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I hear a lot of people claiming that Metallica are sell-outs but I'm more curious about what you guys think, also please state why you believe so.

They sell music for money; also, they have been known to sell-out tickets for shows.

Who were Metallica grandad?

Nurglitch wrote:They sell music for money; also, they have been known to sell-out tickets for shows.

Nice. Mind you, you don't think they make music because they enjoy playing instruments or they think they are good?

Inb4 Metallica haters, you just know they're flocking to this thread as we speak; slavering at the mouth, rancid spittle dripping from their deformed fangs as they rush to shred the flesh of the innocent, pure-hearted Metallica fans who unwittingly gather to honor their favorite band, not knowing the demons they attract...

Oh man im one of said haters! Well not really i just dont like them

George Spiggott wrote:Who were Metallica grandad?

This sums it up.

Metallica hasn't been relevant since like Justice (I'm sure there are some people on here older than me who will say 'Master of Puppets')

Yea totally. I used to like their music back in the day. But basically since loaded or reloaded or whatever the hell it was called, I have liked them less and less and less. The crap they put out today just makes me ill

Khornholio wrote:

George Spiggott wrote:Who were Metallica grandad?

This sums it up.

Metallica hasn't been relevant since like Justice (I'm sure there are some people on here older than me who will say 'Master of Puppets')

+1.

Doesn't make them sell outs, but they haven't made a good song/album since I was in middle school (1990).

Cheesecat wrote:

Nurglitch wrote:They sell music for money; also, they have been known to sell-out tickets for shows.

Nice. Mind you, you don't think they make music because they enjoy playing instruments or they think they are good?

Of course they enjoy it. Professional recording artist is pretty much the most awesome career a person who enjoys playing music could have. But it's a job. It has been since the dawn of the recording industry (well, actually the Edison Phonograph Company originally CHARGED people to record their voice into their 'talking machine' at county fairs - it was a novelty, rather than an artistic medium originally). It's only really been since the '60s that popular recording artists really began to see themselves as 'high artists' and their 'high art' as pure. Even Jazz musicians prior to this, for all their artistry, saw it as a means to earn money. Their 'art' wasn't divorced from commerce, in the way that subsequent artists would try to project their work.

With that in mind I've voted 'no' - Metallica aren't any more of a 'sell-out' than any other band who ever charged money for their music, whether as a recording or a live performance.

Most of the time the term 'sell outs' when talking about music, is used when referring to a band who have followed money rather than staying true to the music. Usually in the form of "hey this works, it's making us a ton. Lets just repeat it." That's pretty much metallica in a nutshell, it's all sounded the same for the past twenty years.

Albatross wrote:

Cheesecat wrote:

Nurglitch wrote:They sell music for money; also, they have been known to sell-out tickets for shows.

Nice. Mind you, you don't think they make music because they enjoy playing instruments or they think they are good?

Of course they enjoy it. Professional recording artist is pretty much the most awesome career a person who enjoys playing music could have. But it's a job. It has been since the dawn of the recording industry (well, actually the Edison Phonograph Company originally CHARGED people to record their voice into their 'talking machine' at county fairs - it was a novelty, rather than an artistic medium originally). It's only really been since the '60s that popular recording artists really began to see themselves as 'high artists' and their 'high art' as pure. Even Jazz musicians prior to this, for all their artistry, saw it as a means to earn money. Their 'art' wasn't divorced from commerce, in the way that subsequent artists would try to project their work.

With that in mind I've voted 'no' - Metallica aren't any more of a 'sell-out' than any other band who ever charged money for their music, whether as a recording or a live performance.

You know that's probably the most convincing argument on this thread so far.

This the wrong band (it's Tool), but the truth of these lyrics applies all the same:

"And in between sips of Coke
He told me that he thought
We were sellin' out
Layin' down
Suckin' up
To the man.

Well now I've got some
Advice for you, little buddy.
Before you point your finger
You should know that
I'm the man
If I'm the man,
Then your the man
And He's the man as well
So you can
Point that fuckin' finger up your ass.

All you know about me is what I've sold you,
Dumb feth
I sold out long before you ever even heard my name.
I sold my soul to make a record,
Dip gak
And then you bought one."

whatwhat wrote:Most of the time the term 'sell outs' when talking about music, is used when referring to a band who have followed money rather than staying true to the music. Usually in the form of "hey this works, it's making us a ton. Lets just repeat it." That's pretty much metallica in a nutshell, it's all sounded the same for the past twenty years.

Not really. If your definition of selling out is just repeating a successful formula over and over again,then Metallica would basically try to redo Master of Puppets or Black with every album,which isn't what they're doing. I would also disagree that all their stuff the last 20 years sounds the same. Load and Reload sounded very similar,and were softer for the most part. Garage Inc,was a pure cover album. S&M was a live performance with a symphony orchaestra. St.Anger and Death Magnetic were both attempted returns to their harder roots,although St.Anger sucked hard.

I also never got the whole "staying true to the music,"thing. When Metallica started out,the guys were in their late teens,early 20's,and broke as a joke. Now,they're in the their late 40's,have families and kids,and are rich beyond their wildest dreams. What do they have to be angry about as compared to their younger days? Of course the music isn't as hard or angry as it was in the early days.

Looking at sell out bands,though,I would definately throw Korn out there. Korn is a perfect example of a formula band. They hit on something with Follow the Leader...and now every album they've put out since Follow the Leader sounds just like Follow the Leader,IMO.

Whatever1 wrote:

whatwhat wrote:Most of the time the term 'sell outs' when talking about music, is used when referring to a band who have followed money rather than staying true to the music. Usually in the form of "hey this works, it's making us a ton. Lets just repeat it." That's pretty much metallica in a nutshell, it's all sounded the same for the past twenty years.

Not really. If your definition of selling out is just repeating a successful formula over and over again,then Metallica would basically try to redo Master of Puppets or Black with every album,which isn't what they're doing. I would also disagree that all their stuff the last 20 years sounds the same. Load and Reload sounded very similar,and were softer for the most part. Garage Inc,was a pure cover album. S&M was a live performance with a symphony orchaestra. St.Anger and Death Magnetic were both attempted returns to their harder roots,although St.Anger sucked hard.

I also never got the whole "staying true to the music,"thing. When Metallica started out,the guys were in their late teens,early 20's,and broke as a joke. Now,they're in the their late 40's,have families and kids,and are rich beyond their wildest dreams. What do they have to be angry about as compared to their younger days? Of course the music isn't as hard or angry as it was in the early days.

Looking at sell out bands,though,I would definately throw Korn out there. Korn is a perfect example of a formula band. They hit on something with Follow the Leader...and now every album they've put out since Follow the Leader sounds just like Follow the Leader,IMO.

I probably know less about metallica than you do, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

However by 'staying true to the music' I didn't mean by not being angry or having long hair. I meant that by being formulaic a band is not 'being true to the music.' In that music is only developed by experimenting and taking risks. I can name a few bands and artists out there who do this even if when it means earning less, staying outside the mainstream etc.

Any band or artist could be called a "sell out", but they aren't. They're professionals. That's how they make their money. Anyone wearing brand logo clothing could be called a sell-out because you're promoting a company's product for them by wearing their clothes. How is that any different than what musicians do? Or are we okay because we're the masses, while they're sell-outs because they're famous?

In pro-sports, promoting brand names is a good thing called "Sponsorship". Being in the sport for the money doesn't usually draw critique (EG: look at baseball's average salary O_O). But if you're an actor or a musician, look out. Brand names is the devils! Thems make you a bad people!

They all make money off of their talents through live shows, CDs, DVDs, Books, "Signature" instruments, etc...

Is Metallica any different? No. Does it make them a bad band? No. Calling band A a bunch of sell outs, while saying otherwise about band B because you're a fan of band B rather than band A is a double standard, pure and simple.

I dislike them, so i think i would sadly be biased in this argument.

ghosty wrote:I dislike them, so i think i would sadly be biased in this argument.

Just because you dislike something doesn't mean they're sell-outs, though. But you sound pretty modest so I'll cut you some slack.

Death Magnetic = gak

They just want to make a buck, not music.

Sell Outs? No.

Over rated Crapmongers? Absolutely.

Gimme Maiden or gimme Death!

I won't say Metallica are "sell outs",as I honestly feel the term is batted about so often it sort of lacks any meaning anymore.
What I will say is that, IMO, Metallica has "evolved" into a band I no longer enjoy.,nor would financialy support.
I'm one of those "old Metallica fans",old enough to have seen them when Cliff Burton was still alive,and IMO,the direction the band has taken both musically and in their near fanatical "download prevention campaign" against Napster,is indicative of how far they have left their roots behind them.

If you really want to watch a band sell out, look up Against Me! Im going to sound pretentious here but when I first started listening to them obviously I was younger, but they were also dedicated to living the lifestyle they preached. They fought getting a record label deal and their music was great. Well not great, but fitting if your angsty and a teenager. At some point, they made a conscious decision to sell out, I remember them discussing it in an online video where they actually lampooned the one scene from wayne's world. Now try and listen to them. Utterly utterly horrible. Or maybe they always were I dunno.

All bands sell out, some more so than others. The most respectable do it willingly, at least to me. Its when they become so bloated and produce crap and still believe its good and they're not selling out, thats when selling out is bad.

And personally I could never stay mad at the band that has given me some of the best drunken fist pumping of my life, no matter how many St. Angers they produce.

I imagine Anthrax would've gladly "sold out" to be as successful. How many bands for the 80's aren't around because they stayed "stuck in the past"?

If you want blantant sell out, look no further than late 90's Megadeth, that's not metal, it's an abomination. I love Megadeth, but that is not acceptable!

Another formula band is Slayer. They are excellent musicians but their music subsequent to Raining Blood is the exact same as Raining Blood.

I wouldn't consider Load and Re-Load bad, but a shift in direction. I love thrash, but it gets old after a bit, I like variety to my music and the bluesy sounds of those two albums are good. I also imagine that those four guys (three of which have been in since 1983) have gotten tired of the songs off of Kill 'Em All.

I even like some songs off St. Anger(let the trolling begin!), great for throwing weights around in the weightroom.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
One more thing:

What they did against Napster was the right thing to do. Call me whatever, but they were taking a principled stand on the concept of property (intellectual or physical) rights. One of which cannot and shall not be infringed by people who want something for nothing. They aren't holding a gun to your head to buy their stuff, don't steal from them either.

"It's about the Music" bs! Every musician in history has been playing for food, money, a roof over their heads (or women )

The idea of 'selling out' is just a way for a critic to say they've stopped liking a band and will now assume superior position for doing so.

It's all part of the idea that being mainstream is bad in and of itself, and that's only cool to like a band that no-one has ever heard of. Yes, lots of popular music is bad, but that doesn't make popularity in and of itself a bad thing?

I mean, are artists supposed to be writing songs that no-one likes?

I liked Death Magnetic and I thought that most of it was a great album. I wasn't quite as fond of tracks 1 and 2, but by track 3 I was headbanging, and when I first heard "All Nightmare Long' I almost snapped my neck. That song immediately became one of my favorite songs of all time, right up there with Master of Puppets. Cyanide I didn't like too much at first, but it grew on me over time and now I love it. Unforgiven III was excellent and it took a different direction from the rest of the album. After that it was all good, but nothing stuck out particularly...

But you can't ignore the fact that it brought us one of the best songs they ever made, a song so vicious I would willingly headbang to it until my spine shatters; a spiritual successor to Master of Puppets.