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Hey guys, here's a very interesting interview with ex GW rules writer Alessio Cavatore by Beasts of War.

Some fascinating insights into how a new set of rules is designed to fit around a pre-existing miniatures range, worth a watch.




Cheers

This is interesting. especially the ancilliary video's of the contract signing. Hillarious I must say.

Good stuff

Have you seen the zombie vids
Too creepy for me! Puts me off buying the starter set!

No worries looks like Mantic will be including rules in smaller boxes too if I understand it correctly.

Am impressed by how versatile the selling system is going to be.
Surprised there is not more interest in this. Has anyone seen the rules yet?

The zombie models look amazing! I'll certainly be getting myself some of them to bulk out my VC that I'm planning on starting in the next few months.

I'm very keen to see the rules, seems to be a lot of emphasis on simplicity, and Alessio says in the interview like nothing we've ever seen. Very interesting and rather exciting!

Kinda mixed feelings
No clocks for me! I crack under pressure!

I like the ideas mentioned for playing games with massive armies.
Also the simpler rules system could be an excellent intro for youngsters into wargamming!

Am really liking the vibes from Mantic.

Hmm, I'm quite curious as how this will turn out. But I have faith in Alessio as I liked his work while in GW. So, I'm ordering a Battleset and hope I'm one of the 1st 100

The game looks intersting.

togashi wrote:Hmm, I'm quite curious as how this will turn out. But I have faith in Alessio as I liked his work while in GW.

Well, that makes one of us. I think he boned an entire edition of Fantasy, as well as beginning the trend of making skirmish armies totally unplayable (admittedly WE were broken before that, but he nerfed skirmishers way too hard). His cheesy overpowering of his own armies' codices was also pretty lame.

Oh well, here's hoping he can learn from his mistakes, or at least do better assembling rules from whole cloth rather than editing an existing set.

Got the impression that skirmishers got stuffed even more in 8th ed?

Doesn't look like being any skirmishers to nerf at all in KoW
or does that mean skirmishers get totally nerfed?

I spent the whole video checking out the GW stuff that was in the background, forground and to each side of them.

Also skirmishers in 8th are better than in 7th, at least my lizardmen ones are.

Waaagh_Gonads wrote:I spent the whole video checking out the GW stuff that was in the background, forground and to each side of them.

Also skirmishers in 8th are better than in 7th, at least my lizardmen ones are.

Pah You youngsters have the concentration of gadflies

My bad Gonads (and I never thought I would say that in public! )


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PS did anyone see the Ironclads review.
There is an orcsey's/gobbo's head on the sprue which may be a clue to the 4th army

Savnock wrote:Oh well, here's hoping he can learn from his mistakes, or at least do better assembling rules from whole cloth rather than editing an existing set.

I think this is the crux of the matter.

Being constrained by previous mechanics and being able to make something new from the aether.
Since he is no longer being constrained and now has freedom to actually design a game and its mechanics, he could very well show himself in a much better light with this opportunity. Worth the benefit of the doubt anyways.

I rather like how he extols the simpler approach to mechanics. The old army acronym of 'K.I.S.S' or 'Keep It Simple, Stupid' is a good one that I happen to agree with. Simpler rules are often much better in games with less abstraction and a stronger theme.

Its not how the core rules work that make the game good however. That is the easy part in relation to the more specific rules that override the general which will make or break this game.

Unit mechanics and how they interact with other units, missions, etc. These types of specific hallmarks are what make a game 'good'.

Luckily, he has a very large pool of mechanics to glean from besides his own imagination to work with as there are a plethora of great mechanics that are begging to be brought together to create a good wargame. Interleaved turn structures, simultaneous action selection, action point allowance, resource management, etc.

The birth of a new game has exciting possibilities.

I only fear that his time under the GW yoke might have biased his design skills into a certain pattern. Time will tell but I remain hopeful.

Well, it looks like they're going to tell us alot about the game before it releases, and the rules themselves will be readily available. I'll be holding off on getting anything 8th Edition; prolly just pick up the mini-rulebook off Ebay.

Savnock wrote:
Oh well, here's hoping he can learn from his mistakes, or at least do better assembling rules from whole cloth rather than editing an existing set.

That's pretty harsh. I believe that much of the credit for the good direction the GW rule sets have gone in recent memory can be given to Alessio Cavatore. Let's let him have a shake at the Mantic rule set and see how he does. I was very pleased with the Warmaster rule set that he worked on and that was from scratch.

Looks very WOTR-ish, which is no bad thing. Interested in how the unit and dead counter approach will work out. I could see myself getting into this game (damnit, that makes 4 different fantasy games I play now.)

I love that gaming table, one of the best I've ever seen in how simple but dynamic it is!

I'm just hoping that the simplicity lends itself to a lot of depth of tactics. Usually it means "pick up a lot of dice and chuck em at each other" which is hardly very satisfying for very long, but if the basic rules allow for many differing playstyles or if units have a number of differant orders or actions they can take part in no mater what type of unit they are.

I know it was jervis not allesio that wrote it, but epic armageddon vs 40k is a good example, a relatively simple ruleset for epic that allowed a HUGE amount of tactical diversity in game with a large amount of options that any unit could do between moving at differant rates giving you atack modifiers and being able to overwatch or assault and such. Going into board games, Setlers of Catan is one of my favorites and is completely differant each time but only has a 4 page rulebook.

Here's hoping for integrated turns and alternating activation of units, always always always makes any game twice as complex without really making the rules any more complex

It looks pretty interesting to me. I really like the point about having a unit in a box, I hate having to track down two or three extra models. I'll be following this. After all, I think everyone gets into wargaming with a vision of a table top full of troops and it looks like that's what this rule set is being designed for.

Plus the troops are cheap.

Absolutely Specs, the whole packaging thing has been well thought out as a concept, even to being able to use the box afterwards.

Also have to agree with Kalamadea about alternating the turns.
Having played that system in Anima Tactics I really like it. Also hope that it is a turn based roll for priority rather than just for the game.




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Was thinking that the low cost makes it feasible to buy sets for converting.

I am not a big fan of the cannons tbh but might get some and make my own barrels.
Need to have another look but it may be possible to stack up a couple or three of the organs which would look really cool!
I find that the cannon barrel is too American Civil War era for my tastes.

I applaud Hellfury for his optimism, though I don't share it!

brainwashed wrote:

Savnock wrote:
Oh well, here's hoping he can learn from his mistakes, or at least do better assembling rules from whole cloth rather than editing an existing set.

That's pretty harsh. I believe that much of the credit for the good direction the GW rule sets have gone in recent memory can be given to Alessio Cavatore. Let's let him have a shake at the Mantic rule set and see how he does. I was very pleased with the Warmaster rule set that he worked on and that was from scratch.

Hmmm, yes and no.

Alessio was, as far as we can tell, responsible for some fairly hideous rules and army books.

Here's hoping THAT won't repeat itself...

Well, he was also responsible for 5th edition 40k and 7th edition Warhammer Fantasy, both not that bad

From the interviews it looks like it's going to be a very simple, minimalist ruleset. I'm kind of excited to see the beta.

Kroothawk wrote:Well, he was also responsible for 5th edition 40k and 7th edition Warhammer Fantasy, both not that bad

Yes, his 'general rules' were OK, his 'specific rules' (codices, army books) - not so much...

Me too
Thing is if the rules are not up to scratch, then what is the loss? Bit of time playing?

no biggie
Again, this will be ideal for beginners and getting youngsters into fantasy with this system.

I'm trying to sign up for the mantic/wayland newsletter and get my free undead sprue, but where it says *enter the letters above there aren't any. Anyone know what the score is on that?

Yep, I'm wanting to see the rules too. I already like the minis!