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I have been wondering, does a TA shas'el or a shas'o have more effectiveness? i have heard both. I like the Shas'o because he has an incredible statline for someone so cheap, and I like BS 5 and 4 wounds

Shas'El with Targetting Array = BS5 for 15pts less than a Shas'O. The 4 wounds isn't amazingly incredible when he's still most likely to be targetted by a lascannon, close combat ability is pointless and the extra leadership is negligible.

A Shas'O is only really useful when you've got nothing to spend the points on, as a Shas'El does it all for less. Leadership 10 is nice at times, but unnecessary all the time, BS5 is easily obtained by a Shas'El and 4 wounds doesn't mean anything vs a lascannon to the face, but it makes him slightly hardier vs small arms.

Shas'el is more sensible, Shas'o is more fun. It's easy to go overboard with options with your commander..."lets take Stims...and Shield generator...and Drones..." you may end up with 150+ point commander which is difficult to kill, but in the end, is just another Fireknife (or whatever). But sometimes it's just fun to load Shas'o up on wargear and you can actually assault some weak enemy units.

that sums it up most of the time. I personaly go with the shas'o and stick him in a squad to "protect' him from instant death.

okay

what do you guys play?

stompydakka wrote: okay

what do you guys play?

all my lists have

shas'o with plasma rifle, missile pod, multi-tracker and two shield drones.

he meets up with a fireknife squad giving me 4 fireknife and 4 shield drones.


woop! new rank!

thanks. is a helios shas o worth it?

Economy option: Shas'El w/ Targeting array, Airburst, Missile pod, HW Multitracker, one Drone (Gun or shield). 107 points, doesn't die to first Krak missile, fairly durable against small arms fire (esp. if I also throw in Stims).

what is the best anti MEQ build for either?

stompydakka wrote:thanks. is a helios shas o worth it?

Imo, only if your running two coms.

helios are effectively expendable. If you run one it would have to have a bodyguard, and would possabley die.

Because they are so close to the enemy, they are kinda dont last very long, except if they take out the enemy in one shot.


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stompydakka wrote:what is the best anti MEQ build for either?

both are good. Firekifes are good for there long range.
Helios are more damaging but need to be close to the target. harder to keep alive.

if I had a helios w/ 2 other helios suits, I could take out most MEQ units, that was my thought....
since I play mostly MEQ armies, i was wondering...

Shas'El with Shield Drone and Targetting Array costs the same as a Shas'O. You get four wounds, one with an Invul(The drone) and are still BS5.

Since FNP is being thrown around like a midgit in a bar, I go Plasma Rifle/ Missle Pod on all suits. Missle pods are nice because of the range and High(ish) Strength and long range.

stompydakka wrote:if I had a helios w/ 2 other helios suits, I could take out most MEQ units, that was my thought....
since I play mostly MEQ armies, i was wondering...

a helios com with helios bodyguards take out about 5 meqs while up close.

Iur_tae_mont wrote:
Since FNP is being thrown around like a midgit in a bar,

lol

so, are Fireknives just the best?

my suits are..

shas'o helios

2x 'ui helios

3x TA deathrain 'uis

monat w/ TLFB, Flamer

Plasma Rifle/ Missle Pod is good against MEQ and I like it over Plasma Rifle/ Fusion Blaster because Missle Pods have about 3 times the range of the Fusion Blaster and if you need to, you can still pop some transports with the Missle Pods.

I run 3 squads of 3 Shas'ui Fireknives and a Shas'el Fireknive with Targetting array and shield drone

i dont really have the points for that... lol.
is my build ok, or are less fireknives a better option?

How many points do you play?

1500

To consider:
In tourneys, when surviving HQs are often a secondary objective, having the 'O is better: 2 guns, Shield Gen, hwMT and still BS5, with the extra wound.

Non-RTT missions, the Shas'El with Target Array makes the most sense, especially at 1500, stompydakka.

I'll stay out of the gun choice debate, although I field a FK+ Shas'el.

In my opinion there is no 1 weapon combination that's better then another over all. There are builds that are better at doing certain things then others which is where you have to decide what you want your battlesuits to do (including your command suits) and then equipt them to do that job. I will say this though, the most versatile all around weapon for battlesuits is the missle launcher.


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Also I play 2k games with a partial Ninja army so I usually field both a Shas'o and Shas'el. The Shas'o has a bodyguard and deepstrikes in and my Shas'el is in charge of getting my reserve troops in when I want them to with my pathfinder devilfish taking care of the where.

Not quite true. If you are in a MEQ heavy(shouldn't be too hard, T4 3+ troops are only about 1/2 of the codexes) environment Then Fireknife would be better than TL Flamer.

Actually it is true. FK would be better in an MEQ situation, but that's because they're focussed on doing a certain thing. In a horde situation, FK would be inferior to TL-Flamer or Deathrain etc. due to the low output of shots.

TL flamer?
if i am misinformed.... XD sorry
i was under the impression that Helios=plasma rifle + fusion blaster

'is this incorrect?

nope. im slightly confused what there on about too. Fireknifes put out 4 shots per turn within 12". death rain would only put out 2 twin linked shots???how is this better???

TL flamer, you could hit 4 maybe with one template, so 8. but its going to die very fast at that range. Helios will put out 3 shots but they will pop transports quite easyly with melta and ap1

Iur_tae_mont wrote:Not quite true. If you are in a MEQ heavy(shouldn't be too hard, T4 3+ troops are only about 1/2 of the codexes) environment Then Fireknife would be better than TL Flamer.

Not sure how what I said is "not quite true" considering what you said does nothing but support my statement?


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stompydakka wrote:TL flamer?
if i am misinformed.... XD sorry
i was under the impression that Helios=plasma rifle + fusion blaster

'is this incorrect?

No you're right. A Plasma Rifle and Fusion Blaster is a Helios. He was just using the TL Flamers as an example.

If you google search Battlesuit Weapon Configurations a PDF should pull up from ATT that has all the weapon combinations for battlesuits and their associated names.

My point is that differant weapon configurations are going to be better at differant things. Some are better at popping tanks, some are better at killing MEQs and some are better against hordes. When giving your battlesuits weapons you need to decide what you want that battlesuit to do and give it the best gear to be able to do it.

Some people take 2 or 3 squads (of course these are for higher games) and each will be assinged a differant function. One squad will be equipped for taking out infantry hordes, another will be equipped to take out vehicles and the last will be there to take out elite infantry like Terminators, Tyrant Guard and MegaNobs.

Others will mix their weapons in one squad so that each suit will have a differant purpose. If there are 3 suits in a team 1 suit will be long ranged, the 2nd will be medium ranged and the last will be close ranged. These differances in weapons also allow you to use the wound allocation rules in the same way as Ork Nobz or Space Wolf Wolf Guard. It allows you to divide up your wounds amongst the squad instead of focusing them on one model.

And when you have a casualty it allows you to remove the suit thats purpose is no longer needed. For instance removing the long range suit instead of your mid and short ranged suits because the enemy is fairly close. While the long range could still shoot them it probably woulden't be as effective as the suits with weapons that are designed for when the enemy is closer. So you would want to remove that suit vs the other 2. These are all things that you'll learn and get used to.

(If I make you sound Like a newby I apologise, I can't remember if you said how long you've been playing or not )

I run a Shas'el with T/L fusion blasters, Stim, Shield Generators and Iridium Armour. Like 83pts I believe, very good at DS and tank killing

Krellnus wrote:I run a Shas'el with T/L fusion blasters, Stim and Iridium Armour. Like 83pts I believe, very good at DS and tank killing

It's also illegal. I count 2 weapons systems, 0 support systems and 2 wargear options.

Ledabot wrote:nope. im slightly confused what there on about too. Fireknifes put out 4 shots per turn within 12". death rain would only put out 2 twin linked shots???how is this better???

because the shots are twin linked and have theire full potentail at range up to 30", they are BS4 with my config, and they are much cheaper than a fireknife.


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Speaking of Advanced tau Tactca, there is also a PDF that I still have somewhere that is a reminder sheet for what do to each turn (or something like that.)

really?

post a link please!