Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I have just started collecting Orks as my second string force. I was wondering what everyone thought about Nob leaders in Boyz squads?

Which option is best, taking into consideration combat effectiveness and points economy?

As far as I can see, most players prefer PK armed nob leaders. But at an extra 25pts, i think it is a bit pricey. Also, cancels out any benefits of charging. Whilst a solid choice for dedicated squads, do Power Klaws belong with the boys?

Big Choppas are less than half price, but IMO are reasonably useless given their lack of armour pentration, which leaves the standard Nob upgrade - at 10pts, an absolute bargain for the stat upgrades it affords, Strength on the charge is very decent, rendering the Big Chopppa obsolete given the advantage of an extra attack. PLUS you can take full advantage of charging bonuses. PLUS you get an extra 4 boyz instead of lashing out on that big shiny PK.

Feedback would be most welcome.

CK

Boyz don't last long in protracted combats. There will be games where a dude doesn't fail an armor save. There will also be games against Plague Marines and other T5 goodness. Let's not get into to MC's. Basically the Klaw is what makes winning combats possible. Expensive, maybe. Worth it, oh hell yes. Unless a unit is just for scoring or it's a unit of 3 nobs for a wagon a PK should be on that Nob.

I only been playing for a little and can safely say PK all the way. The Boyz are just a deliver system and extra wounds for the Nob. 210pts for 30 guy with one capable of IK SM and likely wounding twice a combat, is gold. The tough part I find is getting there, but that should get easyer the more games I play.

For smaller squads that may be forced out of fearless early (Trukk boyz come to mind), the addition of a bosspole is also a good upgrade.

The powerklaw is the all purpose swiss army...fist of the Ork army. It denies armor saves, krumps up weak 'umies, opens up tin cans, and hits into MCs with decent damage. The one bad thing is that it goes last in any combat at I1, so make sure you have enough boyz to absorb the wounds in a combat before the klaw becomes active.

Totally agree with Hulksmash. Youve got to realize that everything gets an armor save against boyz in assault. And so the better the save the worse they will do in it. The only sure fire way of taking down troops are better, is a PK. Im telling ya, if you dont take it in every boyz mob, youll regret is big time. The boyz are pretty much just s cushion for the nob to get some instant death, crunch vehicles, or wound tough guys. If the boyz actually cause a couple troops to die, then perfect, but I rely on my nobz to do the killing.


Also realize that every boyz mob now has decent anti tank. Thats pretty scary for mech armies

Just remember that blood talons aren't your friend

Many people refer to boys squads as "power klaw delivery systems" and their not far off. Loads of attacks are nice buts its the PK that does the damage. Big choppas and choppas haven't been a good fit for nobs/warboss in many years.

p.s. I do miss taking a choppa and a power klaw on my warboss - the power klaw for big nastiness or the choppa that reduced armor to 4+ and would go off on initiative 8. But that was 3rd edition - I guess that makes me an old fart.

thanks guys, solid feedback. As a primarily Tau player, I'm a bit new to the whole squad upgrades thing. Turns out some decent ones do exist...!

What to do with all those slugga/choppa nobs from Black Reach?

ColonelKlink wrote:thanks guys, solid feedback. As a primarily Tau player, I'm a bit new to the whole squad upgrades thing. Turns out some decent ones do exist...!

What to do with all those slugga/choppa nobs from Black Reach?

The good news is that orks can be modeled fairly easily, and the nobs from Black Reach can form the core of a full nob squad.

This ork here for instance I modded from an AOBR nob to have a combi-rokkit and a bigger huge choppa:







However, the discussion for an ork nob squad is another topic altogether.

ok, that answers my question pretty thoroughly, cheers

As mentioned above Power Klaw is the goto tool of destruction, especially against mech and mc.....but do not under estimate the uge choppa.......2 strength 6 attacks.......id to Tau and Guardsmen.........well worth 5 points.........

Boss Pole and eavy armour also a must......

There's a choice?

For sluggas, I'd say just a nob with pklaw and bosspole.

For shootaz, three of either of the weapons, and a nob with pklaw (if you're running low on points, a nob with big choppa), and of course bosspole.


'Eavy Armor can be useful to absorb attacks, but it depends on how you're allocating wounds.

I wouldn't bother with klaws in shoota mobs, who shouldn't really be getting into HtH if they have a choice, but I agree with others above that klaws are pretty essential for slugga mobs.

Clang wrote:I wouldn't bother with klaws in shoota mobs, who shouldn't really be getting into HtH if they have a choice, but I agree with others above that klaws are pretty essential for slugga mobs.

Always klaw, always! There's nothing people love more than a klaw-less mob. Charge it with a scout sentinel, warwalker etc and 35pts will tie up thosse 30 orks

Melissia wrote:There's a choice?

QFT

Orks thrive on the klaw as one of the only universal things they can effectively employ to rip apart armor, MCs, tough CCers, and anything else that may need to be opened Pop-eye spinach can style.

The claw is supremely effective over just a big choppa or worse a regular choppa as you've already got a load of lower strength attacks goind before you. Anything that survives the initial storm of ork boyz bludgeoning the enemy with axes WILL require a power claw to be properly opened up.

Clang wrote:I wouldn't bother with klaws in shoota mobs, who shouldn't really be getting into HtH if they have a choice, but I agree with others above that klaws are pretty essential for slugga mobs.

Ok do not ever listen to this type of reasoning ever. Shoota mobs shouldnt be in combat? Since when? They can shoot twice at 18, and then assault with 3 attacks on the charge. So basically a shoota boy can have 5 attacks each in one turn. A SLugga boy gets 1 shot and then 4 attacks on the charge....which is 5 attacks a turn. Weird. The problem is, the shooting is more effective with the Shoota boyz then the sluggas. The 2 shots are farther range so increases the chance of getting 2 shooting phases out of them and its 2 shots. Thats ALOT more chance for 5s & 6s.

Again ALWAYS put a PK nob in a boyz mob, the PK will make up for all the lack that the boyz have


(spelling errors)

what about upgrading a 30 man shoota mob to 'ard boyz? with Nob with PK and Boss Pole, should be a nice objective holder...?

30 wound power claws all the way.

Doots wrote:As mentioned above Power Klaw is the goto tool of destruction, especially against mech and mc.....but do not under estimate the uge choppa.......2 strength 6 attacks.......id to Tau and Guardsmen.........well worth 5 points.........

Boss Pole and eavy armour also a must......

Im gonna have to disagree w eavy armor being a must...your nob has 2 wounds allowing you to take a shot if need be...if your nob is up close and actually having to use that armor...well then youve already lost anyway and your either going to be swept or runnin away due to failing leadership...there are far better ways to spend 5 points in the ork dex (like another Big Shoota on your BW or another ammo runt to abuse wound allocation in your nob squad or anothe kombi weapon for your nobz the list goes on!) than on armor that really doesnt help...

ColonelKlink wrote:what about upgrading a 30 man shoota mob to 'ard boyz? with Nob with PK and Boss Pole, should be a nice objective holder...?

That would cost ALOT of points for 30 ard boyz. 120 just in the upgrade, yikes. Suddenly that decently priced unit just went crazy. all it takes is 1 well placed template and you can kiss that unit goodbye, well seriously F'ed up anyways. Then the objective is being contested because you know they are getting assaulted after the ouch. Grots. Linked like a chain. Much better

Ultrafool wrote:30 wound power claws all the way.

uhm.....you mean a 10 nob mob all with pks? No thanks. 250pts for 10 pks? Missile launchers will make you a sad panda. Oh and those are free for SM boyz

Shake Zoola wrote:

Doots wrote:As mentioned above Power Klaw is the goto tool of destruction, especially against mech and mc.....but do not under estimate the uge choppa.......2 strength 6 attacks.......id to Tau and Guardsmen.........well worth 5 points.........

Boss Pole and eavy armour also a must......

Im gonna have to disagree w eavy armor being a must...your nob has 2 wounds allowing you to take a shot if need be...if your nob is up close and actually having to use that armor...well then youve already lost anyway and your either going to be swept or runnin away due to failing leadership...there are far better ways to spend 5 points in the ork dex (like another Big Shoota on your BW or another ammo runt to abuse wound allocation in your nob squad or anothe kombi weapon for your nobz the list goes on!) than on armor that really doesnt help...

I totally agree with this. 5pts for armor in a boyz mob? No way man. Think about it, once the boys are gone and its FINALLY down to the nob, you REALLY think that 4+ save is going to help that much? No way. Now a big shoota on a vehicle or something similar, thatll go a long ways. Hell if it makes your opponent take just one save it has payed for itself. Specially if your opponent is something the Bigshoota ignores the saves of. Then even better.