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Hey guys,

I'm new here, just wanted to see what you think of this as a general list, I'm going to be playing against Space Marines with it.

HQ -
Shas-o Crisis suit Commander, Abursting Fragmetation Launcher, Plasma Rifle, Multi Tracker, Hardwired Drone Controller, 2xShield Drones, Iridium Armour = 170

Elite -
Crisis suit team- 2x Shas'ui with Plasma Rifles, Missle Pods and Target Locks.
Shas'vre with Plasma Rifle, Missle Pod, Multi Tracker, Hardwired Drone Controller and 2x Shield Drones = 226
Stealth Suit Team- 2x Shas'ui with Burst Cannon and Target Locks
Shas'vre with Fusion Blaster, Drone Controller and 2x Shield Drones

Troops -
8x Fire Warriors with Pulse Rifles, 1 Shas'ui with Photon Grenades = 181
8x Fire Warriors with Pulse Rifles, 1 Shas'ui with Photon Grenades = 181
8x Fire Warriors with Pulse Carbines, all with EMP Grenades, 1 Shas'ui with Photon Grenades = 167
8x Fire Warriors with Pulse Carbines, all with EMP Grenades, 1 Shas'ui with Photon Grenades = 167
Devilfish with Burst Cannon and Gun Drones = 80

Fast Attack -
8x Gun Drones = 96
Piranha x3, 1 with Fusion Blaster, all with Gun Drones = 185

Heavy Support
Broadside Suit Team -2x Broadside Shas'ui, both with Smart Missle System and Target Locks
Shas'vre with Smart Missile System, Multi Tracker, Hardwired Drone Controller and 2x Shield Drones = 265

Hammer Head with Railgun and Burst Cannons = 150

Total= 1910 (Unless I've made a mistake typing it up)

I know it's not quite 2000 points, I'd put another Gun Drone squadron in but I can't afford it right now.

So, as a general list, what do you guys think?

Thanks.

Vampiric_Penguin wrote: Shas-o Crisis suit Commander, Abursting Fragmetation Launcher, Plasma Rifle, Multi Tracker, Hardwired Drone Controller, 2xShield Drones, Iridium Armour

A bit on the fat side. Lose the Iridium.

Vampiric_Penguin wrote:Crisis suit team- 2x Shas'ui with Plasma Rifles, Missle Pods and Target Locks.

With Target Locks, they can only fire *one* of their guns. Switch to Multi-Trackers, standardly used in every list you'll find here on Dakka and other sites.

Vampiric_Penguin wrote:Shas'vre with Plasma Rifle, Missle Pod, Multi Tracker, Hardwired Drone Controller and 2x Shield Drones = 226

Skip the vre upgrade, go Team Leader instead, and gain a Bonding Knife for the same points. 'Vre is pretty much a worthless upgrade, having no real impact on h2h.

Vampiric_Penguin wrote:Stealth Suit Team- 2x Shas'ui with Burst Cannon and Target Locks
Shas'vre with Fusion Blaster, Drone Controller and 2x Shield Drones

1. Team Leader instead of vre.
2. Skip the Fusion Blaster. It splits your purpose, meaning they do two things half-assed, instead of one thing well. And, 3 Stealths in general (using that phrase a lot) ought to be used as MarkerDrone jockyes, and even then, it's not a great load out. The best use of Stealths, IMHO, is a 6 pack, al BCs, Bonded, as solely anti-Infantry.

Target Locks in general: Splitting all your fire every where means a measily armor save or there for your enemy, instead of tons of dice throws that yield many failed saves. Largely, Target Locks should only go on Broadsides and BC Railheads.

Vampiric_Penguin wrote:Troops -
8x Fire Warriors with Pulse Rifles, 1 Shas'ui with Photon Grenades = 181
8x Fire Warriors with Pulse Rifles, 1 Shas'ui with Photon Grenades = 181
8x Fire Warriors with Pulse Carbines, all with EMP Grenades, 1 Shas'ui with Photon Grenades = 167
8x Fire Warriors with Pulse Carbines, all with EMP Grenades, 1 Shas'ui with Photon Grenades = 167

Several things:

1 Carbines - so few enemy units can be reliably Pinned. *If* you had a unit of Pathfinders using MarkerLights to lower a leadership check, then okay, but you don't. Carbines are inferior to Rifles because of one less shot in 12" range and you also loose the 30".
2. So, you've got 'em with grenades, which makes sense; shoot an Assault weapon, charge what's left over ... except FWs utterly blow in h2h. What enemy infantry *would* you charge? Not even IG. This makes tau grenades completely worthless. Who don't want them having Photons because you *want* your FWs to completely die on the enemy's charge, not last two rounds of h2h, so you can shoot them on your Turn. EMPs? They aren't so good for anti-T anyway.

Make all your FWs with Rifles, and skip grenades entirely. Question: Didja already build all of these?

Vampiric_Penguin wrote:Devilfish with Burst Cannon and Gun Drones

Most players always have the DisPod. Why wouldn't you want a 4+ Save for your vehicle?

Vampiric_Penguin wrote: 8x Gun Drones

Dump 'em. Waaayyy too easily creamed. In 4e, GDs were good to take for a cheap scoring unit, but not in 5th Edition.

Vampiric_Penguin wrote:Piranha x3, 1 with Fusion Blaster, all with Gun Drones =

Flechettes would really make 'em tougher to take down.

Vampiric_Penguin wrote:Broadside Suit Team -2x Broadside Shas'ui, both with Smart Missle System and Target Locks
Shas'vre with Smart Missile System, Multi Tracker, Hardwired Drone Controller and 2x Shield Drones =

The 'vre thing again. Same points for Team Leader and a Bonding Knife, which is good, as it could alllow two surviving suits to rally.

Vampiric_Penguin wrote:Hammer Head with Railgun and Burst Cannons

The MultiTracker to move & shoot all guns at Combat Speed, DisPod, too.

Vampiric_Penguin wrote:I know it's not quite 2000 points, I'd put another Gun Drone squadron in but I can't afford it right now.

Don't. In fact, trim down to 1850. Lose the GDs and Stealths. Combine your 4 FW units, into 3 groups of 10 or 12. Make sure to put one inside the d'fish.

Your list is called a "gun line". Immobile b-sides and a couple lines of FWs. With Outflank a big part of 5e, you're going to assaulted rather quickly and there goes the show. I take it that the list includes pretty much all your models? IF so, then I have some other recommendations, depending on whacha got.

Thanks for replying, that list is my whole Tau army, and it's fully made. What are your recommendations, or should I start rewriting the list now? Thanks for taking the time to help me.

Thanks.

Vampiric_Penguin wrote:Thanks for replying, that list is my whole Tau army, and it's fully made. What are your recommendations, or should I start rewriting the list now? Thanks for taking the time to help me.

Thanks.

Your carbine FWs have just been transferred to the Pathfinder division.

It's cheaper than buying the metal PF models in the blisters. I eventually took the spare PulseRifle bits, cut the barrels into rectangular pieces, and added 'em on top of the carbine and with two dots on the end; now they look just like the PF models ... maybe their hats are a little smaller.


So, rewrite your list, with all of the trimming I mentioned, and change one unit of FWs into a unit of Pathfinders. Go the full 8. Give their d'fish at least a Dispod. If you need more points, then upgrade it to SMS, MT, and Target Array, making it a good gunboat, called a Warfish.

Aim for 1850. I'll check the thread periodically today.

Thanks a lot, I'll start rewriting now.



Thanks.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Okay, here's the rewrite:

HQ - Crisis Shas'o Aburstring Launcher, Plasma Rifle, MultiTracker, HWDC, 2x Shield Drone. 150

Elite - Crisis Suit Team - 2x Shas'ui, Plasma Rifle, Missile Pod, MultiTracker.
Shas'ui Team Leader, Plasma Rifle, Missile Pod, Multitracker, HWDC, 2x Shield Drone, Bonding Knife. = 226

Troops - Fire Warriors x12
Fire Warriors x10
Fire Warriors x10
All with Pulse Rifles, no grenades this time. = 350

Fast Attack - 8x Pathfinders, Devilfish with Disruption Pod. (Just gonna leave it with the burst cannon on the front for now) = 181
3x Piranhas, one with fusion blaster = 185

Heavy Support - Broadside Team, 2x Shas'ui, Smart Missile Systems, Target Locks.
Shas'ui Team Leader, Smart Missile System, Multitracker = 205

Hammerhead - Railgun, Burst Cannons, Multitracker, Disruption Pod = 150

Total = 1501.... Too low, or a list without crap?

Thanks again.

Okay, I'm kind of tired right now, so I'm not going to say that much.

Both your broadsides don't need target locks. Give them both A.S.S., make one a team leader, and give the team leader a target lock.

imho, piranhas are horrible. Take them if you think they work for you.

AFP and Plasma rifle do not go together. Plasma Rifle and Fusion Blaster/Missile pod does work.

Also, EMP grenades are awesome because they are. It makes me lol to have fire warriors assault a heavy vehicle like a monolith or a land raider, and on average, score 4 glancing and 2 penetrating hits. I had my fire warriors assault a monolith and blow it up first try. It made me lol, and it can be quite the surprise for your opponent when fire warriors have EMP grenades. In short, photon grenades = no. EMP grenades = YES... if you are careful.

The Bringer wrote:Both your broadsides don't need target locks. Give them both A.S.S., make one a team leader, and give the team leader a target lock.

Good point, TB. Missed that.

The Bringer wrote:imho, piranhas are horrible. Take them if you think they work for you.

I disagree with TB, although I don't own any. The reason, TB, why they're great is the armor 11 making them hard to bring down for infantry, nearly always having moved Cruising Speed. Combined with Flechettes, DisPod & TA, they're great anti-T, and require a concentrated amount of the enemy's anti-T to bring a squadron of 'em down. For a piranha squadron, it would be the *one* decent time to use Decoy Launchers, given vehicle squadron game mechanics (Immobilize results being BAD).

The Bringer wrote:AFP and Plasma rifle do not go together. Plasma Rifle and Fusion Blaster/Missile pod does work.

Minor point, but, VamPenguin, he's right.

The Bringer wrote: It made me lol, and it can be quite the surprise for your opponent when fire warriors have EMP grenades. In short, photon grenades = no. EMP grenades = YES... if you are careful.

I'll agree that most opponents *will* be surprised if you use EMPs.

I have seen a squad of 3 pirahana with fusions do bad things to tanks. Not a huge game breaker, but being fast means they can help nuke those pesky tanks hiding from your broadsides. They can also put decent dents in hev infantry that's been diversified with fnp. I wouldn't spend much on them tho. Just basic kit plus fusions. If you have points to spare maybe dpods..

Just my 2 bits.

Thanks to you all for the replies. I'm going to keep the list as it is for now though, except I'm going to give the other 2 piranhas fusion blasters and them all disruption pods, decoy launchers and flechette dischargers. They are going to be a tank hunting squadron, nabbing those vehicles in cover. I'm going to see how this new list plays against the Marines on Wednesday, and if it works, I'll keep it. If not then I'll add in the other ideas you guys have given me. Right now I'm going to read up on using markerlights, to make sure I know what I'm going to be doing!

Once again, thanks everybody.

Right.. uh, yeah. I'm going to list the most important events of the battle, as I didn't write down everything that happened or when.

The game turned out to be an Annihilation with the pitched battle scenario. My Tau managed to seize the initiative, much to the annoyance of the Space Marines. My railguns managed to wreck the SM Rhino eventually, but not the Landraider.

My Crisis Suit team destroyed all but one of the SM scout team- who then deployed a 10 man terminator squad.... yeah.

My Pathfinders came in handy in gathering another kill point with the Markerlights, thankfully. In the end, after we rolled for the fifth turn, my opponent said we could agree on an honourable draw and say neither team won. I personally though there was nothing honourable about, but decided to stick with the Tau idea of retreating rather than dying, to regroup and strike again at another time. The draw was the better option, as the Space Marines were winning 6-4 on kill points. So that's another draw, then.


I think the Pathfinders were a good idea, I will definitely use them again in the future. The team leader with bonding knife idea seems good, although I've not tested it. For what it's forth though, I'll use it again. I personally believe the Piranha squad is much better off with all three having fusion blasters, so that will stay. And giving the Devilfish, Piranha's and Hammerhead all their upgrades was worthwhile.

Thanks for all your input, people. I really appreciated you taking the time to help em with my list, there were times in the game where I was thankfully for following your suggestions.

Once again, thanks everyone.