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I notice that in the errata pdf for Empire, the steam tank doesn't seem to have the immunity to magical spells without a strength value, or did I just miss this?

It depends on who you ask. Some people are insisting that it works now if it has no strength value, but many still say they don't. Personally, I'm of the "You can't hurt the Steam Tank without a Strength Value" group, if only because they work under the same mechanic saying "It no longer ignores the spells" as saying "A Steam Tank has no mean to generate steam points", as neither is covered in the FAQ.

Well it does still tell you how to generate steam points, since it still has that on its special rules in the PDF, page 2 right hand column 2nd bolded set of text.

I don't have an Empire army book handy, where exactly does it say that rule, is it in the section on steam points in the army book, or does it have its own special rule mentioned with a name for the rule?

If its under its own name, or in its own section then I would argue that it no longer has that rule.

It looks like it lost it's immunities as it doesn't seem to be covered in its new 'special rules.'

I don't see a "Ignore the Magic Phase rules" in the FAQ. It still has the same immunities as it always did, because pg51 clearly says so.

em_en_oh_pee wrote:I don't see a "Ignore the Magic Phase rules" in the FAQ. It still has the same immunities as it always did, because pg51 clearly says so.

Exactly. It's slightly confusingly worded, but as it doesn't say to ignore those rules, they are still in force.

the faq tell you what to change in the book.

it doenst say to change/remove that paragraph in the book.

there for stanks keep the only spells with strength.

I see what you're getting at. I thought that whole page 51 was special rules. So lore of Metal doesn't work to well against the metal tank now....

I'd have to disagree with folks on this one. The FAQ states:

Change the profile, equipment and special rules for the Steam
Tank to:

Special Rules
Impact Hits (D3 per SP), Large Target, Terror, Unbreakable,
Steam Points (see page 51)

It says change them to, i.e. here's what they are now. I don't see anything about immunity to magic on there. If it had said "add these" or "replace them with the following" like they did with alot of stuff, I could see the argument. But when they included impact hits, large target, steam points, etc. which were already on there, thats leading credence to the argument that the above special rules are it for the Steam Tank.

Its T10 too, so hurting it with cannons, stone throwers, etc. etc. isn't exactly a sure thing now. Sure lore of metal will hurt it badly, but how many folks will take that lore when you have to stick with it for the entire tournament and such?

Okay, after looking through both the rules for the steam tank and the FAQ, here is what I found.

The rule for the steam tank ignoring all non damage effects of magic is not a special rule as far as its profile, or the FAQ, is concerned. It appears on page 51, which includes more rules for the steam tank and how it functions in the different phases, but not on the "special rules" list that the FAQ replaced.

Also, if the steam tank were to not be immune to the non damage effects of magic then why would Pit of Shades not work on it, as described in the FAQ?

I am pretty sure that this sums up why the steam tank still benefits from the immunity to the non damaging effects of magic.

Pit of shades may not work because the Stank doesnt have an initiative value to test.

I'm at a real crossroads on this one because some of it is written weird and the rule in question (I think the special rule was called "Thick hull plating" or something like that) isn't even mentioned.

Considering the rework on magic in 8th to be more devastating in general I would almost say the stank no longer has this benefit. This will probably take a phone call to fix, but heres my points for and against this T10 headache.

The FAQ says "Change the profile, equipment and special rules for the Steam Tank to:" and then it continues ton to name rules and changes.

the FAQ does not say "Ignore the thick hull plating rule thingy"

At the same time, they don't tell us the rule is removed but they also dont tell us its still there.

As I said in my post earlier, the steam tank's immunity to the non damage effects of magic comes from the section on page 51, where it describes how the steam tank operates in the magic phase. It was not a special rule, as far as the steam tanks profile is concerned, and the FAQ does not change page 51. (At least not the part about how the steam tank operates in the magic phase.)

I am unable to see how this could work any other way, as there have been no changes the way that the steam tank operates in the magic phase.

If the model doesnt have the value it automatically fails that type of characteristic test.

If they lose the ability for magic not to effect them, then pit of shades is an instant kill.

Right, and with that logic and the ruling of the FAQ about Pit of Shades, we can conclude that the steam tank still has its protection from magic.

Bear in mind, also, that the tank has a rule that it automatically passes all characteristic tests except initiative, which it automatically fails. Nothing of this 'rule' was referred to in the .pdf, either.

Sorry, guys, but the tank is still immune to many spells.

Yea, guys, it is immunie to magic as always it was. If we choose to disregard that rule, we must disregard the rules for generating Steam Points. See the problem?

I agree that the Steam Tank is totally Immune to Magic without a Str Value. If you disagree, I challenge you to actually pick up an Empire Army Book and look at what I am looking at.

Its not a special rule, like large target or unbreakable, as those are special rules found on the special rules section of the BRB.

Its an Additional Rule, like Yell and Bawl for a Giant.

The updated FAQ has removed the entire Magic Phase paragraph from P51.
Lore of Metal now totally owns the Stank :(

Thanatos_elNyx wrote:The updated FAQ has removed the entire Magic Phase paragraph from P51.
Lore of Metal now totally owns the Stank :(

Hell yeeeeeeeeeeeeah!

Thanatos_elNyx wrote:The updated FAQ has removed the entire Magic Phase paragraph from P51.
Lore of Metal now totally owns the Stank :(

Ah yes, new part of the FAQ (they updated the updates? Bugger all). My bad.

Yet, the Pit of Shades still does not work.

Why would they remove that entire Magic section, as it seems just so arbitrary.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Thanatos_elNyx wrote:The updated FAQ has removed the entire Magic Phase paragraph from P51.
Lore of Metal now totally owns the Stank :(

Now I am glad I have an AL and WP, giving me more Dispel Dice. Best I can hope for is to just deny them the spells that hurt it. Of course, if they put focus on it, they won't be going after the rest of my stuff.