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OK, if you're firing ordnance at another tank and the center is on that tank, you determine which facing you hit by looking at which angle the firing tank is in. Easy enough, and really straightforward. Now what happens if you're firing your vindicator at a guy 10" away and manage to scatter the template directly back onto your own vehicle? Do you manage to hit your front, since that's the angle the gun is in, or something else? The rules don't really cover a tank shooting itself unless I've missed a specific passage somewhere.

If it's hull mounted, I'd say the front. If it's a turret mounted weapon, I'd say from the side closest to the gun.

BearersOfSalvation wrote:OK, if you're firing ordnance at another tank and the center is on that tank, you determine which facing you hit by looking at which angle the firing tank is in. Easy enough, and really straightforward. Now what happens if you're firing your vindicator at a guy 10" away and manage to scatter the template directly back onto your own vehicle? Do you manage to hit your front, since that's the angle the gun is in, or something else? The rules don't really cover a tank shooting itself unless I've missed a specific passage somewhere.

The rules do not sufficiently cover this, so you have to make it up.

Most people play it as hitting the facing where the weapon is mounted.

if you aim at a spot 10" away you can scatter 8" back maximum as your vindicator has bs4

anyways,direction is determined by the center of the template

HamHamLunchbox wrote:if you aim at a spot 10" away you can scatter 8" back maximum as your vindicator has bs4

anyways,direction is determined by the center of the template

He could have a Chaos one, which can be BS3 with Possession, and the Cannon is recessed a little bit.

well yes,but chaos vindicators should shoot themselves anyhow XD

HamHamLunchbox wrote:if you aim at a spot 10" away you can scatter 8" back maximum as your vindicator has bs4

Yeah, so it's shooting at someone 6" away or using some scenario rule that causes extra scatter.

anyways,direction is determined by the center of the template

That's only if the center of template is not on the vehicle. If the center is on the vehicle, I didn't see anywhere in the rules to determine direction, and from what everyone else has posted there is no rule for it.

Vindicators are so powerful they can blow a hole in the rules at short range!

HamHamLunchbox wrote:anyways,direction is determined by the center of the template

That's just for Barrage weapons, not regular Ordnance.

BearersOfSalvation wrote:Yeah, so it's shooting at someone 6" away or using some scenario rule that causes extra scatter.

Edit - Never mind... Early morning brain-fade.

That's only if the center of template is not on the vehicle. If the center is on the vehicle, I didn't see anywhere in the rules to determine direction, and from what everyone else has posted there is no rule for it.

The centre of the blast marker ('template' refers to the tear-drop shaped marker) being over the vehicle or not has on bearing on which facing is hit.

insaniak wrote:

HamHamLunchbox wrote:anyways,direction is determined by the center of the template

That's just for Barrage weapons, not regular Ordnance.

getting confused with the english terms sometimes.

Sorry, but just sheding my bit o' sense.

take the point where you wanted to shoot.
scatter it into the tank. oh, it hits the tank. kewl.

now, what you do, is leave a marker at the point where the hole of the blast marker was, and use a tape measure to find the direct angle to where its shooting.

otherwise, I'd just remove the tank. seriously, your crew is way too drunk to be shooting at anything.

Easiest method: a shot where the tank would hit itself is discarded.
Easy method: simply resolve based on from centre of the blast.
Difficult method: draw line of sight from weapon to center, if it crosses the tank resolve on spot it hits the tank, if not resolve from centre of blast.

The risk of a weapon striking the tank itself for significant damage is remote, however, considering scatter reductions from BS and S reductions if centre of blast is not on the tank hull. Just keep in mind when devising home made rules that the shot travels from the weapon to the point of impact in a straight or semi-straight line, it doesn't veer around from the intended point of impact or anything like that.

I haven't come across the situation where an ordnance blast lands directly on a vehicle often, but I thought that it was always resolved agaisnt the rear armor.

We play it as hitting the facing from which you fired the shot, whether turret weapons or otherwise.

ie LRuss if firing from front arc gets hit front arc if it scatters, if firing to the side (any scattered shot hits side) and similarly rear

I would play it like Sceleris. So a vindicator would always hit its front armor.

Alternately, use the Barrage rule and determine from the hole.

Conceptually, it seems really odd that an artillery shell would ever land back on the piece. I guess it could be viewed as the shell detonating in the breech or upon firing or something. But that would probably immediately destroy the weapon, if not detonate the whole vehicle!

What's a way trickier situation is when you shoot really close models and scatter far enough backwards to hit the tank behind your firing tank. Now, do you hit the armor of the side facing your tank? Or, do you draw LOS, using the gun which is facing the opposite way, "around the planet" and hit the opposite side?

Grakmar wrote:What's a way trickier situation is when you shoot really close models and scatter far enough backwards to hit the tank behind your firing tank. Now, do you hit the armor of the side facing your tank? Or, do you draw LOS, using the gun which is facing the opposite way, "around the planet" and hit the opposite side?

I think in most situations, drawing a straight line from the gun is a good solution. I also like Sceleris' solution for most circumstances.

insaniak wrote:The centre of the blast marker ('template' refers to the tear-drop shaped marker) being over the vehicle or not has on bearing on which facing is hit.

While you're correct that I should have said 'blast marker' instead of template, you're wrong about what affects which facing is hit. P60, "The center of the blast matker ends outside the vehicle, but part of the marker covers its hull... The armour penetration is resolved against the Armour Value facing the center of the marker, regardless of the position of the firer, and the weapon's strength is halved".