Do spears allow for the second rows full attacks to be made?

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**ChocolateGork**

Do spears allow for the second rows full attacks to be made while the third row gets only one supporting attack?

An example.

20 saurus warriors in ranks of five.

First rank gets two attacks

Second ranks gets a single supporting attack

Third rank none

Fourth Rank none

20 saurus warriors in ranks of five with spears

First rank gets 2 attacks

Second rank gets 2 attacks??

Third rank gets 1 attack

Fourth rank gets no attacks.

**ShivanAngel**

Spears grant the fight in extra ranks rule.

This states the unit can make "supporting attacks" in one more rank then normal...

So my guess would be that they only get one attack regardless of profile.

**ChocolateGork**

Sad Face

Well spears are hardly worth it for lizards anymore

**lixulana**

yes exactly how i read it also.

spears grant an extra rank of supporting attacks = 1A.

**ChocolateGork**

Of course that works out fine for the high elves

**nieto666**

actually it works out pretty well for sarus too. As everyone fights in two ranks, only one fro the second. Plus spears add another rank to fight. So with 20 sarus warrios here are how the attacks would work out with spears.

first rank with champion 11 attacks
second rank 5 attacks
third rank 5 attacks

thats a grand total of 21 str 4 attacks, pretty good if you ask me. Plus they have a 4+ save due to their scaly skin and shield. Yes they're expensive point cost wise and the whole int thing hurts them but Ive seen 25 of them gobble up whole units of sea guard due to their toughness and str, plus a 4+ save is still prtty good. Sarus warriors ar better with spears imo then they were in the previous addition, more attacks is a good thing. Plus skinks are a whole a lot better then what they were.

**ShivanAngel**

for my saurus im actually liking them without spears more.

you save 1 ppm and also get a 6+ ward save in CC.

A big block of saurus vs a big block of high elf spearmen, the saurus actually come out ahead, even without spears.

That T4, 4+/6+ is pretty rough for S3 infantry...

**ChocolateGork**

how have skinks gotten better?

The new skirmish formations are kind of sucky.

**Zad Fnark**

Skinks do work both ways, skirmish and formation.

ZF-

**nosferatu1001**

Because you can march and shoot with no penalty apart from long range to worry about most of the time.

You have just doubled their poison threat range at a stroke. How is that not "better"? They also dont struggle with the formation due to the ability to march without penalty.

**nieto666**

I don't know why everyone is complaining about the new skirmish rules, honestly they're not that bad. Plus skink with blow pipes are disturbingly good, as if they weren't before.

**Aduro**

I prefer Javelins. The Skinks need to either not move or get within 6" for the Blowpipes to be able to use their 2x shots. For the 1pt more your Skinks get to hit on 5s usually with Long Range of 6-12", and always get to Stand And Shoot even if the enemy is close to you. The shields are a bit of gravy, and Javelin/Shields look cooler than Blowpipes.

Now for Chamelions I like the Blowpipes (not that they have an option) as well as Skink Chiefs. Their slightly higher BS is just enough that they can make much better use of the 2x Shots.

**The Defenestrator**

march and shoot, shooting in two ranks. These two things made skink skirmishers even better than before. I modded up my old 5x1 cavalry movement tray (like I'll ever need it lol) into a skirmishing tray for 10 skinks; 5x2. That 6" short range is easy to get into with march (gives you an 18" threat range), and gives you double-shots on that sweet spot of 6s to hit. There's something awesome about being able to average 3 saves on ANYTHING for 70 points. I'm looking at you, warmachines....

I also think the day of auto-including saurus spears is gone. spear saurus get the exact same number of attacks as in 7th, while almost everyone else has more, often twice as many. Being able to exchange 1 S4 attack per file for a ppm and a 6+ ward is starting to feel like such a braindead obvious choice. Looks like I may have a lot of HW arms to paint.....

**nosferatu1001**

Aduro - you're thinking 7th ed.

In 8th ed Blowpipes are "quick to fire", meaning no penalty for moving.

Skirmishers can also March before firing, meaning:

BS3: basic 4 to hit
Move: no penalty in 8th; 4s to hit
Long range: 5s to hit
Multi Shots: 6s to hit, still have poison!

See now?

**The Defenestrator**

Where did you see that they're quick to fire? The FAQ says nothing about them, the army book states only that they're multiple shot x2, and there's no entry for blowpipes in the main book.

**Leigen_Zero**

So does this combine with the hordes rules?

I.e. i have a unit of 40 clanrats 10 models by 4 ranks deep

this means I get front rank full attacks, second rank supporting attacks, third rank spear attacks and then 4th rank horde attacks?

**Jin**

Yes.

**nieto666**

The Defenestrator wrote:Where did you see that they're quick to fire? The FAQ says nothing about them, the army book states only that they're multiple shot x2, and there's no entry for blowpipes in the main book.

The reason he says that is because of the picture right next to the quick to fire rule in the BRB. It's a skink with a blowpipe. i thought it was odd that they would have that pic there and then nothing in FAQ, perhaps a typo of some sorts.

**nosferatu1001**

That was exactly it - the rules for quick to fire show a blowpipe skink.

Hmm, another question to ask....

**Epicwargamer**

Okay, please read your Army Book.

Lizardmen with spears do not gain an extra attack per page 25 of their army book. Under Predatory Fighting.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
And The blowpipe is not near Quick to Fire... its near Poisoned attacks. If you think I am wrong flip the page back. Do Dark Elf Corsairs have Impact Hits?

So no, Blowpipes are not Quick to Fire. Skirmisher rule allows them to march and fire with a -1.

**ChocolateGork**

Umm read your own army book and see if its the right edition.

Page 25 is a timeline of important events in lustria.

**nosferatu1001**

Epicwarganmer - bvefore asking people to "read their army book" it would behoove you to check you have the CURRENT army book.

The Predatory Fighters rule is from 6th ed lizardman book, not 7th.

**Epicwargamer**

Yeah, I don't know how I don't have my 7th Lizardmen AB. Sorry for the slow moment.

**ShivanAngel**

Epicwargamer wrote:Yeah, I don't know how I don't have my 7th Lizardmen AB. Sorry for the slow moment.

No worries...

Now eat this pine cone as punishment!

**nosferatu1001**

Just be glad he only has to EAT the pine cone, there are worse punishments....

**Lordhat**

nosferatu1001 wrote:Just be glad he only has to EAT the pine cone, there are worse punishments....

Involving a pinecone, even.