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reps0l wrote:

deejaybainbridge wrote:http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/rumor-premeasuring-ranges-40k-6th-ed/

Recap: Pretty much as the title says, pre-measuring is in. The guys spend most of time discussing on why it may speed up the game rather than slow it down. They basically feel, pre-measuring will allow players to make more definitive moves/decisions. For example, if you pre-measure 12", it may be a no-brainer to move and then assault as opposed to having to estimate and ponder the consequences of moving and not making the assault.

I suspect that they will have a random assault rule similar to fantasy to counter this. Also possible assaults are done first and not last, As with all these rumours we have to consider what other changes may be in place alongside the one's in these videos.

It does refer to the pre-measure for shooting and does not mention for moving and assaulting (unless I missed something).

reps0l wrote:

deejaybainbridge wrote:http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/rumor-premeasuring-ranges-40k-6th-ed/

Recap: Pretty much as the title says, pre-measuring is in. The guys spend most of time discussing on why it may speed up the game rather than slow it down. They basically feel, pre-measuring will allow players to make more definitive moves/decisions. For example, if you pre-measure 12", it may be a no-brainer to move and then assault as opposed to having to estimate and ponder the consequences of moving and not making the assault.

I'm all for it to be honest. Some people just aren't good at judging measurements, especially new players. Also it will stop players from cheating slightly by moving their mini's those extra few mils to get into combat.

deejaybainbridge wrote:

reps0l wrote:

deejaybainbridge wrote:http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/rumor-premeasuring-ranges-40k-6th-ed/

Recap: Pretty much as the title says, pre-measuring is in. The guys spend most of time discussing on why it may speed up the game rather than slow it down. They basically feel, pre-measuring will allow players to make more definitive moves/decisions. For example, if you pre-measure 12", it may be a no-brainer to move and then assault as opposed to having to estimate and ponder the consequences of moving and not making the assault.

I suspect that they will have a random assault rule similar to fantasy to counter this. Also possible assaults are done first and not last, As with all these rumours we have to consider what other changes may be in place alongside the one's in these videos.

It does refer to the pre-measure for shooting and does not mention for moving and assaulting (unless I missed something).

I agree. I'm not a fan of all these "rumored" changes when you hear about them one by one, but when you start looking at the larger picture I can see how they synergize with each other.

deejaybainbridge wrote:

reps0l wrote:

deejaybainbridge wrote:http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/rumor-premeasuring-ranges-40k-6th-ed/

Recap: Pretty much as the title says, pre-measuring is in. The guys spend most of time discussing on why it may speed up the game rather than slow it down. They basically feel, pre-measuring will allow players to make more definitive moves/decisions. For example, if you pre-measure 12", it may be a no-brainer to move and then assault as opposed to having to estimate and ponder the consequences of moving and not making the assault.

Also possible assaults are done first and not last

That idea is flat out terrible no matter how you look at it
Assaulty armies: Don't get to shoot and soften up the enemy before they charge in.
Shooty armies: Might not assault much, but with these rules they will never assault since they can't even soften the enemy up.
It is also counter-intuitive, or to say the opposite of BoW, it isn't "cinematic" you move towards the enemy, shooting as you advance and then charge.

There is really no reason for this rule to exist if it did, no one benefits it just weakens assault armies and makes shooty armies even less likely to assault.

As a new nid player... these rules make me wan't to stop wasting my money on GW product. Seriously year after year codex after codex they can't just find a happy medium between making money and pleasing the players? I mean sometimes they get it right but 90% of the time...

I'm also saying this as a Chaos player... seriously? 40k=fantasy now?

Laughing God wrote:As a new nid player... these rules make me wan't to stop wasting my money on GW product. Seriously year after year codex after codex they can't just find a happy medium between making money and pleasing the players? I mean sometimes they get it right but 90% of the time...

I'm also saying this as a Chaos player... seriously? 40k=fantasy now?

I wouldnt really worry about it until you either have the new rulebook in hand, or you get a chance to borrow it. Otherwise youre upsetting yourself for nothing.

Buttons wrote:

deejaybainbridge wrote:

reps0l wrote:

deejaybainbridge wrote:http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/rumor-premeasuring-ranges-40k-6th-ed/

Recap: Pretty much as the title says, pre-measuring is in. The guys spend most of time discussing on why it may speed up the game rather than slow it down. They basically feel, pre-measuring will allow players to make more definitive moves/decisions. For example, if you pre-measure 12", it may be a no-brainer to move and then assault as opposed to having to estimate and ponder the consequences of moving and not making the assault.

Also possible assaults are done first and not last

That idea is flat out terrible no matter how you look at it
Assaulty armies: Don't get to shoot and soften up the enemy before they charge in.
Shooty armies: Might not assault much, but with these rules they will never assault since they can't even soften the enemy up.
It is also counter-intuitive, or to say the opposite of BoW, it isn't "cinematic" you move towards the enemy, shooting as you advance and then charge.

There is really no reason for this rule to exist if it did, no one benefits it just weakens assault armies and makes shooty armies even less likely to assault.

Dont get me wrong I'm not saying that would be a good thing. I'm unsure myself, It works for Fantasy BUT that does not mean they are carbon copying the rules over to 40K. I'm just surgesting possibillitys on nothing but opion

deejaybainbridge wrote:

reps0l wrote:

deejaybainbridge wrote:http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/rumor-premeasuring-ranges-40k-6th-ed/

Recap: Pretty much as the title says, pre-measuring is in. The guys spend most of time discussing on why it may speed up the game rather than slow it down. They basically feel, pre-measuring will allow players to make more definitive moves/decisions. For example, if you pre-measure 12", it may be a no-brainer to move and then assault as opposed to having to estimate and ponder the consequences of moving and not making the assault.

I suspect that they will have a random assault rule similar to fantasy to counter this. Also possible assaults are done first and not last, As with all these rumours we have to consider what other changes may be in place alongside the one's in these videos.

It does refer to the pre-measure for shooting and does not mention for moving and assaulting (unless I missed something).

From bests of war site"We have come to believe that this is in fact an actual early version of the 6th Edition rules… but not quite. Apparently the Design department were let loose on the 40K system… they were allowed to try anything they fancied… we’re told that nothing was off the table. This “no-holds-barred” version was then edited down with the truly unworkable ideas removed and those that could prove to be exciting or contentious left in to be play-tested… so was born the Heretics 40K Rulebook!

This a version that was very likely sent to trusted play-testers (we still believe these guys exist!). Who like all trusted minions… were turned by the promise of power… or in this case internet notoriety and likely splurted the document all over the web!

I actually found this explanation to be not just more plausible (than the lone gunman theory) but a real breath of fresh air if true, and to me at least it shows a high level of innovation within the design team looking down upon us from the ‘Ivory Citadel’, and also shows that there is no shortage of ideas knocking around in there.

You can just imagine the design team having a real blast with this iteration of the rules (we loved it so why shouldn’t they) but its not been hard to spot a lot of potential for (ED: asshats now now don’t get carried away!) gifted players with a penchant for the meta side of our beautiful game… to discover unbalanced lists etc.

And there you have the crux of the issue the design team face, they could probably create a massively fun game at the drop of the hat, and simple folk like me wold love them dearly for it, but alas there is a whole other side (some say dark, Darrell says only!) to our hobby and that is the competitive win at all costs play.

So, fun as they may be, they’re not the final (or indeed likely to be anything like the complete) rule set for 6th edition… but what have we turned up about the actual 6th Edition Rules?

Well some really interesting stuff. For a start here’s what we believe wont make it from the Heretics Rulebook:

Evasion Values are Out – well we think this is a given… I’m sure every Dark Eldar player was praying for the day that their skimmers and flyers didn’t fall over in a stiff breeze, but that’s not all. Our Man in Havana has told us that Dark Eldar players will be very pleased with the 6th Edition updates.

Could that mean an overhaul of the skimmer rules… could it mean more deadly flyers?

Of course it could mean one, both or neither. However, more robust transports would make the Dark Eldar much more deadly… so keep your eyes peeled for more revelations.

The Turn Sequence will remain the same – The biggest shake-up and the one that would mean a rewrite of Assault weapons and the death of certain “shooty armies” ( Tau ), was the turn structure that put charging/melee before shooting. I would say it was unrealistic, but in a world of extra-terrestrial and supernatural horrors, where mankind has moved to the stars… that’s probably a bit redundant.

Anyway…the turn structure will likely remain the same as it is now, although i still think the reversal is tactically more interesting.

No Unit by Unit Activation – Yup that was pretty disappointing for me, (but who knows everything we have printed here could well be misinformation too! – fingers crossed I say.) I was sooo looking forward to faster more intricate games with that option. (Over watch would have been deadly)

Gargantuan Creatures will remain with Forge World & Apocalypse Games – That’s right… probably no supersized tanks and critters for the main rulebook… but does that mean we won’t get any Aracknarok-sized monsters?
Well it hasn’t been ruled out, and as Land Raiders are already that size, it’s doesn’t take a genius to think we’ll be getting more big kits.
In fact that’s a definate area of discussion… we all like to gripe about GW prices.

However, it’s pretty common knowledge GW are investing all the time in new kits, new moulds, more people (sculpting team is largest its ever been apparently – and picking up designers too – with the Hobbit on the horizon this would make perfect sense too!) and a bigger and better gaming experience… you can take that at face value if you wish… but if it means more plastic kits (and fewer Finecast), and more big bad creatures and machines is it worth it?

So who will be writing this new 6th Edition Rulebook I hear you cry?

Well as you can imagine the creation of a new rule set of this scale is a team effort… but some poor soul has to captain this vessel… so who is it?

Well… we simply don’t know! that really is top secret and even we couldn’t get the name (and you can’t use thumbscrews on a corporation these days!)… but we have some ideas on who isn’t. (Basing most of this off their recent commitments and things that have been let loose at recent events.)

So here are a few names who may well be involved, but most likely won’t be the lead writer… Matt Ward, Jervis Johnson and Phil Kelly… but if not one of them… then who – bearing in mind that on a project this size they are probably all involved in some way?

Will you need an update to your existing Codex when 6th Edition launches?

We’ve heard that the new rule book was written to take into account the latest releases and so there’s no need to post a massive errata.
However, we know that there are many codices that need a revamp. So I’m very sceptical that there will be “no need for an FAQ”.

Although I’m always prepared to be proven wrong.

So, while events unfold we’ll try to keep this article up-to-date with info as it turns up (aside from fixes of spelling, grammar, readability and of course insults to the ‘meta gifted!)

For now though… feel free to speculate all you want… or post a question. Perhaps we can piece together a puzzle with our ‘spidy sense’ and see if we can get the inside track. (US Military aren’t the only ones experimenting with remote viewing these days – Remote Viewers please contact us to apply!) (Update: Jessica Moonbeam writes in to say she sees desks full of papers and scribbles – erm helpful Jessica, very helpful!)"

Big caveats on this guys, in that while we’re confident that the contents of the article are accurate you are relying on multiple sources and research, and… well… there could be many ways in which it may not be accurate (not necessarily deliberate by a source either, pieceing info together like this is tricky!) so take it that its just part of the business these days that while we do our best, there are no guarantees! We will work to keep this article updated.

All of that aside, is the Heretics 40K Rulebook good enough, different enough to warrant a following of its own? (I’m so tempted its unreal!)

BoW Warren

http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/rumor-close-combat-weapons-ap-40k-6th-ed/

Another Video is up, Think the title sums it up, the sound is exceptionally low on this one so someone else will need to give a brief for the work blocked.

deejaybainbridge wrote:http://www.beastsofwar.com/warhammer-40k/rumor-close-combat-weapons-ap-40k-6th-ed/

Another Video is up, Think the title sums it up, the sound is exceptionally low on this one so someone else will need to give a brief for the work blocked.

Close combat weapons getting AP is definitely a step in the right direction. CC things always seem kind of cumbersome combared to shooty things.

Joey wrote:Close combat weapons getting AP is definitely a step in the right direction. CC things always seem kind of cumbersome combared to shooty things.

I agree, this is the most interesting piece of info thus far. Shame the sound is so poor for me (need some new headphone at work).

Anything of note aside what the title says?

It's funny how they look like they really, really need to go bathroom everytime they record their videos, stepping from one foot to the other

I don't know if I would like regular power weapons to "only" have AP3 as they suggest, certainly would Assault Terminators make a bigger pain to deal with.

deejaybainbridge wrote:

Joey wrote:Close combat weapons getting AP is definitely a step in the right direction. CC things always seem kind of cumbersome combared to shooty things.

I agree, this is the most interesting piece of info thus far. Shame the sound is so poor for me (need some new headphone at work).

Anything of note aside what the title says?

Not really, they say Power Weapons may be AP3 and Powerfist may be AP2. Warren just questions what this adds to the game besides having to remember more stuff. Reducing armor saves taken will speed up combat.

Malthor wrote:It's funny how they look like they really, really need to go bathroom everytime they record their videos, stepping from one foot to the other

I don't know if I would like regular power weapons to "only" have AP3 as they suggest, certainly would Assault Terminators make a bigger pain to deal with.

It would also give a boost in the arm to artificer armor and terminator armor. I like this as I think the 3++ save has overshadowed everything else to the point where normal armor saves are considered 'meh'

Lets say that the force weapon also has an AP of 3, then when Mephiston flys over and starts beating your tactical terminators about the head, then instead of killing 3 or 4 of them a turn, he will just beat one of them into submission.

The tactical terminators on the other hand will fist mephiston right where it hurts the most denying any save.

labmouse42 wrote:

Malthor wrote:It's funny how they look like they really, really need to go bathroom everytime they record their videos, stepping from one foot to the other

I don't know if I would like regular power weapons to "only" have AP3 as they suggest, certainly would Assault Terminators make a bigger pain to deal with.

It would also give a boost in the arm to artificer armor and terminator armor. I like this as I think the 3++ save has overshadowed everything else to the point where normal armor saves are considered 'meh'

Lets say that the force weapon also has an AP of 3, then when Mephiston flys over and starts beating your tactical terminators about the head, then instead of killing 3 or 4 of them a turn, he will just beat one of them into submission.

The tactical terminators on the other hand will fist mephiston right where it hurts the most denying any save.

That's true, totally forgot about the artificer armour, I like outfitting my HQ models with it, maybe now my runepriest could actually survive combat against GK^^

Also this could benefit Tyranids, when your big bugs don't necessarily go down to a single force weapon blow if you get them their 2+ save upgrade.

What 2+ save upgrade? They are now lucky to get even a 3+ and thats costly!

Couldn't the swarm tyrant and some other bugs get something like this, hardened carapace or something? It's been a long time since my last game against Tyranids, just had it in the back of my mind that there was something like that. Maybe I am confusing that then, sorry

Nope not any more. Only the Hive Tyrant gets an armor upgrade and that brings it from a 4+ to a 3+ for about the cost of a termi.

Your thinking 4th edition codex, 5th edition is such a feth fest that it makes me cry every time I table a nid army. . .

Lysenis wrote:What 2+ save upgrade? They are now lucky to get even a 3+ and thats costly!

Armored Shell. p83 of the codex
"A model wtih an armoured shell has an armour save of 2+"

The following units can take it/Have it
* Hive Tyrant
* Tyrannofex

You're thinking of armoured shell. Which gives a 2+ save.
It is an upgrade for the Tyrant and the Tyrannofex has it standard.

edit: ^ what he said..

Ah yes. I am sorry I completely spaced on that one. Its been a long long day.

labmouse42 wrote:

Malthor wrote:It's funny how they look like they really, really need to go bathroom everytime they record their videos, stepping from one foot to the other

I don't know if I would like regular power weapons to "only" have AP3 as they suggest, certainly would Assault Terminators make a bigger pain to deal with.

It would also give a boost in the arm to artificer armor and terminator armor. I like this as I think the 3++ save has overshadowed everything else to the point where normal armor saves are considered 'meh'

Lets say that the force weapon also has an AP of 3, then when Mephiston flys over and starts beating your tactical terminators about the head, then instead of killing 3 or 4 of them a turn, he will just beat one of them into submission.

The tactical terminators on the other hand will fist mephiston right where it hurts the most denying any save.

My Meganobz like this idea

It's not going to help that much with the ridiculous 2+/3++/4+ FNP (unless they change how FNP works) that i keep runnning into, and my orks as a whole aren't going to get much use out of it, but my Meganobz might actually last long enough to swing back against someone..

AP3 powerswords? my deathwing army is happy.

Still don't like MANZ though. Stupid T4 and instant death rules...

AP 3 power weapons? Isn't the whole point of power weapons to ignore all armor.

There's a howling banshee fan in tears right now

I don't see them doing that, as power weapons are already seldom taken by units who can take powerfists. When was the last time you saw a Space Marine sergeant with a power sword?

Not everyone gets a powerfist option though

DE, for example, have all sorts of power weapons, not a single PF.

It's just one more piece of BS, if true. to keep those 2+/3++ 'ers alive even longer. If T-hammers and Chainfists get an AP 1 it's even more blatant, as only SM get those (as far as i'm aware anyhow...)

Brother SRM wrote:I don't see them doing that, as power weapons are already seldom taken by units who can take powerfists. When was the last time you saw a Space Marine sergeant with a power sword?

I hope they do that. It will give DCA's a hard counter -- as right now they can tear through anything in the game -- especially when dual hammerhand is cast on them.

I would greatly enjoy seeing DCA's bounce off artificer armor or even regular terminators.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Ascalam wrote:It's just one more piece of BS, if true. to keep those 2+/3++ 'ers alive even longer. If T-hammers and Chainfists get an AP 1 it's even more blatant, as only SM get those (as far as i'm aware anyhow...)

That would also (if they keep the same rule) give t-hammers and chainfists an extra 1 on the damage roll to destroy vehicles. Not a bad deal.

In the video Darrell seemed pretty sure of himself on the AP-3 Power Weapons deal. I guess time will tell, only 29 more days until June 30.

I would like to see AP 1, 2, and 3 ignore Feel No Pain, like in Pancake Edition. It buffs necron destroyers, eldar dark reapers, Battlecannons, Vespids, and many other non-imperial units.

Edit - First post brought up to speed with all current videos as of this post.