Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

This will be the last of five in the series of VR-5 frame Leviathans. You can see more about this model and check out some recent projects on my Blog.
http://dreamforge-games.blogspot.com/

The first release of the Mortis is scheduled for December, the others to follow soon after.

All the best,
Mark-

Love it! (and as someone who already owns three titans my love means its a pretty likely purchase depending on price point ).

I'm really looking forward to seeing these designs in production, and getting a final idea on the kits price tag.

Jack

Really, really nice work. The angles and ornamentation on the armor are particularly well done.

Is the chassis actually larger than your other Leviathans? Any chance of a scale pic (ruler scale, adjacent model, or whatever else works)?

Savnock wrote:Really, really nice work. The angles and ornamentation on the armor are particularly well done.

Is the chassis actually larger than your other Leviathans? Any chance of a scale pic (ruler scale, adjacent model, or whatever else works)?

Same basic body as the other Leviathans.
Each individual has different heads, weapons, shoulders and sometimes armor and/or engine details that set the apart from the other Leviathans in this chassis design.
They all stand roughly 9-9.5" tall depending on how you glue the legs together.

Azazel, will look larger due to the shoulders and head size.

Out of curiousity, what is the expected price range for these beasts of war?

And when are you re-releasing the black widow? I have a turret that I got second-hand thats been sitting on my desk for the better part of 4 years, waiting for weapons and legs.

cosmic wrote:Out of curiosity, what is the expected price range for these beasts of war?

And when are you re-releasing the black widow? I have a turret that I got second-hand thats been sitting on my desk for the better part of 4 years, waiting for weapons and legs.

I don't have anything in stone on the price yest because I still need to price out the resin use for each model. I also need to get some quotes back from some casters so I can move production out of house. Best guess right now is $275 to $350 depending on what I find out.

Wow Chaos, A Black Widow....I think I only made about ten of those? I have some bad news on the Black Widow... When I re-release it I doubt it will be the exact size of your current turret. In order to keep the cost down I need to adjust it down wards in scale slightly.

Nice looking.

& remind me Warjack.

:tear: ah well, I guess I can find another use for the turret I have then. I could see why you might need to scale it down though, the turret alone is about the size of a land raider.

And 250-350 doesn't sound too bad really. i assume these are about the size of a warhound?

i may have to buy one when they're released

Mark,

Looking great! At this stage, can you let us know what weapons will be available indiviually in December? (Am definitely thinking of getting one or two...)

Nice to see Dreamforge up and running!

Padre^.

Hi Padre, The first weapon options for the Mortis are:

Right Arm Claw -or- Right Arm Vulkan
Left Arm Scythe

In January? I will release the Crusader:

Right Arm Claw -or- Right Arm Vulkan
Left Arm Sword -or- Left Arm Vulkan

Holy poo-poo, those are sweet!

Any thought on extra weapon prices?

Jack

Jackmojo wrote:Any thought on extra weapon prices?

Jack

I think were looking at $30-45 depending on the weapon. Some take more molds and resin than others.

The Armor upgrade that will add armor to the arms and legs will likely run $35-40 depending on whether or not you need the larger pointy stomper feet with the armor. It uses four to five molds but does not use a load of resin and the lack of small sharp details will likely prolong the mold life.

I may add discounts to this if they are ordered with the main kit or as full sets of multiple weapons? just not sure yet.

december you say? hmmm christmas gift for me then!

TyraelVladinhurst wrote:december you say? hmmm christmas gift for me then!

PLEASE keep in mind that production will be limited until I can move them out of house to another casting service. This will take some time as all 30-32 molds will need two to three duplicates.

I just want to make sure that everyone understands that with the number of molds, 30-32 right now, that the most I could see making on my own is one kit per day. While the kinks are being worked out of the molds (vent and sprue size and location) it may be even less than that. Ideally I can find a caster that can handle three units per day that wont charge an arm and a leg for their service. Equally important is an eye for detail with a good understanding of what is and is not acceptable for a completed casting... I will need to negotiate a Terms of Service Agreement so that we are all on the same page and we minimize Uh-oh moments...time will tell.

I'm a firm believer in being upfront and setting reasonable expectations so we minimize hard feelings. I'm just not sure what the best way to deal with the number of initial orders will be? First come first served? lottery? Hell I don't know... whats your thought on this conundrum?

Out of curiousity, nosegolbin have you considered plastic production?

chaos0xomega wrote:Out of curiousity, nosegolbin have you considered plastic production?

Haven't looked into it yet, I sent you a PM... If memory serves you did a bit of digging on this topic for your project?

Another idea would be one of the rapid prototyping direct resellers (shapeways is the one I am thinking of specifically), who print and deliver it on a per order basis, directly to your customers.

I certainly wouldn't mind a lower detail shapeways version of these, if the price were commensurately less, if nothing else it would be great for some of the nifty looking bits on the kits I'd want for conversions but am unlikely to order a whole kit for

Jack

Jackmojo wrote:Another idea would be one of the rapid prototyping direct resellers (shapeways is the one I am thinking of specifically), who print and deliver it on a per order basis, directly to your customers.

I certainly wouldn't mind a lower detail shapeways version of these, if the price were commensurately less, if nothing else it would be great for some of the nifty looking bits on the kits I'd want for conversions but am unlikely to order a whole kit for

Jack

Hi Jack,

I'm not sure how that would work out for you? Direct print would be ALLOT more expensive. Even on the Objet low settings your looking at over $2300.00. Your not just paying for the printed component, your also paying the support materials. As this model has many components that are large and curved, it requires a lot of support material in the print. Although the cubic centimeter cost of support material is roughly 50% the cost of the print material, the volume of support material was likely 4 to 6X that of the actual print surfaces.

How do I know? I ran the files through Shapeways when I quoted two other vendors. I received back quotes that went up to $3200.00. I decided to go with Moddler for the print because he has always done right by me and he always runs high-rez. With the small details and surface quality I required, this bugger needed to be a high rez print. Even at high-rez it took two months to bench and clean the 200 parts to a pattern ready condition.

I cant speak to very small detail parts but the price I charge for full components such as weapons is still far less than the cost to print them yourself. And they have been Benched and cleaned for a quality surface.

Ah, I bow to your superior experience then, all of the things I've gotten through shapeways were smallish components, so I must have had a jaundiced view of the overall cost (that also helps explain why so many of the scfi models in their store are super small).

Thanks for the info though, I'm always interested in this stuff.

Jack

Nice to see an update, Ive been following the blog for a while now.

Price point is acceptable, however you will want to work on the production rate. People arent going to be happy about plunking down several hundred dollars and waiting weeks or even months for the product to arrive. I know it is for me. Id like to order 2 of the variants...but $550-$700ish payed out with an unknown delivery time is a bit of a discouragement to actually ordering.

As far as order priority...ALWAYS first come first serve. The thought that orders would be filled randomly would pretty much seal the deal on not ordering.

I LOVE the models, but Im already getting a bit uneasy about actually ordering...between the low production rate and you not knowing what order to fill orders in...I dunno...I might have to sit back and wait for those who do order to post their experiences.


PLEASE...work on the service end of things. That will be the make or break for you.

Just to make clear...Im not some random guy looking for things to complain about...If there are no big issues you can count me in for 1 or 2 early next year, possibly all 5 of them within the rest of the year. I am more than willing to shelll out the cash for models that exceptional...but Im not willing to play the pay now get it whenever game.

Mad4Minis wrote:Nice to see an update, Ive been following the blog for a while now.

Price point is acceptable, however you will want to work on the production rate. People arent going to be happy about plunking down several hundred dollars and waiting weeks or even months for the product to arrive.

Hi Mad4Minis,

I think I must not have been clear on my question or concerns. I agree with you completely. I don't do Pre-orders on non existent product. I think thats a recipe for disaster. Tried that once and failed... never again!

The question is how to handle the orders? How to keep everyone happy? I don't know that I can.... At this point my gut is telling me to use a shopping cart with an in stock level that is replenished by me as I cast kits and have them boxed. If there is no inventory on hand and ready to go, you cannot make the purchase.

My point really is that I think there will initially be more demand than supply... I'm just don't see any way to get everyone taken care of who wanted this for X-Mas.

All the best,
Mark-

Hey Mark,

Thanks for the quick response. So, we'll be looking at the Vulcan, Claw and Scythe before Christmas, and the other weapons in the New Year...

Any idea what weapons will be next to go into production, or a rough idea when they'll all be available?

Cheers,

Padre^.

Looks great, I cannot view your blog in work, is this a game system of your own design?

What current system would it be similar to?

NoseGoblin wrote:

Mad4Minis wrote:Nice to see an update, Ive been following the blog for a while now.

Price point is acceptable, however you will want to work on the production rate. People arent going to be happy about plunking down several hundred dollars and waiting weeks or even months for the product to arrive.

Hi Mad4Minis,

I think I must not have been clear on my question or concerns. I agree with you completely. I don't do Pre-orders on non existent product. I think thats a recipe for disaster. Tried that once and failed... never again!

The question is how to handle the orders? How to keep everyone happy? I don't know that I can.... At this point my gut is telling me to use a shopping cart with an in stock level that is replenished by me as I cast kits and have them boxed. If there is no inventory on hand and ready to go, you cannot make the purchase.

My point really is that I think there will initially be more demand than supply... I'm just don't see any way to get everyone taken care of who wanted this for X-Mas.

All the best,
Mark-

A shopping cart with a current stock would be excellent. I would allow people to order even if out of stock, but make it clear that it is out, and there may be a wait, even better if there is a good estimate on a ready date. No one likes a surprise wait. No worries on xmas for me...the Crusader is the one Im interested in first...since its the second release in guessing it will be early next year. Not sure what my second will be yet, only one im a bit iffy on is the Mortis...work is great in just not sure Im feeling the head. Of course, if I end up collecting the other 4 Im sure Ill get that one just to have the full set.

Padre wrote:Hey Mark,

Thanks for the quick response. So, we'll be looking at the Vulcan, Claw and Scythe before Christmas, and the other weapons in the New Year...

Any idea what weapons will be next to go into production, or a rough idea when they'll all be available?

Cheers,

Padre^.

I hope to have all of the three remaining variants printed at the same time and released within a week of one another. This will involve benching them, making molds, instructions and box art. Thats a bit of work... it will need to be done while I am casting the current line. Estimating an exact date is difficult.

Radius wrote:Looks great, I cannot view your blog in work, is this a game system of your own design?

What current system would it be similar to?

I'm not sure what game it resembles the most?
The game system is called Iron Core, its vehicle centric and designed to be played with a small number of Tanks or Leviathan and a few infantry support. It plays more like a WWII tank sim. Not every shot will hot and not every hit will kill. It's designed to factor in armor thickness and angle of the plate without needing to jump through a bunch of hoops to resolve the round penetration. Most of the hit and pen data are extrapolations of WWII tank data.

Mad4Minis wrote: A shopping cart with a current stock would be excellent. I would allow people to order even if out of stock, but make it clear that it is out, and there may be a wait, even better if there is a good estimate on a ready date. No one likes a surprise wait. No worries on xmas for me...the Crusader is the one I'm interested in first...since its the second release in guessing it will be early next year. Not sure what my second will be yet, only one I'm a bit iffy on is the Mortis...work is great in just not sure I'm feeling the head. Of course, if I end up collecting the other 4 I'm sure Ill get that one just to have the full set.

Yeah, the Deaths Head is one people seem to love or hate. I'm not sure if I can find a shopping cart that will do all that? The part that I have not yet found is one that provides an estimate of date based on the current outstanding orders that do not have stock on hand....I'll give it a look.....

NoseGoblin wrote:

Padre wrote:Hey Mark,

Thanks for the quick response. So, we'll be looking at the Vulcan, Claw and Scythe before Christmas, and the other weapons in the New Year...

Any idea what weapons will be next to go into production, or a rough idea when they'll all be available?

Cheers,

Padre^.

I hope to have all of the three remaining variants printed at the same time and released within a week of one another. This will involve benching them, making molds, instructions and box art. Thats a bit of work... it will need to be done while I am casting the current line. Estimating an exact date is difficult.

Radius wrote:Looks great, I cannot view your blog in work, is this a game system of your own design?

What current system would it be similar to?

I'm not sure what game it resembles the most?
The game system is called Iron Core, its vehicle centric and designed to be played with a small number of Tanks or Leviathan and a few infantry support. It plays more like a WWII tank sim. Not every shot will hot and not every hit will kill. It's designed to factor in armor thickness and angle of the plate without needing to jump through a bunch of hoops to resolve the round penetration. Most of the hit and pen data are extrapolations of WWII tank data.

Mad4Minis wrote: A shopping cart with a current stock would be excellent. I would allow people to order even if out of stock, but make it clear that it is out, and there may be a wait, even better if there is a good estimate on a ready date. No one likes a surprise wait. No worries on xmas for me...the Crusader is the one I'm interested in first...since its the second release in guessing it will be early next year. Not sure what my second will be yet, only one I'm a bit iffy on is the Mortis...work is great in just not sure I'm feeling the head. Of course, if I end up collecting the other 4 I'm sure Ill get that one just to have the full set.

Yeah, the Deaths Head is one people seem to love or hate. I'm not sure if I can find a shopping cart that will do all that? The part that I have not yet found is one that provides an estimate of date based on the current outstanding orders that do not have stock on hand....I'll give it a look.....

Im not sure if there is a cart that will do that...its something you might have to manually make a note of in the item.

I like the sounds of your rule system, gonna have to check it out. Overall Im extremely impressed with what your doing, keep it up.

Just saw your tentative release date for the mortis (which I am also sort of on the fence on).

Totally looking forward to you getting these guys moving out the door

Jack

Any guestimates for the other releases for the others, or at least the Crusader? The crusader will be a must have for me, most likely followed by the Gabriel as soon as it comes out.

I was reading your blog...nice to see the cost breakdown but possibly not necessary. Anyone who will cry about $350 for something of this size and quality is nuts. Hell a Forgeworld titan will run you close to $1000 with all its accessories, and IMO they arent nearly as cool.