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astrolux444 wrote:man i was going through storage today and i found a folder with some old Virtual World simulator printouts. that'll take you back.

That place gave me one of my best Mad Dog [Vulture] vareint the Vulture V4
6x SSRM-6 [4 Tons Ammo]
6x ERSL

It will Stip almost all the Armor off Maurader in one Volley

skyth wrote:Wait...Urbies have style? They are just walking trash cans...Didn't you know that house Liao recruits urbanmech pilots solely from Sanitation Engineers?

Mattlov is confused. Urbies have uniqueness. Well as unique as a mass produced mech can get, and some players do have a lot of them.
However conversely a Panther really does have the style, it's a light mech that does heavy mech impersonations; the big fish in the small pond. The clicky tech mech looks crap, but ignore that, look at old school 3025 book, the Panther is a double helping of mean. It looks like it has just seen you, is pissed off and is about to do something about it:

Panther looks cooll, but it's slow for a light mech. I like them, but I've always perfered Wolfhounds

As far as ther Jihad is concerned, it was heading in more or less the right direction plotwise. dont eliminte technology just distribute it randomly and sparingly.

So you get 3025 with battlearmour and some clan era equipment thrown in piecemeal.

Where it breaks down is in the creation of many new factions, the artibrary destruction of other ones unconnected with ther Jihad and the means by which the plot change was introduced.

It also doesnt help that factions which would not under any circumstances adopt the clicky tech method of organisation do so. Jade Falcons with tanks infantry and agromechs and not Jade Falcons anymore. It could possibly go for some types of Wolf, they are spheroid lovers anyway due to the dragoons and Phelan's lot. but I cannot see the other clans going far down that route either.

Also too many factions haver access to too many forms of battle armour, if the factories were smashed why has everyone got stockpiles of every design under the suns?

Here is one from the 1st ed CritterTech called the Dodgerman

Its based on a Level-1 Rifleman
Give it 19 HS
5/8 move
2 PPC
Guess what they they go the tonnage for this.

Anpu42 wrote:Here is one from the 1st ed CritterTech called the Dodgerman

Its based on a Level-1 Rifleman
Give it 19 HS
5/8 move
2 PPC
Guess what they they go the tonnage for this.

I would guess stripping out the other weapons. At least, that's the way I'd do it. Yanking the two AC/5 & ammo, 2 L.Lasers, and 2 M.Lasers for two PPC leaves 15 tons, minus 9 for the extra HS, leaves 6 tons for the engine upgrade, which is in the general ballpark of correct (don't have my construction rules handy...).

But given the name... I bet you stripped off some armor, didn't you?

Yep they ripped off Armor of all things along will all the other weapons systems.
I field this one all the time, just keep thinking "I am a 60 ton Light Mech, "I am a 60 ton Light Mech, "I am a 60 ton Light Mech"
I have used them with great effect, with the flipple arms and no Armor who cares wich way you are facing.

My own version of the Rifleman is i just put the 2 ML out the back and call that my rear armor. This keeps me from firing the MLs out of fustration to early and getting realy hot.
I also run it a little hot most of the time 7-12 points of heat is normal. I do ocasianly back it int battle and then turn around ounce my "Rear Armor" is gone.
This tactic has worked great, I even fought a Zues to a draw once in a arena match.

Now I remind you this is all with Level-1 Tech

IMO level 1 tech is the best, really teaches you the game, and you learn respect for your weapons. yee ol machinegun becomes popular when in a p-hawk facing infantry for instance or when youve opened up a torso.

Level 1 tech is part of the game, certainly not the best part of it though.

And playing Solaris-style bouts teaches you the game. Any fears you have of of heat or disrespect you may have for various weapons (Machine guns being a good example) all go away in a Solaris style free-for-all or some team-games. I can honestly say that despite having played BTech for years, I really didn't know how to use my 'Mechs until we started a Solaris campaign.

I no longer fear the heat scale, and have a respect for weapons I had dismissed earlier.

H.B.M.C. wrote:Level 1 tech is part of the game, certainly not the best part of it though.

And playing Solaris-style bouts teaches you the game. Any fears you have of of heat or disrespect you may have for various weapons (Machine guns being a good example) all go away in a Solaris style free-for-all or some team-games. I can honestly say that despite having played BTech for years, I really didn't know how to use my 'Mechs until we started a Solaris campaign.

I no longer fear the heat scale, and have a respect for weapons I had dismissed earlier.

Agreed; I've played btech since 87 and when I first played Solaris-VII-style combats, I got a real healthy respect for MG's.
The one thing about level-1 style play, especially when playing with 3025 tech, it at least taught you to rely more on movement-related tactics and to not depend so much on the weapons per-se.....

Still playing now...and when I want some of my gaming group to know what mech-combat is really about, I introduce them to Solaris-VII...lol!

Anpu42 wrote:

astrolux444 wrote:man i was going through storage today and i found a folder with some old Virtual World simulator printouts. that'll take you back.

That place gave me one of my best Mad Dog [Vulture] vareint the Vulture V4
6x SSRM-6 [4 Tons Ammo]
6x ERSL

It will Stip almost all the Armor off Maurader in one Volley

one time we played without heat...i think i used that vulture varient, it was silly haha

Those Solaris-VII battles, are they based on a certain sourcebook?

It was a boxed set, it was a fun way to play only one mech.
Each turn was 4-6 seconds and each hex was 7.5m wide.
Most of the weapons had a recharge time, but Machine Guns had a Recharge of 0 and a 12 hex range, you just fliped the on switch and fired them every turn.

Anpu42 wrote:It was a boxed set, it was a fun way to play only one mech.
Each turn was 4-6 seconds and each hex was 7.5m wide.
Most of the weapons had a recharge time, but Machine Guns had a Recharge of 0 and a 12 hex range, you just fliped the on switch and fired them every turn.

A Battletech turn is split into three Solaris turns. In Solaris weapons worked differently. The machine guns for example would be less of a joke if they fired three times a turn, which is what they do in Solaris. Frankly some of the Battletech weapons should have been counter modified to work more like they did in Solaris in the main game..

H.B.M.C. wrote:

I no longer fear the heat scale, and have a respect for weapons I had dismissed earlier.

As you got triple heat sink capacity but weapons did triple heat you would get the heat pulses absent in the main game. However 'fear the heat scale?', noone goes anywhere near it. I have never seen a shutdown mech in all my years of battletech, and only known one person who claims to have seen it in game. Besides you are likely to blow up first. Sorry H' the heat scale is a joke, you get targeting penalties - which really matter long before you fget to any of the effects so commonly described in the background. However +1 and +2 to hit is so commonplace its just another modifier and the cause is easy to ignore.
the short heat scale was one of the few things I liked about clicky-tech.

Orlanth wrote:I have never seen a shutdown mech in all my years of battletech, and only known one person who claims to have seen it in game. Besides you are likely to blow up first. Sorry H' the heat scale is a joke, you get targeting penalties - which really matter long before you fget to any of the effects so commonly described in the background. However +1 and +2 to hit is so commonplace its just another modifier and the cause is easy to ignore. The short heat scale was one of the few things I liked about clicky-tech.

I have not been to one of our games then. We would have Mechs shutdown from heat all of the time.
In some places this became a tactic.
Back in the Day the maximum heat you could build was 30 even if you had the ability to produce 100 points of heat you would start your next turn at 30 points of heat. So it was go to 30, cool 30, go to 30 cool 30.
So you would get builds like this.

Type/Model: Dire Wolf (Daishi)
Mass: 100 tons

Weapons and Equipment
--------------------------------------------------------
2 ER PPCs RA
1 ER Medium Laser RA
2 ER PPCs LA
1 ER Medium Laser LA
1 ER PPC RT
1 ER PPC LT
1 ER PPC CT
1 ER Small Laser HD
1 ER PPC RL

But then they changed that rule, now life is better.

No ammo to explode though so yiou get away with that exploit. Still the pilot could take damage.

Remember you pass through all the steps on the way to 30 heat. You dont just fire two ERPPC's and there you are.

The pilot only takes damage if the life support is damaged.

The pilot only takes damage if the life support is damaged.

The pilot might also take damage from being an immobile target for a round.

Orlanth wrote:A Battletech turn is split into three Solaris turns. In Solaris weapons worked differently. The machine guns for example would be less of a joke if they fired three times a turn, which is what they do in Solaris. Frankly some of the Battletech weapons should have been counter modified to work more like they did in Solaris in the main game..

This wasn't using the original Solaris rules, this was standard BTech rules in the updated Fanpro Solaris pack, using the Solaris Map sheets and so on, in more a league/competition style.

Orlanth wrote:I have never seen a shutdown mech in all my years of battletech, and only known one person who claims to have seen it in game.

Well goody for you.

My point is I'm no longer worried about ending a turn with heat left over like I once was, and ending a turn with 10+ doesn't bother me as it once did.

Well actually H' it is rather difficult to shutdown a mech and for many designs actually impossible unless they take two slugs in the engine or bathe in lava hexes.

Orlanth wrote:Well actually H' it is rather difficult to shutdown a mech and for many designs actually impossible unless they take two slugs in the engine or bathe in lava hexes.

Wow. You must not play with many different designs. Or you play extremely cautious with the heat scale.

Mattlov wrote:

Orlanth wrote:Well actually H' it is rather difficult to shutdown a mech and for many designs actually impossible unless they take two slugs in the engine or bathe in lava hexes.

Wow. You must not play with many different designs. Or you play extremely cautious with the heat scale.

Or he only plays mechs with double heat sinks.

Remember back in 3025, when we didn't have double heart sinks, and you really had to manage your heat carefully? Remember when a basic Warhammer could generate 34 points of heat... and only dissipate 18? The Rifleman could generate 26... and only dissipate 10?

Oh yes, I remember. I still prefer to play 3025 tech level, as I think that is the true feel of the game.

Mattlov wrote:

Orlanth wrote:Well actually H' it is rather difficult to shutdown a mech and for many designs actually impossible unless they take two slugs in the engine or bathe in lava hexes.

Wow. You must not play with many different designs. Or you play extremely cautious with the heat scale.

+12 heat is as far as we dared go. Shutdown is not the big problem the +2 followed by +3 targetting is the big problem. Normally all thingsd considered we would be needed 8+ to 10+ on a shot, and would have a go on 11+ if ammo was good or heat was to spare.
Overheating to +2 fire mod really crippled your chances, i was better to fire one or two guns lessand hit than overheat waste shooting. +2 on a 2d6 scale ias crippling.

If there is anything to be said about our games we never really had anyone better than 3 gunner and piloting, maybe you lot are using 2/2 elites too often, we had 4/4 and 4/5 as average, 3/3 and 3/4 were the one per lance or company leaders.

Sheesh, ive shutdown so many times i cant count em, heat dont bother me though, pushing hte scale is part of the game, just be careful of having no case when the ammo gets hot

I never go above 7 heat if I have a choice...It's hard to get me to go above 4 heat.

skyth wrote:I never go above 7 heat if I have a choice...It's hard to get me to go above 4 heat.

You shouldn't worry about it. It's not that big a deal.