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I wouldn't run the BA captain as warlord. Yes the warlord traits (either +1D or 5+ ignore wound with re-roll 1) are good but your also guaranteeing you give up Slay the Warlord.
I'm looking to dust of my AdMech (skitarrii only in 7th edition).
Probably going to run 3 Onagers, multiple squads of Vanguard and Rangers, my 2 Dragoons, Dominus, maybe Cawl, and then try out some Kataphrons. What are the main builds we work around to stay semi competitive?
Mars or Stygies?
And Ruststalkers and Infiltrators look to be trash... shame because they were my favorite units. Are they ever worth running?
1) Main builds revolve around Kastelan robots. Take a squad of at least 4.
2) Why not both? Mars for Cawl+Robots, Stygies for everything else seems to be generally accepted as the best combination. I personally usually run mono-mars because it makes book keeping easier, but getting Stygies for the potential alpha strike with Clandestine Infiltration with one of the nastiest combat units in the game is definitely a thing. Especially now that most alpha strike abilities are gone, it could take an enemy by surprise.
3) Ruststalkers are indeed crap. Friendly games only. Infiltrators when used correctly can be a great asset. Here's why: You will run into the odd situation where you won't be able to use Wrath of Mars on your dakkabots. Say your opponent is hiding models, using mobility to his advantage to stay out of range/LOS of the robots, etc. The Infiltrators make for a great secondary user of Wrath of Mars. Also, when taken in a large enough squad (I like 8 personally), they become a threat than can really open up a flank or reinforce one. Taser goads in such quantities, when paired with +1 to hit in close combat stratagems, become a real threat. Your opponent will only make the mistake of ignoring them once.
They can fold to dedicated firepower, but ultimately I think Infiltrators are worth considering. Especially when people are still making use of large, cheap, weak infantry units that the space uzi (the burst pistols that Infiltrators use) can make short work of, and they can be surprisingly resilient with shroudpsalm, cover, 6+ invulnerables, etc.
1) Main builds revolve around Kastelan robots. Take a squad of at least 4.
2) Why not both? Mars for Cawl+Robots, Stygies for everything else seems to be generally accepted as the best combination. I personally usually run mono-mars because it makes book keeping easier, but getting Stygies for the potential alpha strike with Clandestine Infiltration with one of the nastiest combat units in the game is definitely a thing. Especially now that most alpha strike abilities are gone, it could take an enemy by surprise.
3) Ruststalkers are indeed crap. Friendly games only. Infiltrators when used correctly can be a great asset. Here's why: You will run into the odd situation where you won't be able to use Wrath of Mars on your dakkabots. Say your opponent is hiding models, using mobility to his advantage to stay out of range/LOS of the robots, etc. The Infiltrators make for a great secondary user of Wrath of Mars. Also, when taken in a large enough squad (I like 8 personally), they become a threat than can really open up a flank or reinforce one. Taser goads in such quantities, when paired with +1 to hit in close combat stratagems, become a real threat. Your opponent will only make the mistake of ignoring them once.
They can fold to dedicated firepower, but ultimately I think Infiltrators are worth considering. Especially when people are still making use of large, cheap, weak infantry units that the space uzi (the burst pistols that Infiltrators use) can make short work of, and they can be surprisingly resilient with shroudpsalm, cover, 6+ invulnerables, etc.
Thanks bud! What role do Dragoons fill? I used to use them to pop transports, I don't think they fit that role now. They seem to be popular, I just don't know what targets they should go after in 8th.
So I went to the store today to buy another dragoon, but the idea with dragoons is to run them in a 1x4 to 1x6 STYGIES stack and infiltrate them on the first turn. Then you send them into the enemy as soon as you can and give them the +2 to hit strategem, this causes them to have exploding 4+s. They are point for point the hardest hitters in the IMPERIUM.
Wulfey wrote: So I went to the store today to buy another dragoon, but the idea with dragoons is to run them in a 1x4 to 1x6 STYGIES stack and infiltrate them on the first turn. Then you send them into the enemy as soon as you can and give them the +2 to hit strategem, this causes them to have exploding 4+s. They are point for point the hardest hitters in the IMPERIUM.
Dragoons are currently 68 points and with the strategem should generate 5.5 Str8,-1,2dam ~hits~ (6.5 if you can get the reroll 1s canticle). If I have to pick Dragoons or Russes, I would pick the dragoons every time. Russes are pretty meh if there are -1 to be hit models around. And infiltrating dragoons should be 9" away from the first rank of guardsmen on turn 1.
Maybe Suzeto can answer this, but I am not sure how infiltrating dragoons should be played. I am thinking that even if you get stuck with second turn, you should just put them 9" away from enemy models anyways. Dragoons only move 10" and if you keep them back to try and get that 12" -1 from STYGIES, then you are just going to end up needing another turn to close the distance anyways. Might as well put them all the way up and hope for the best.
Wulfey wrote: Dragoons are currently 68 points and with the strategem should generate 5.5 Str8,-1,2dam ~hits~ (6.5 if you can get the reroll 1s canticle). If I have to pick Dragoons or Russes, I would pick the dragoons every time. Russes are pretty meh if there are -1 to be hit models around. And infiltrating dragoons should be 9" away from the first rank of guardsmen on turn 1.
Maybe Suzeto can answer this, but I am not sure how infiltrating dragoons should be played. I am thinking that even if you get stuck with second turn, you should just put them 9" away from enemy models anyways. Dragoons only move 10" and if you keep them back to try and get that 12" -1 from STYGIES, then you are just going to end up needing another turn to close the distance anyways. Might as well put them all the way up and hope for the best.
Good your giving dragoons a chance. The models themselves are so awesome and the rules quite nice too.
How many does your latest purchase take you up to then?
3 Dragoons (my loadout) with Conqueror Imperatives + reroll 1s to Hit (just to be sure...) makes:
- 13,37 wounds to GEQ (1W);
- 10,60 wounds to Skitarii/Scions (1W);
- 8,03 wounds to MEQ (1W);
- 16,06 wounds to Primaris EQ (2W);
- 10,60 wounds to TEQ (2W);
- 7,13 wounds to a Plague Marine (1W, 5+++);
- 12,83 wounds to a Rhino EQ;
- 9,63 wounds to a Leman Russ
They're among our most point-efficient units, and make a cheap threat that can't be ignored. I play them Stygies with Infiltrate when possible (or keep them close when facing deep-strike lists), when I grab first turn I place them the closest possible to their targets, and if I grab second I try to keep them at a little distance most of the time, but it depends on what my opponent plays. Everyone at my store learned that they should fear them, and so I need to play them a little safer sometimes.
Aaranis wrote: 3 Dragoons (my loadout) with Conqueror Imperatives + reroll 1s to Hit (just to be sure...) makes:
- 13,37 wounds to GEQ (1W);
- 10,60 wounds to Skitarii/Scions (1W);
- 8,03 wounds to MEQ (1W);
- 16,06 wounds to Primaris EQ (2W);
- 10,60 wounds to TEQ (2W);
- 7,13 wounds to a Plague Marine (1W, 5+++);
- 12,83 wounds to a Rhino EQ;
- 9,63 wounds to a Leman Russ
They're among our most point-efficient units, and make a cheap threat that can't be ignored. I play them Stygies with Infiltrate when possible (or keep them close when facing deep-strike lists), when I grab first turn I place them the closest possible to their targets, and if I grab second I try to keep them at a little distance most of the time, but it depends on what my opponent plays. Everyone at my store learned that they should fear them, and so I need to play them a little safer sometimes.
What else do you take with your chicken walkers? Any reason you stick to 3 and not more?
Ideasweasel wrote: What else do you take with your chicken walkers? Any reason you stick to 3 and not more?
Keep in mind I don't play competitive, but more like challenging friendly games most of the time. In my latest 2000 pts list I bring a battalion of Stygies VIII + a battalion of Dark Angels, like this:
The reason I don't use more Dragoons is my budget That's the reason I can't do 2000 pts lists as good as I wanted. I'd play 2x3 Dragoons easily if I could, they're just so good.
In my current list I'd switch one of the Vanguard squads and the TAC Marines to another Intercessor squad, these guys are great. I'd like to try this list more though, don't get many games lately.
Wulfey wrote: Dragoons are currently 68 points and with the strategem should generate 5.5 Str8,-1,2dam ~hits~ (6.5 if you can get the reroll 1s canticle). If I have to pick Dragoons or Russes, I would pick the dragoons every time. Russes are pretty meh if there are -1 to be hit models around. And infiltrating dragoons should be 9" away from the first rank of guardsmen on turn 1.
Maybe Suzeto can answer this, but I am not sure how infiltrating dragoons should be played. I am thinking that even if you get stuck with second turn, you should just put them 9" away from enemy models anyways. Dragoons only move 10" and if you keep them back to try and get that 12" -1 from STYGIES, then you are just going to end up needing another turn to close the distance anyways. Might as well put them all the way up and hope for the best.
Problem with dragoons is they're melee units with low AP. infiltrate might help but 8th is a gunline edition. that's why mechanicus is so low tier if dragoons are the best thing you have to offer. Big guns or go home
I still think we're overthinking things. Taking Slamguinius with a Celestine Auxiliary really does feel like weakening a majority of matchups to prepare for a minority of matchups. I feel now is the time for us to adopt a dominant strategy rather than settle for the reactive one we've always had. I get that it's hard to abandon our old modes of thinking, but consider that assault just got kicked in the balls, leaving us as one of the only armies with a T1 alpha strike and easy access to great ways to convert CP into wounds. The same operative logic that drove other armies should now apply to us: hit as hard as possible on turn one, and ride the momentum of that advantage into midgame.
I think the four ingredients that are necessary are:
1) Cawlstar
2) Goondozer
3) 5/5+ Commander
4) Earthshakers/Mortars
And it is reflected in my list:
Spoiler:
MT Battalion Detachment - 522
HQ - 60 1x Company Commander - Laspistol, Chainsword, Warlord: Grand Strategist
1x Company Commander - Laspistol, Chainsword, Kurov's Aquila
Heavy Support - 660 6x Kastelan Robots - 18x Heavy Phosphor Blasters
Stygies VIII Auxiliary Detachment - 408
Fast Attack - 408 6x Sydonian Dragoon - Taser Lance
Total: 1997 points
12 Command Points
Wulfey wrote: Maybe Suzeto can answer this, but I am not sure how infiltrating dragoons should be played. I am thinking that even if you get stuck with second turn, you should just put them 9" away from enemy models anyways. Dragoons only move 10" and if you keep them back to try and get that 12" -1 from STYGIES, then you are just going to end up needing another turn to close the distance anyways. Might as well put them all the way up and hope for the best.
You already know who goes first. If you go first, 9" always. If you go second, it depends. 12" away from heavy weapons. 9-10.9" from everything else; in fact, we have a small buffer.
More important is the formation. If you want them as a screen, you make a big horizontal chain, two inches apart. As a wall, base to base 2" + <enemyBaseSize> away from your line (so 3" for 25mm models, 4" for 50mm models, 4 and 3/8" for 60mm models, etc). UNLESS THEY FLY. Then you're cramming every unit as closely together as possible. (In case anyone doesn't know, making walls like this is called "castling" or the Cawl Wall.) If you're deep striking, you need to fit them in a 3x2 block. To be honest, this can be tough with 6x Dragoons in unfavorable terrain. 4x Dragoons can do a 2x2 block, which is much easier to rotate.
But yeah, the goal is to hit really hard or at least make the opponent worry about you hitting really hard. It's pretty much the same strategy as Guard + Blood Angels.
This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2018/04/23 01:57:33
I locked up half of a Guard player's russ line for 2-3 turns once with a Celestine aux. Amazing unit to use for that reason alone.
Personally, I'm 100% willing to soup, but I'm really not interested in taking guard or marines. I'd rather fill those gaps with units from a different codex. Guard and Marines just aren't fun for me, I ran IG for 3-4 years in 6th and 7th and those editions ruined my perceptions and enjoyment of the IG army. As for marines, I've never liked them.
I've written a lot of soup lists that use Adeptus Ministorum (Celestine aux, Crusaders, those flail-arm dudes), Assassinorum (I've tried every one of them except for the sniper dude), and Imperial Knights (I hope the codex makes them beefy! )
The problem is scouts. From the warhammer stream they even said that the big idea with the FAQ was to make it so that all armies didn't feel like they needed to be able to deploy out of their deployment zone .... but nurglings + 40 cultists bricks still exist.
Once I tried playing with scouts I am going to have a hard time going back. And boy if there is anything infiltrating dragoons like, it is scouts to make some space on the board that nurglings can't block. And once I take scouts ... then what space marine HQs do I take.
I do think that Guard/Mech is still quite viable and makes for a good gunline. Cawl/Bots/Neutrons/Mortars/Basilisks has only gotten better in 90% of matchups. But it suffers from specific chaos matchups in a big way due to nurglings being able to claim area right on your deployment line. I see 4 flavors of chaos army at my next ~16 man tournament. If I want to write a 3-0 list, I have to plan like I will face them. With the scouts I can space the 40 man infiltrating cultist mega bomb that double shoots and has +1 to wound to outside of rapid fire range. I can also push back the list I know that my buddy will be running that has 5 chaos lords infiltrating up the board on steeds of slaneesh that allow for advancing and charging with 12" movement. I can expect to see him at the top table if I get there.
EDIT: if you are fast enough to finish your games and use the warhammer dice app for the robot rolling, the basic Cawl/Bots/Neutrons/Mortars/Basilisks list is guaranteed a 2-1 list. It outshoots everything that isn't 9 basilisks and with the new anti-deepstrike rules faces fewer auto lose matchups. MARS battalion, CADIA battalion, and STYGIES dragoon auxiliary is going minimum 2-1 every damn time. The list practically plays itself. EDIT2: or STYGIES battalion, MARS spearhead, CADIA battalion
EDIT3: STYGIES aux - 1x5 dragoons [extra dragoon over mortar, AUX trades infantry durability and 2CP to avoid 47 point engi tax] MARS battalion - Cawl, Engi, 1x6 van, 2x6 ranger, 1x5 dakkabot, 2x1 neutron [more mans here instead of mortar] CADIA battalion - 2x com, 3x9 mortarguard, 1x2 basilisk
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2018/04/23 02:46:01
I locked up half of a Guard player's russ line for 2-3 turns once with a Celestine aux. Amazing unit to use for that reason alone.
Personally, I'm 100% willing to soup, but I'm really not interested in taking guard or marines. I'd rather fill those gaps with units from a different codex. Guard and Marines just aren't fun for me, I ran IG for 3-4 years in 6th and 7th and those editions ruined my perceptions and enjoyment of the IG army. As for marines, I've never liked them.
I've written a lot of soup lists that use Adeptus Ministorum (Celestine aux, Crusaders, those flail-arm dudes), Assassinorum (I've tried every one of them except for the sniper dude), and Imperial Knights (I hope the codex makes them beefy! )
Celestine + Dominion Squads is actually a bit more consistent than Scouts, since you can move them up to 1" away from the enemy scout line.
Wulfey wrote: The problem is scouts. From the warhammer stream they even said that the big idea with the FAQ was to make it so that all armies didn't feel like they needed to be able to deploy out of their deployment zone .... but nurglings + 40 cultists bricks still exist.
Once I tried playing with scouts I am going to have a hard time going back. And boy if there is anything infiltrating dragoons like, it is scouts to make some space on the board that nurglings can't block. And once I take scouts ... then what space marine HQs do I take.
I do think that Guard/Mech is still quite viable and makes for a good gunline. Cawl/Bots/Neutrons/Mortars/Basilisks has only gotten better in 90% of matchups. But it suffers from specific chaos matchups in a big way due to nurglings being able to claim area right on your deployment line. I see 4 flavors of chaos army at my next ~16 man tournament. If I want to write a 3-0 list, I have to plan like I will face them. With the scouts I can space the 40 man infiltrating cultist mega bomb that double shoots and has +1 to wound to outside of rapid fire range. I can also push back the list I know that my buddy will be running that has 5 chaos lords infiltrating up the board on steeds of slaneesh that allow for advancing and charging with 12" movement. I can expect to see him at the top table if I get there.
EDIT: if you are fast enough to finish your games and use the warhammer dice app for the robot rolling, the basic Cawl/Bots/Neutrons/Mortars/Basilisks list is guaranteed a 2-1 list. It outshoots everything that isn't 9 basilisks and with the new anti-deepstrike rules faces fewer auto lose matchups. MARS battalion, CADIA battalion, and STYGIES dragoon auxiliary is going minimum 2-1 every damn time. The list practically plays itself. EDIT2: or STYGIES battalion, MARS spearhead, CADIA battalion
EDIT3:
STYGIES aux - 1x5 dragoons [extra dragoon over mortar, AUX trades infantry durability and 2CP to avoid 47 point engi tax]
MARS battalion - Cawl, Engi, 1x6 van, 2x6 ranger, 1x5 dakkabot, 2x1 neutron [more mans here instead of mortar]
CADIA battalion - 2x com, 3x9 mortarguard, 1x2 basilisk
I actually cannot see Chaos easily overcoming a well-deployed AdMech/Guard castle. Unless Berserkers somehow gain Fly, they will have to get past the infantry screen. Dragoons open up transports like tin cans (and don't forget to make them go BOOM), and Robots still chew up MEQs like nothing else.
Cultists don't infiltrate, they outflank. Tide of Traitors allows them to deploy on the first turn 6" from a table edge and 9" from any models. In any case, you can use MSU Skitarii to screen them out of your deployment zone by deploying them on your flanks.
Chaos Lords on Steeds? I haven't seen that yet. I thought they lost a lot of their allure this edition.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/04/23 04:29:17
The problem is the FORWARD OPERATIVES strategem for alpha legion. It is a clone of the SYGIES strategem, but can be applied to a 40 cultist brick that can get veterans of the long war for +1 to wound. Also, they can infiltrate all kinds of melee threats in place of cultists and can freely use veil of time to send jumppack chaos lords over screens. If this combo didn't exist, I wouldn't be insisting on scouts. I know my buddy is bringing a list to maximize this play, so I have to have an answer for it.
Ideasweasel wrote: What else do you take with your chicken walkers? Any reason you stick to 3 and not more?
Keep in mind I don't play competitive, but more like challenging friendly games most of the time. In my latest 2000 pts list I bring a battalion of Stygies VIII + a battalion of Dark Angels, like this:
The reason I don't use more Dragoons is my budget That's the reason I can't do 2000 pts lists as good as I wanted. I'd play 2x3 Dragoons easily if I could, they're just so good.
In my current list I'd switch one of the Vanguard squads and the TAC Marines to another Intercessor squad, these guys are great. I'd like to try this list more though, don't get many games lately.
Oh I hear you on the budget. I’m in the same boat trying to save for more
Wulfey wrote: The problem is the FORWARD OPERATIVES strategem for alpha legion. It is a clone of the SYGIES strategem, but can be applied to a 40 cultist brick that can get veterans of the long war for +1 to wound. Also, they can infiltrate all kinds of melee threats in place of cultists and can freely use veil of time to send jumppack chaos lords over screens. If this combo didn't exist, I wouldn't be insisting on scouts. I know my buddy is bringing a list to maximize this play, so I have to have an answer for it.
Ah, I see. But I don't see why we can't just block the blob of 40 Cultists. I mean, these guys aren't Blood Angels. They are slow, foot-slogging ifantry. And the combo is to Infiltrate, Warp Time, Fury of Khorne + Veterans of the Long War, then wreck tanks with clubs, right? (I guess they can also use Flamers...?)
If they bring 3x jump pack Chaos Lords, castle up.
Wulfey wrote: The problem is the FORWARD OPERATIVES strategem for alpha legion. It is a clone of the SYGIES strategem, but can be applied to a 40 cultist brick that can get veterans of the long war for +1 to wound. Also, they can infiltrate all kinds of melee threats in place of cultists and can freely use veil of time to send jumppack chaos lords over screens. If this combo didn't exist, I wouldn't be insisting on scouts. I know my buddy is bringing a list to maximize this play, so I have to have an answer for it.
Ah, I see. But I don't see why we can't just block the blob of 40 Cultists. I mean, these guys aren't Blood Angels. They are slow, foot-slogging ifantry. And the combo is to Infiltrate, Warp Time, Fury of Khorne + Veterans of the Long War, then wreck tanks with clubs, right? (I guess they can also use Flamers...?)
If they bring 3x jump pack Chaos Lords, castle up.
So what your saying for a solution is “More daka” I like it
EDIT: something else to consider, the FAQ on pistols makes 10 strong MARS infiltrators bombs a very attractive way to get rid of some pesky assault units in your lines. Pistols can now shoot at enemies in combat with other units, so long as the enemies are the closest model. So that means that whatever is tying up my robots can be shot by infiltrators.
Wulfey posted this back a few pages ago. I can't find anything in the FAQ to support this.
Can someone quote the errata that supposedly allows you to do this?
Wulfey wrote: The problem is the FORWARD OPERATIVES strategem for alpha legion. It is a clone of the SYGIES strategem, but can be applied to a 40 cultist brick that can get veterans of the long war for +1 to wound. Also, they can infiltrate all kinds of melee threats in place of cultists and can freely use veil of time to send jumppack chaos lords over screens. If this combo didn't exist, I wouldn't be insisting on scouts. I know my buddy is bringing a list to maximize this play, so I have to have an answer for it.
How are cultists getting "veterans of the long war"? I thought a unit needed to be Marines in order to get that.
'I've played Guard for years, and the best piece of advice is to always utilize the Guard's best special rule: "we roll more dice than you" ' - stormleader
"Sector Imperialis: 25mm and 40mm Round Bases (40+20) 26€ (Including 32 skulls for basing) " GW design philosophy in a nutshell
EDIT: something else to consider, the FAQ on pistols makes 10 strong MARS infiltrators bombs a very attractive way to get rid of some pesky assault units in your lines. Pistols can now shoot at enemies in combat with other units, so long as the enemies are the closest model. So that means that whatever is tying up my robots can be shot by infiltrators.
Wulfey posted this back a few pages ago. I can't find anything in the FAQ to support this.
Can someone quote the errata that supposedly allows you to do this?
Check the new pistols answer. I dont think the infiltrators themselves have to be in combat, but the closest enemy unit can be.
Wulfey wrote: The problem is the FORWARD OPERATIVES strategem for alpha legion. It is a clone of the SYGIES strategem, but can be applied to a 40 cultist brick that can get veterans of the long war for +1 to wound. Also, they can infiltrate all kinds of melee threats in place of cultists and can freely use veil of time to send jumppack chaos lords over screens. If this combo didn't exist, I wouldn't be insisting on scouts. I know my buddy is bringing a list to maximize this play, so I have to have an answer for it.
Ah, I see. But I don't see why we can't just block the blob of 40 Cultists. I mean, these guys aren't Blood Angels. They are slow, foot-slogging ifantry. And the combo is to Infiltrate, Warp Time, Fury of Khorne + Veterans of the Long War, then wreck tanks with clubs, right? (I guess they can also use Flamers...?)
If they bring 3x jump pack Chaos Lords, castle up.
The issue isn't killing Cultists. We have cost efficient means to do that.
The issue is that they're in your face, which means they actually need to be taken care of. Forgetting other Strategems that might increase their damage output, it's all about the potential tarpitting they can do.
CaptainStabby wrote: If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.
jy2 wrote: BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.
vipoid wrote: Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?
MarsNZ wrote: ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
Wulfey wrote: The problem is the FORWARD OPERATIVES strategem for alpha legion. It is a clone of the SYGIES strategem, but can be applied to a 40 cultist brick that can get veterans of the long war for +1 to wound. Also, they can infiltrate all kinds of melee threats in place of cultists and can freely use veil of time to send jumppack chaos lords over screens. If this combo didn't exist, I wouldn't be insisting on scouts. I know my buddy is bringing a list to maximize this play, so I have to have an answer for it.
How are cultists getting "veterans of the long war"? I thought a unit needed to be Marines in order to get that.
I believe Cultists have the <Legion> rule which is the requirement.
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They can fold to dedicated firepower, but ultimately I think Infiltrators are worth considering. Especially when people are still making use of large, cheap, weak infantry units that the space uzi (the burst pistols that Infiltrators use) can make short work of, and they can be surprisingly resilient with shroudpsalm, cover, 6+ invulnerables, etc.
EDIT: something else to consider, the FAQ on pistols makes 10 strong MARS infiltrators bombs a very attractive way to get rid of some pesky assault units in your lines. Pistols can now shoot at enemies in combat with other units, so long as the enemies are the closest model. So that means that whatever is tying up my robots can be shot by infiltrators.
Wulfey posted this back a few pages ago. I can't find anything in the FAQ to support this.
Can someone quote the errata that supposedly allows you to do this?
Check the new pistols answer. I dont think the infiltrators themselves have to be in combat, but the closest enemy unit can be.
The question originally had to do with a unit with pistols that are in close combat. I think that you are gonna have a tough time selling this one to your opponent or a TO in a tournament. I'd be careful with building lists with this intention in mind.
That's the reason I can't do 2000 pts lists as good as I wanted. I'd play 2x3 Dragoons easily if I could, they're just so good.
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6k 
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