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Done some modifications to my Angels list, trying Baal Predators so will see how it goes.

Blood Angels "Wing Striker" - 2,000 points


HQ

Librarian shield of sanguinus & unleash rage

Librarian shield of sanguinus & unleash rage

Honour Guard w/ Razorback chapter banner, 1 x flamer & 2 x power weapons - Razorback w/ lascannon & twin-linked plasma gun

Elite

Sanguinary Priest

Sanguinary Priest

Troops

5 x Assault Marines w/ Razorback 1 x flamer - sgt w/ power weapon - Razorback w/ lascannon & twin-linked plasmagun

5 x Assault Marines w/ Razorback 1 x flamer - sgt w/ power weapon - Razorback w/ lascannon & twin-linked plasmagun

5 x Assault Marines w/ Razorback 1 x flamer - sgt w/ power weapon - Razorback w/ lascannon & twin-linked plasmagun

5 x Assault Marines w/ Razorback 1 x meltagun sgt w/ infernus pistol - Razorback w/ lascannon & twin-linked plasmagun

5 x Assault Marines w/ Razorback 1 x meltagun sgt w/ infernus pistol - Razorback w/ lascannon & twin-linked plasmagun

5 x Assault Marines w/ Razorback 1 x meltagun sgt w/ infernus pistol - Razorback w/ lascannon & twin-linked plasmagun

Fast Attack

Baal Predator

Baal Predator

Heavy Support

5 x Devastators 4 x missile launchers

Total: 2,000


Blood Angels "Book of Blood" - 2,000 points

HQ

Librarian - melta bombs, jump packs, shield of sanguinus & unleash rage

Librarian - melta bombs, jump packs, shield of sanguinus & unleash rage

Honour Guard - jump packs & 4 x meltaguns

Elite

Sanguinary Priest - jump pack

Sanguinary Priest - jump pack

Troops

10 x Assault Squad - 2 x meltaguns - sgt w/ power fist

10 x Assault Squad - 2 x meltaguns - sgt w/ power fist

10 x Assault Squad - 2 x meltaguns

10 x Assault Squad - 2 x flamers

5 x Assault Squad - plasma gun

Heavy Support

5 x Devastators - 4 x missile launchers

5 x Devastators - 4 x missile launchers


Game: Pitched Battle + Annilation

Deployment

I won the roll off and decided to go first, reason for this is so I can hang back and get a first turn of shooting and make Kris come out and expose himself to me, ohhh errr . I deployed all my stuff pretty much in the centre of the game to give me a broad spectrum range of fire power.

Kris deployed his Angles clustered mostly together on my right flank far away from my guns, two of his Dev units deployed in a ruin on the right flank and one unit directly opposite me with two Assault Squads with meltaguns.

Btw I'm proxying the two red Razorbacks as Baals, all the rest are las/plas Razorbacks












*Tactical Notes

I'm going to target the Devastators right in front of me and use terrain to get cover or block LOS from the other two squads, if I disable Kris' long range fire power he will need to bring his melta units to close to me, which means plasma death or bail out and assault with multiple units. I'll be tackling the Honour Guard first and then the other melta units.

Turn 1

Kris attempts to seize the initiative but fails.

I move a few Razorbacks around, nothing major, and plough one Baal through terrain. That's it for me.

Shooting I blast everything at the Devastators in front but only manage to kill two but force a morale test, which fail.

Kris' first turn, he moves the Devs which failed morale back into position thanks to the Marines funky ATSKNF special rule. He starts to move his Angels out using terrain as a shield to block LOS.

Shooting Kris unleashes krak missiles at a Baals side armour but does nothing. I think that's about it.

Points are me 0: Kris 0.





*Tactical Notes

I'm a bit bummed I didn't kill Kris' Devs, every time my lascannons fired they got a 1 to wound! At least I've stopped them shooting for a turn I guess.

Next turn I'll move the Baals so ontop of the hill so they can rain down assault cannon shots on Kris' exposed Angels and the Devs have the front armour to crack. I'll reposition the Baals but keep the range and hopefully maul a unit of take one down.

Turn 2

In my movement turn I move both Baals to ontop of the hill by the shrine, one goes through terrain ok. I reposition my Razorbacks but that's about it.

Shooting I blast that Dev squad which regrouped and kill them. I blast Kris' Honour Guard with krak rockets but I get poor rolls and kill a single Honour Guard Marine. I blast a melta Assault Squad with plasma and lascannons but they get cover, I fire the Baals at them and after it's all done only three Marines from that squad have died.

Kris' turn he moves his Angels towards me with two squads getting up close to my tanks.

Shooting he blasts his Devs at my Devs and kills two, my squad passes morale. He blasts his other Dev squad at a Baal and immobilised and stuns it. He fires meltas at my Razorbacks and manages to stun one and explode another.

In assault Kris charges his some of his Angels at my tanks and manages to pop one with a melta bomb from the Librarian.

Kill points are me 1: Kris 3




* Tactical Notes

Ok I've lost three Razorbacks which I expected with the melta shots to be honest. Though, Kris hasn't been able to assault me because he did the damage in the assault phase and didn't pop one which now means I can mass charge him and kill several of his squads.

Turn 3

I debus a melta Assault Squad ready to mass charge Kris' Angels. My Honour Guard got busted out their ride and so did another melta Assault Squad. I also debus a flamer unit ready to bring on the pain.

Shooting I use the flamer on one of Kris' squads along with bolt pistol fire. I use Razorbacks along with Devastators to wipe out Kris Honour Guard.

In assault I charge Kris' two Assault Squads, I win combat, one squad falls back with just the Priest left and the other squad falls back with just the Librarian and two Marines, though I did lose my Librarian in combat :(

In Kris' turn he the Librarian and Marines fail morale and fall back, he joins the Priest with them so at least they get fill no pain if assaulted or shot at. Kris moves the rest of his Angels towards me.

Shooting Kris' meltas pop a Razorback exposing a squad inside. He fires the two Devastator units at my Baals and pops them both :(

In assault Kris charges his 7 man melta Assault Squad into my unit, I fail combat and fall back 5".

Kill points are me 2: Kris 5





*Tactical Notes

It's not looking too hot at the moment. First dumb ass mistake was I didn't allocate my attacks onto Kris' Librarian, could have killed that sucker, ah well.

Kris is now closing in on me, but he's lost his Honour Guard squad, got a melta unit left and one which is falling back. I'll run a melta squad of mine towards Kris' Librarian who will fall back when my Marines get close. I'll debus another flamer squad and charge those into the Assault Squad which made my Marines fall back, which that falling back squad should regroup and charge back in with another Assault Squad close by.

Turn 4

I run a melta Assault Squad towards Kris' Librarian and Priest so within 6" and will make them fall back. I do morale on my own squad, which fails and falls back off the table giving Kris another kill point :( . I debus a flamer Assault Squad ready to charge into Kris' Marines along with another melta Assault Squad of mine and the Honour Guard.

Shooting I blast Kris' Marines which made my Marines fall back and unleash plasma and lascannons on his 5 man plasma Assault Squad wiping them out.

In assault I charge Kris' melta Assault Squad with my flamer and melta Assault Squads, the Honour Guard are out of range, I win combat and consolidate the flamer unit away from Kris' Marines though the melta unit doesn't get a good roll.

In Kris' turn he spilts his Librarian off ready to melta bomb a Razorback while his flamer squad move in for the kill.

Shooting his flamer squad unleash bolt pistols and double flamers on my melta Assault Squad.

Assault the Librarian fails to destroy the Razorback, just immobilises it, though his flamer squad does better and wipes out my squad.

Kill points are me 5: Kris 7















*Tactical Notes

Kris is starting to sneek ahead here though I managed to claw back 3 points in one from the Librarian, Marines he was attached with and Priest when they ran off the table - I do feel a bit bad as I mentioned to Kris the Priest could give feel no pain to them and attach to the unit, I just thought about chasing them off after, honestly!

This turn I'm going to blow that Librarian away and score me a point and finish off that flamer Assault Squad which should put me even.

Turn 5

I move squads towards Kris flamer Marine squad ready to blast and assault them. I firstly blast the Librarian and get myself a point, I blast the flamer unit with plasma, lascannons and bolt pistols and only three remain - but they fail morale and leg it denying me the assault! Bah!

Kris smartly pulls his Assault Marines back towards his two Dev units and runs them into terrain, he then torrents my Devs with krak missiles and kills them, doh!

Kill points are me 6: Kris 8





*Tactical Notes

Doh, just as I was catching up Kris pulls the rug from under my feet with his lucky dice rolls and flees his Assault Marines. I also should have gone to ground with my Devs which I forgot about until his second volley but by then it was too late.

If there's a turn 6 I'll mount up and move 12" towards Kris' lines, I can't move 18" as fast vehicles cannot mount up and do one so I'll pop smoke and then next turn move up and blast.

Turn 6

We roll for turn 6 and game rages on.

I mount up what I can and move towards Kris' board edge, popping smoke on which tanks I can. No shooting from me.

Kris turn sees him fire volleys of krak missiles into the Razorback carrying the other Librarian, first volley sees it immobilised second volley sees it destroyed and gives Kris another point.

Points are me 6: Kris 9

We roll for turn 7 and it doesn't happen. Kris wins with 9 kill points!






Summary

That was a short and brutal fight. There was plenty of psychic battles with the psychic hoods and furious charge going on, it was a contest who can get into assault first and use their psychic powers to get the advantage!

I had some bad luck at the start with those lascannon roll to wound rolls, I cannot believe how many 1's I got! I also made a mistake no allocated attacks onto Kris' Librarian when in combat and should have allocated more on his Priest, but I guess I got those points back. It was alos unlucky for me and lucky for Kris his final Assault Squad ran off and those Devs failed saves or might have been a draw. I also forgot about the Honour Guards banner giving re-roll to my morale tests, ah well live and learn.

The abd thing about my list is how many kill points it gives away, even if I table the other player doesn't mean I am going to win. Oh, Baal Predators should be called Ball Predators because that's exactly what they sucked - as I thought they're not good really and even against hordes don't have enough shots. I don't think I'm going to try flamestorm, not sure, might go a Vindicator instead but I haven't got enough points for two of those. I think I'm going to drop the Devastators though and get another Honour Guard squad.

Kris played pretty well. I'd say his mistakes were deploying that centre Devastator squad so close to me, others I couldn't touch. He also flanked around first turn using terrain to block LOS which means he didn't make combat until turn 3, if he would have come straight at me he would have got me by turn 2. He also attached the Priest to the falling back Librarian which wasn't a good idea, though I guess I put that in his head, honestly no sabotage intended

Good job on the win Kris

Really interesting report. Once again it seems no one succumbed to RT?

When you mentioned that your Lib failed morale and ran off the board, I assume you mean he was chased off the board?

How did you like the swap to Baal Preds vs the Devastators you were using? I think one of the advantages of them is outflanking, but I can understand wanting to deploy them. Looking at his movement though it seems a tank coming in off the edge might have pushed him more to the center.

Once again Calypso we forgot - fail :( Isn't a major factor as we have plenty of Priests about but fearless could come in handy.

Kris' Libby squad failed morale and fallen back. He tried for morale to regroup as he was under half strength and failed, the Priest then joined for security. I moved my squad up next turn so within 6", which means cannot regroup so, yes I guess you're right they was chased off the board.

I didn't like the Baals at all. As I've said a few times the assault cannons aren't really anti horde and not that brilliant. I think I got two rending hits through out the game and Kris wasn't even bothered about them TBH. I've alos dropped the Devs too as this is the second game they haven't done a lot really and I have enough long range fire power.

I've tweaked the list by adding another Honour Guard squad with several power weapons. I've given a hand flamer to a single elite Priest just because of spare points and taking a single Vindicator. The H.G give me more Priests, more bodies, more Razors and power weaps but best of all those Priests aren't I.C which means they cannot be singled out and don't give away kill points. Vindicator should add some much needed template help for hordes.

I cannot count the number of times I have played a BA player and we end up rolling RT halfway through the game. I like to do it just so we might remember next time and I know one guy who made really cool markers for RT squads so he would remember (he wanted to use his awesome markers).

I have found I really like taking Vindicators in pairs and I agree that the Baals seem to work towards strengths this list already has and not 'cover' weaknesses.

I thought ATSKNF meant you do not need to check morale to regroup, even at half strength but I could be wrong.

It seems like Honor Guard are much better priced in the BA codex, they always seemed too expensive to me for vanilla marines.

On an unrelated note, that Jump Pack list Kris run's is really growing on me from reading battle reports. I don't think I would want to play against it...it has a ton of PA FNP bodies with FC...

The all razorback list has serious weaknesses. The biggest being that those 5 man squads (while they did do some damage) get eaten by full squads of dedicated assault units. also if your opponent is not mech, then your razorbacks become much less useful as you can't use them to deny mobility. The worst nightmare of your razorback list would be an ork army with just boy squads and some lootas.

bagtagger wrote:The all razorback list has serious weaknesses. The biggest being that those 5 man squads (while they did do some damage) get eaten by full squads of dedicated assault units. also if your opponent is not mech, then your razorbacks become much less useful as you can't use them to deny mobility. The worst nightmare of your razorback list would be an ork army with just boy squads and some lootas.

lolwut - just get 2-3 razorbacks to assault the same group of boys at a time. Blood angels in razorbacks have the mobility to do just that. 5 man squads - ESPECIALLY - ones backed up by priests or librarians are pretty nasty little buggers.

lol, you've got your own cherub LOS checking servitor!



"yup, dad, you can see them but they get 4+ cover!"

Not if you can't kill the Lootas in cover reliably and they pop 1-2 razorbacks a turn and leave you in the open for boys to eat.

calypso2ts wrote:I cannot count the number of times I have played a BA player and we end up rolling RT halfway through the game. I like to do it just so we might remember next time and I know one guy who made really cool markers for RT squads so he would remember (he wanted to use his awesome markers).

I have found I really like taking Vindicators in pairs and I agree that the Baals seem to work towards strengths this list already has and not 'cover' weaknesses.

I thought ATSKNF meant you do not need to check morale to regroup, even at half strength but I could be wrong.

It seems like Honor Guard are much better priced in the BA codex, they always seemed too expensive to me for vanilla marines.

On an unrelated note, that Jump Pack list Kris run's is really growing on me from reading battle reports. I don't think I would want to play against it...it has a ton of PA FNP bodies with FC...

I think some bases with blood drops on them and then varnished would look pretty cool TBH. Might make me some of those...

I always like taking tanks in pairs, unfortunately no room for the second Vindicator without cutting a troops choice and I really need them TBH.

ATSKNF lets you auto regroup even if under half strength, but if enemy units are within 6" then no regroupy. Now that I think about it I think we might have got something wrong some where or my memory is going in my old age

Haven't checked vanilla Marines Command Squad points, but Angels have the benefit of a Priest which gives feel no pain 6" radius instead of just the squad like the Command Squad, a Priest alone is 50 points so for 65 you're getting another 4 SGTs for that, not bad.

Kris' jump pack is a pain in the arse and Kris is getting more confident with it and using it correctly too...

bagtagger wrote:The all razorback list has serious weaknesses. The biggest being that those 5 man squads (while they did do some damage) get eaten by full squads of dedicated assault units. also if your opponent is not mech, then your razorbacks become much less useful as you can't use them to deny mobility. The worst nightmare of your razorback list would be an ork army with just boy squads and some lootas.

I wouldn't say serious weaknesses, that's just how Razorback lists are as you can only get 6 models per transport. Razorbacks can also maul or take out a enemy unit a turn with the volume of fire power, but that's how it is, melta heavy lists are pants against none mech lists too. The Angels should handle Ork lists as long as I charge multiple Angel squads into the Boyz, being I5 means I strike first hit on 4+ and wound on 3+ and I've taken power weaps where possible to do this Razorbacks will deal with the Lootas for a distance, but this may take time.

warboss wrote:lol, you've got your own cherub LOS checking servitor!

"yup, dad, you can see them but they get 4+ cover!"

That would be Kris' cherub giving tactical advice

Yeah, this game was going to be tough for you. As you said, it was a matter of who got into assault, and your opponent had jump packs while you were stuck in closed-topped transports that leaked KP like a sieve.

Kind of surprised I didn't see many assaults against your vehicles. Assault marines have krak grenades, don't they? Also, I'm a little surprised I didn't see more squads melta-exploding a razorback and then assaulting the squad inside.

Ailaros wrote:Yeah, this game was going to be tough for you. As you said, it was a matter of who got into assault, and your opponent had jump packs while you were stuck in closed-topped transports that leaked KP like a sieve.

Kind of surprised I didn't see many assaults against your vehicles. Assault marines have krak grenades, don't they? Also, I'm a little surprised I didn't see more squads melta-exploding a razorback and then assaulting the squad inside.

Also, being str 5 on the charge 90% of the time means you can put the pain down on vehicles especially when they're so clustered

Good battle report, I noticed one thing though


Marines fight marines. Whoever looses, I WIN!

Hard fought game mercer! Good to see Kris' list do well. One thing, on the Baal's why not Flamestorm cannons? Seems like they would do better against non-mech armies.

Nice batrep. Go Blangels!

Ailaros wrote:Yeah, this game was going to be tough for you. As you said, it was a matter of who got into assault, and your opponent had jump packs while you were stuck in closed-topped transports that leaked KP like a sieve.

Kind of surprised I didn't see many assaults against your vehicles. Assault marines have krak grenades, don't they? Also, I'm a little surprised I didn't see more squads melta-exploding a razorback and then assaulting the squad inside.

While Kris has jump packs to get into assault quickly, I have armour to protect me. If he comes too close and hasn't popped my transport or I'm close enough to get into combat then he ends up taking the pain. He failed to pop some Razorbacks shooting and did the damage in assault which let me assault him next turn. He needs to bust my transports and then assault after. It's a game really, I need to get close enough and multi assault Kris' squads and he needs to pop my transports and assault me, it's however does the job first, though I believe I haev the benefit with the range and ap2 guns which means Kris has to come to me with his short range meltaguns.

Kraks indeed, he just didn't manage to assault my vehicles that much because when my 5 man squads assault (not upped to 6 man in new list) they do pack a punch thanks to Priests and power weapons . Unfortunately for Kris his meltas had the same luck as my lascannons wounding; he popped one or none in the shooting phase and the deed was done in assault allowing me to counter assault him next turn with mass squads.

Chaos Lord Gir wrote:Good battle report, I noticed one thing though


Marines fight marines. Whoever looses, I WIN!

Thanks

Sigmatron wrote:Hard fought game mercer! Good to see Kris' list do well. One thing, on the Baal's why not Flamestorm cannons? Seems like they would do better against non-mech armies.

Was a good game and I'm glad Kris won this one, only once I helped him and that was at the end and by then he had won anyway.

TBH mate I was trying assault cannons as I keep getting told how "awezomez" they are, they're not. I'm trying flamestorm variation tomorrow. If flamestorms don't work (which I think they will) I'm going double Vinicator as I know how those work.

irongustavius wrote:Nice batrep. Go Blangels!

Thanks, which Angels you supporting?

SOunds good, only thing is I didnt think ICs could join units that are falling back, so the priest and libby+marine would have remained seperate.

Outflanking flamestorms are nasty.

Just checked, you're correct. Thanks

umm what do the predators have??
I know 1 has an Auto cannon and Bolter's but I'm not sure about the other one. but one thing I know from playing blood angels is that if you ever have two Baal Preds arm 1 with Flame storm and flamers and Other with auto cannon and Bolter's. Hide AC one behind cover and run your flamer tank up into close combat and all attention will be on that so your AC tank will be picking off nasty hq's *cough*Vect*cough* and if it blows up lots off dead enemies *cough*vect*cough*

Nice report, as always.
Well, in KP missions, Razorback spam has some downsides.
If I were Kris, I'd try a full DoA army without Devastators.

RonanG wrote:umm what do the predators have??
I know 1 has an Auto cannon and Bolter's but I'm not sure about the other one. but one thing I know from playing blood angels is that if you ever have two Baal Preds arm 1 with Flame storm and flamers and Other with auto cannon and Bolter's. Hide AC one behind cover and run your flamer tank up into close combat and all attention will be on that so your AC tank will be picking off nasty hq's *cough*Vect*cough* and if it blows up lots off dead enemies *cough*vect*cough*

Both Preds are Baal Preds as per the list, which are assault cannons standard, not autocannons

I've recently run double Baals again using flamestorm cannons and liked them a lot more.

wuestenfux wrote:Nice report, as always.
Well, in KP missions, Razorback spam has some downsides.
If I were Kris, I'd try a full DoA army without Devastators.

Yup kill points is a bummer :( He's tried a DoA army and I believe not his play style. He basically did the same list but with Vanguard.

I found that DoA is my play style.
Its an alpha strike army with tactical flexibility.
However, one needs at least one tougher unit in the list in order
to deal with MCs and the like.