Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I've changed the thread OP so people won't think I'm asking for advice anymore

Just curious if there are any new developments on the Vamps now that 8th has been out for awhile. I'm sure alot of what's been said still sticks but anything new? What are some Vampire builds people are running that are pretty effective as well as lists and such

If you're going to use a Varghulf, use two.

GG with GW are AMAZING but you need a large unit. 40 works. Deploy in horde formation with the banner of the barrows and keep a vampire with the helm of commandment nearby to make them WS 6 or 7. hitting on 2+ wounding on 2+ hurts.

BSB isn't necessary, but it makes that unit of gg very VERY hard as nails with regeneration. Don't give them a champion and when someone issues a challenge, refuse so the BSB goes to the back automatically - the banner still works back there.

Spellbound describes a nice unit. They can even be buffed further with Van Hel's for ASF (strike at initiative with great weapons and re-rolls to hit). This starts to get really nasty in a hurry.

RZ

Ok thank you, but what about my other questions? I mean now I know the size I should take on my GG but that's about it

I don't have answers, but I'll be interested in reading others' take on it. I've been hoping VC will still be viable, and it looks like with at least some builds they definitely will be! So that's good

I know that Vampire Counts got nerfed in 8th edition but I think that they can still do good. They just won't be the heavy hitters that they used to be. And for the record I'm looking at making 3K

What I've been throwing around is having a HUGE army of skeletons (maybe 4) with each unit screened by ghouls and back up by spammed caster vampires who will heal the units instead of build them and allow my undead to march. 2 corpse carts behind my skeleton blocks positioned so that their effects can hit 2 units at a time.

2 Black Coach as flank units (also allowing marching) and 2 Varghulf as warmachine /character hunters (since flying has gone south for fell bats) and a combat oriented lord who can help out in the tougher fights. OR maybe a caster lord who sits in a GG bunker unit behind my main line

And since I'm getting so few responses on this I may just right up my list with what I think is best and put it in the army lists section to be tore apart, I think I may get more feedback that way but I'll wait a bit longer to see if a Vampire Lord will help me out with some knowledge of the dead

Spellbound wrote:If you're going to use a Varghulf, use two.

GG with GW are AMAZING but you need a large unit. 40 works. Deploy in horde formation with the banner of the barrows and keep a vampire with the helm of commandment nearby to make them WS 6 or 7. hitting on 2+ wounding on 2+ hurts.

BSB isn't necessary, but it makes that unit of gg very VERY hard as nails with regeneration. Don't give them a champion and when someone issues a challenge, refuse so the BSB goes to the back automatically - the banner still works back there.

Just one small thing. You can give the unit a champion. When sending a unit to the back rank for refusing a challenge you can't pick the unit champion. So your BSB will always be the one going to the back rank (assuming it is the only character in the unit).

Ghouls are awesome in combat. Skeletons are handy for the banners but that's it. Even 40 or 50 in hoard formation, with spears, will get its but kicked by just about everything. Hoard formation has few benefits to undead.
I cant see why you would need more than one corpse cart in 8th, they just soak up power dice you can use to build units.
Spamming master is a good way to go, as is making full us of forbidden lore, some of the 8 lores used offensively are nasty.
Vargulfs are fun, Black Coach tends to be more effective. But it does eat PD... but it does eat your opponent PD.

Your general is pretty important to keep alive. Any time he is not in a unit getting the 2+ look out sir is risking a lot. The safest place is on foot in a unit. However if you're comfortable with the risks you can experiment with other options. I'd keep it to cavalry or on foot. Riding monsters is very risky in this era of laser guided cannon balls.

The BSB isn't essential. It's nice to have some extra magic banners though. VC core needs all the help it can get. Wight Kings are good as they're a little cheaper, higher T and more wounds than a vampire hero. I only field Necors when I don't have the points for a vampire hero.

Skeleton warriors are best with HW/S. They aren't skilled enough in combat to gain much from an extra rank of attacks. Ghouls may kill more stuff with all their poisoned attacks but they can die just as fast. Skeletons do an OK job of taking a charge and holding up a unit so you can charge it's flank. I generally have a mix of the two. Oh and I always give skeletons the war banner as well. The problem with thinking about taking either in numbers is that they're too expensive. If you want to field lots of guys VC isn't the army to do it with. There are way too many other armies that have cheap troops in the 2-4 point range that are better than your 8 point skeletons. I always recommend taking the absolute minimum in core for VC and then get as much GG (and possibly knights) as you can. The less said about zombies the better. Although they can be a boon in a pinch to raise a new unit to protect a flank. Corpse Carts, 1 is worth it, two is eating up a bit too many points that could be spent on things that kill the enemy (more GG).

GG has been covered. Black Knights I like a lot and usually field them. Their ethereal movement is so handy. Just don't expect them to charge a large infantry block in the front by themselves and break it. That's more a general statement of cavalry in 8th. Fell bats and Dire Wolves can tie up war machines, but they can't kill them. Keep that in mind. Spirit hosts are best left to being raised through that spell that I can't remember the name to. If you want ethereal troops get wraiths.

Varghulf vs coach isn't cut and dry. The Coach is more resilient but the Varghulf is far more killy. I've run both and aside from occasionally eating a cannonball turn 1 and dying they both perform well. Varghulfs do perform better in pairs so if you're only going to have one then the coach is probably a bit better as it will survive longer. Just be careful not to get it into protracted combats. It can disappear fast in a combined combat if you loose.

Thanks everyone for the suggestions but sadly you are all a bit late. I went with Beastmen

Well in this edition, unless you really want to, try to spend minimum amount of points on core. Those points are much better concentrated on anything else

Coachs seem to have the uncanny ability go get pumped up rather quickly. (against me, at least)

ZF-

Zad Fnark wrote:Coachs seem to have the uncanny ability go get pumped up rather quickly. (against me, at least)

ZF-

Watch out though, if you like the Magic Phrase as vamps this unit could hurt you

Yeah, it like having your own little elven vortex near your vampires.

ZF-

Muhaha beastmen, but in relation to VC i just think in a mass horde list.. all ur opponent has to do is null your general. and its game over

I'm really liking the Black Coach in this edition. Even with a casty vampire I'm still getting enough dice to cast my spells and power up my Black Coach. In my last game it was fully powered up after the second turn, charged a Chaos Lord on a dragon, broke him, then ran him off the board. This was after taking on a big unit of Chaos Maurader Horseman and wiping them out. All for 200 points!

Should we start a seperate topic discussing Vampire Counts tactics for those who need it?

Just curious if there are any new developments on the Vamps now that 8th has been out for awhile. I'm sure alot of what's been said still sticks but anything new? What are some Vampire builds people are running

I'll be honest, after a few games with vampire counts, I absolutely hate them.
I understand that the Undead rule requires a high points cost, but my thirty skeletons lasted two rounds of combat with a tomb blade toting Vampire leading them.
Zombies are 4pts each. What the fug? A Chaos Marauder is 4pts, and they can actually fight.

In short, I've found the best thing about vampires is the Ethereal rule.

That's it.

If you're still going to collect them, try a Vampire lord with the powers that make him ethereal and give him loremaster, take beasts and cast Transformation of Kadon. Vampiric powers continue to work during a transformation, so you have an ethereal great fire dragon.

Bam.

Doesn't every caster get a spell that replaces D6+3 zombies?
You don't get fear and magical replacement for free...

Add in magical movement, and zombies don't totally suck.
All you need is a flank charge, then spam summon into that flanking unit. You'll strip ranks, have flank, standard, and +1 for charging.
Unbuffed, that should let you win combat, even against great weapon frenzied marauders, and you've stripped stead fast as well.

Of course, you'll need a TON of zombie models, but it can work.

-Matt

Or, more likely, they will charge your zombies with something and just chew them because you need your movement spells on stuff that doesn't blow. And even if you win combat, zombies have a crappy pursuit rule. They suck.

Skeletons suck slightly less, but are also bad. GG are your heavy lifters.

Edited the OP