saves).

Bikers - try and ensnare them with the other termies. Alternatively, send the assault marines at them. The marines will die, but they will buy time for the Land Raider to get the termies there.

Trukks - Just shoot em. Assault cannons, Missiles, anything. They'll go away, or get immobilized (that's better).

Boyz - This is where you play keep away. The Gitz, nobz, and Bikers are all high priority. The boys are just ablative wounds (and if they have all that other crap, not many of them).

P.S. If your termies are teleporting in, instead of Land Raiding, this may make it harder to get them to the warbikes. If that's the case, DO NOT get them ensnared in combat with the boyz. Instead, send them after the flash gitz or other high power targets. A boyz mob will not only kill most terminators (twin LC are kind of the exception there) but they'll do it with not a huge points loss. Try to get them in with something important. Getting them in with the warbikers if you can bog them down in assault packs is still a good plan.

Remember to keep the game goals in mind. Land speeders can tank shock grots mobs off objectives, Terminators can mack an objective and even if they're tar pitted by a boyz mob, the objective is going to be contested, and assault marines can contest too. With trukks and small mobs, getting KPs are a piece of cake for you, while your entire army is 'ard as 'ell for them.

Well thank you both for your advice very nice of you! We started our 2 thousand point game today and got to turn 4! ill update you how its gone.

We played seize ground spearhead deployment.

I deployed most of my guys in my corner with all weapons at the ready, My assault terminators stayed in crusader waiting for right time to charge out, the other normal squad is in orbit waiting!

First turn i went HORRIBLE SHOOTING whirlwind missed and nothing else hit, not much in range though. No moving on my part just trying to keep my rhinos out of LOS to save them for later.
He moved forward fully. No shooting really his lobbas killed two marines.

Next turn shooting was much better ! WhirlWind hit and killed 8 orks and some plasma cannons and assault cannons got some more. Not quite in range of my main gun line.

He moves closer and shooting doesnt do much but his helicopter guys? bomb me and was quite confused.. didnt do much though..

Next turn i kill most of the helicopters then open fire everything on his main mob in range and wip it out to the man except for the warlord who turns tail and falls back! But his other flank is undisturbed so will cause problems next turn..

He assault on other flank one tactical squad holding until it can be backed up by CCS

This assault will probably decide the battle, so i will deep strike my terminators in near to back them up hopefully turn the game.

Any thoughts? i have one objective he has 2 out of 5 so its still close game.

Lobbas are armor 10 and evaporate when hit, so if you can get any sort of fire into them, they tend to go poof.

Termies will win combat with boyz for the most part if the boyz mob is way under 30. Careful about getting them charged, you take DOUBLE the number of wounds on the charge from slugga boyz (more from shoota boyz). Furious Charge is NUTS.

The difference between 3 attacks hitting on 4s, wounding on 5s, and 4 attacks hitting on 4s, wounding on 4s, is very high.

Yeah I think so far i have been doing pretty good keeping my gun line in tact. Also waiting to counter charge with my assault termies in LRC when they horde hits my lines but so far they haven't reached me yet i have focus fire on one flank the whol game and now i see the other side but i think my guys can hold that side with my CCS and all there but we will see. Also what do you think about me teleporting my reg. termies behind the unopposed flank to get the lobbas and flash gitz and clear the objectives and give him something to think about, other then running forward?

It depends how much damage the Lobbas and Flash Gitz are doing. If it was a KP game I'd say absolutely, but both Lobbas and Flash Gitz are really good at doing a whole lot of nothing (Lobbas can scatter to mars, Flash Gitz usually come in small squads and generally suck - they're virtually untakable). There's no point in 'earning your points back' if you do it taking out a totally ineffective set of squads.

With seize ground in spearhead, I'd be looking to take my squad of Termies to land on or near the objective, especially if they have an Assault cannon (not sure how you're fielding them). Termies on objectives with heavy weapons are all sorts of not fun, and Gitz only ignore armor 2/6 rolls. There's no point in killing 2/3rds of his army then having him have one objective and you have the other. Dumbest thing to happen in Seize ground is where you're murdering an assault and the game ends with him having 1/3rd the points you do, contesting your objective and owning his.

Remember, you might not get a 6th turn. It happens.

Okay i see what your saying with the flash gitz and lobbas. i run my reg termies with an assault cannon. So I think i will teleport them onto an objective or in the area of one to take less pressure off my gun line, and start taking other objectives. And once i kill most of his flank units I will push forward and start taking objectives. His only units i think i need to worry about is the big nob squad and 20 boys coming on with a warboss and tank bustas. Are they scary as i think or no? and if they are what do i do to take them out?

Also im asking for my friend since your decent ork player it seems like. Is his list broken or lacking? Any suggestions for him?

One more thing do you have vassal 40k? would love to play you sometime.

IHEARTLARGEBLASTTEMPLATES wrote:Okay i see what your saying with the flash gitz and lobbas. i run my reg termies with an assault cannon. So I think i will teleport them onto an objective or in the area of one to take less pressure off my gun line, and start taking other objectives. And once i kill most of his flank units I will push forward and start taking objectives. His only units i think i need to worry about is the big nob squad and 20 boys coming on with a warboss and tank bustas. Are they scary as i think or no? and if they are what do i do to take them out?

Also im asking for my friend since your decent ork player it seems like. Is his list broken or lacking? Any suggestions for him?

One more thing do you have vassal 40k? would love to play you sometime.

Nobz can be answered by Termies with power fists, assuming there's a stormshield or two somewhere in the squad. The great secret of Nobz is that they're 20 points each. But then they take a power klaw for 25. Or big choppas for 5. And a painboy, and a boss pole, and a Waaugh Banner. Suddenly, it's a 160 point 8 man squad... with 175 points of additions. So deal with them exactly how you deal with termies - make them eat power fist wounds. Same 5+ invul (no stormshields), same costs, etc.

The other option is to have one unit 'kite' them while another unit takes them on with heavy weapons.

A third option is to send the termies after the warboss (a few PFs in base to base with him are deadly) and let the nobz eat a tac marine squad. The marines will die to a man, but if there's a power fist in there, they'll at least get a few hits in, and they can do a small mud pit.

Try to dump a lot of fire into them coming in. My advice would be anything 8+ goes into nobz, anything lower goes into boyz, but that's just common sense

P.S. If you can multi-assault the boyz and the nobz with Termies, you'll be golden. THAT depends on him screwing up right hardcore, but if you do, you can frequently win combat by something like 6 - 1, and gib 2-3 nobz.

P.P.S. Suggestion for your friend - Flash Gitz are all sorts of not killy. I mean as a simple comparison to Lootas, they get half the shots, hit on the same 5+, wound on 3+ instead of 2+, and negate the 3+ half the time. If they don't negate the 3+ they're obviously worse, and if they do, they're not even much better. It gets secretly much worse than that, since they allow cover saves, so many times if they're negating the 3+, they just get it replaced by a 4+.

Meanwhile, they're nobs without power klaws, meaning if they get in CC, a real CC unit like terminators can sort of relax in a warm green bubble bath. If I got a sneak at the army list, I'd know better, but basically any list with Flash Gitz is worse for having them. Which is sad, because personally I love them as a unit, but practically, I can't justify purchasing the kit for any sane reason besides painting them up for that's sake (and I have enough unpainted ork models...)

Hmm all good ideas there will tell my friend your thoughts on Flash gitz maybe get you a list to look at. I think were continuing with our battle tomorrow so i will update you how it goes from there. Also you have a been a big help thank you very much.

No problem! So how did it go?

BTW, despite the fact that back in my MtG days I did do online testing, I just don't have the heart with 40k. I like looking at models.

Hmmm you sound like you have played 40k for a while lol and i will tell you how it goes still haven't gotten to it yet most likely today will tell you how it goes. And if you ever are interested in just trying 40k PM me i can run you through a vassal game if you know what that is.

as both orc and DA player...heres some advise if its not too late.

to kill:

trukks - shoot it with missle launcher. if its got riggers, it can repair immoboilized, but otherwise they break pretty easy.

nobs on bikes are generally anti tank killers, they dont do so hot vrs infantry... my advice, pie plate them with a vindi, or feed them a few whirlwind shots. it will insta kill them, so negates fnp, and will kill 1 nob per wound. nobs on foot tend to die to any focused shooting, so termies with a mix of lightning claws, flamers and assault cannons can tear them up good. failing that, devs with missle launchers. (good for tanks, nobs, or blasting boyz)

for your tac squads id suggest only a 50/50 mix of hev bolters and missle launchers, with a few flamers scattered in. the missles can take out any vehicle short of a BW, and the bolters will help, plus both are good for pasting infantry.

ignore flash gitz. they are small numbers, not scoring, hugley expensive and genreally useless. if they become a prob, assault them with LC termies. (or just kill a few of them and watch them run away)

the biggest threat the orcs pose is thier speed. they can if done correctly be asaulting you on turn 2. therfore, deploy as far back as possible, and do not split up. orcs will outnumber you, and if you split up he can divide and conquer. negate thier speed by nuking trukks, and hitting the bikes. if you have any abilitys that damage based on LD, use them, but only on units that have less then 8-9 members.

good luck.

IHeart
the 1st step to beating orks with dark angels.... imo.... is to not use the dark angels codex.... its a little bit weak compared to the competition.

one of the things thats good about that book though is that raven wing are the fastest army in the game, no exceptions. id use their teleport homers to deep strike terminators on top of the badguys. land speeders with multi meltas and heavy flamers are cheap and potentially very deadly to orks. give everyone who can carry one a flame thrower or meltagun.
AF

So did you get a chance to finish?

Hey man sorry to keep you waiting this long we have both been busy with the world cup and high school soccer training. But yesterday i went over to his house and finished most of turn 4. Basically he now has 2 nob squads sitting on 2 objectives.. i dont know what to do because game is almost over... and in my turn i deepstriked my reg termeis to take out his tank bustas, but in his turn they got killed off by a bunch of units combined. So i couldn't tell if they did good job distracting or i wasted them. We will finish very soon

hey everybody. im the ork player. the game ended spectacularly! IHEARTLARGEBLASTTEMPLATES won by ending up with the only scoring model, let alone unit! one space marine! i got comepletely murdered. my nobs didnt do very badly, quite well (a unit of 4 w/ klaws & a painboy and a unit of 9 w/ a painboy) but my boyz eithier got the heck shot out of them or were killed by WAY too many space marines in close combat. i learned what you meant about the flash gitz. they. are. worthless... the lobbas werent too bad, but they probably couldve been used elsewhere in terms of points.

Hey gabe! nice to see you on here! Well guys game went well i guess. It was VERY close. Here's the basics of last few turns my command squad tac squad finish off what gabe a 20 man? ork squad and warlord in combat with 5 tac marines left and all the CS intact. So they move up to take an objective. My LRC and 10 man tac squad and dread move up to try to take the objective from a 10? or so nob squad. His turn his "useless" flash gitz vaporize my 5 man tac squad on the bridge due to ap2... I HATE THEM then in combat everything went pretty evenly. next turn i charge my CS into the LARGE combat in the middle of the field thinking i would own. Turn out worst round of CC in my life ended up killing my company master and 3 command vets all the tac squad, nothing to the dred! NAd he take like 1 wound back!? WTF so i was pretty pissed then. He would of won if it would of ended. But turn seven comes around i unload assault termies on nob squad and bathe them in bolter shells from my LRC then charge in and wipe them out so. It turned out he had 3 lootas on the board and his lobbas left.. I had 4 termies 3 command vets and 1!! vet sarge holding my home obj.! I won sieze ground 1-0 suchh a close game and very fun moments! had a great time and thanks for the help from dakka! also i keep trying to get gabe to get transports for his army!

well, as a truthful question, which is more important? more boyz, or transports? its not like 12 boyz are going to do much. and are battlewagons in line with a footsloggin ork army?

oh yeah, i forgot the flash gitz did that! XD once somebody gets past the 33% chance of HITTING something with the bloody ork BS the gun takes it from there. mostly.

My buddy plays orks, and he runs a trukks list. he has 4 trukks and 2 battlewagons (i think) He is pretty successfull with the list. Hard to beat for a marine player(myself). He has such mobility, it is hard to cripple him before he starts assaulting my units. Flash Gits aren't really that great in my opinion, and my buddy's.

thanks nantukoshade for the advice! and also to everybody else! i will certainly take it into account. i hope to beat IHEARTLARGEBLASTTEMPLATES at SOME point in time...

haha NEVER will you beat me i still think you should include a battlewagon or something to improve mobility.

If you do use a BW, definately put a deffrolla on it. they absolutley kill vehicles, and are even worse on infantry.

No prob, btw, although it pains me to give advice to an ork player, lol


Automatically Appended Next Post:
If you do use a BW, definately put a deffrolla on it. they absolutley kill vehicles, and are even worse on infantry.

No prob, btw, although it pains me to give advice to an ork player, lol

yes, ive witnessed the power of them with proxy (ugh).
and, well, im sure the orks will repay the favor. or not.

haha I time to call in the orbital bombardment.....

But gabe you can burrow one of my vehicles or something to proxy a BW to see if you like it.

Flash Gitz are useless because of AP d6. On a 4,5, or 6, they might as well be firing grot pistols, those would do more damage.

Remember, at 30 points, they get 2 hits for 3 gitz. Of those hits, 2/3 wound, and of those wounds, if they got a 4+, 1/3 kill.

So if the coin flip ends poorly, then they kill 1 marine for SEVEN flash gitz. That's 210 points to kill a single tac marine.

If it goes well, and they negate the save, it's 70 points to kill a single tac marine.

Sadly, that makes them worthless units that occasionally have AMAZING rounds of shooting.

For comparison, Grot pistols hit on 4s, wound on 5s, so that's 18 shots to kill a Tac Marine - or 54 points. Better than either config of Flash Gitz.
Shoota Boyz with 3x Big Shootas are significantly better than that.