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I play imperial guard. If i was doing a 1500 pt match and wanted to include some deamon hunters as inquisition i would usualy put in a vindicare.

Any sugestions of what i should use if anything at all?
Any other guard players use the vindicare or are deamon hunters a waste?

Really not a 'Rules Question' but generally speaking DH are good for an Inquisitor with a ld 10 unlimited range psychic hood and deep strike protection using a pair of mystics. Other than that they pretty much across the board weaker than IG choices on a per point basis.

I would include an Inquisitor Lord for the mystics and hood but a Vindicare is way over priced for a model that gets 5 shots a game, cannot perform in CC and costs 100+ points.

Ive said it before, and I will say it again one million times. Wait for the codex.

Moving to the Tactics forum, as this is not a rules question, nor is is about a full army list.

As an elits (IG's worst slot anyway), include one inquisitor with a psychic hood. He's 45 points, so stick him in a unit where he can't be shot and watch as he throws a wrench in the works for any enemy psyker on the board.


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calypso2ts wrote:generally speaking DH are good for an Inquisitor with a ld 10 unlimited range psychic hoodquote

What i meant to say is "this all over the place."

The Elite Inquisitor is LD 8. . . and the Hood loses ties. Almost every Psyker ever is LD 10. That means that the Hood fails on a roll of 3 or less no matter what, and it fails on the opponent rolling 4 or better. That's a less than 25% chance of the Hood working. You need it on a LD 10 model for it to be worth any points. That's either an HQ Inquisitor or in a group of terminators.

I used to use the GK troop choice in my IG list to provide a troops unit that wouldn't fall over dead to a couple flamers. I outgrew that. I'm now using some terminators just for the lols of having a 2+/5++ in a guard army. As said, though, IG usually has good enough choices in their own Codex.

Jaon wrote:Ive said it before, and I will say it again one million times. Wait for the codex.

I heard they were going to scrap deamon hunters.

And a vindicare is only 100 pts nothing else is an option. Ive read his page ten times over and never seen that he can only shoot 5 shots per game....

Since the Daemonhunters codex is second only to the Necrons in overall shittyness, I'd say... no.

I still love it though.

ImpGuardPanzies wrote:

Jaon wrote:Ive said it before, and I will say it again one million times. Wait for the codex.

I heard they were going to scrap deamon hunters.

And a vindicare is only 100 pts nothing else is an option. Ive read his page ten times over and never seen that he can only shoot 5 shots per game....

You're getting at most 7 shots per game, and he's calculating that you won't have a target or you'll have an extremely bad target 2 turns, thus 5 shots/game.

I use my vindicare to kill tanks. I own my friends land raider and tats squad in it on turn one...thats almost if not more than triple what i paid for. Then i turn to IC's or rushing transports.

About assassins I much prefer the Callidus. Being able to move one unit after setup is hilarious and her "ignores invlunerable saves" can be an annoyance.

The Callidus is by far the best option of all the Assassins. The 6" move is nice and she can scalpel out a squad of Long Fangs or Devastators if needed.

Almighty is correct on what I meant. He will miss one shot a game usually, average game is 6 turns overall that means he wipes at most 7 models a game...

For a LR a Turbo Penetrator gives you 3d6 pen which is nice. A rend will pretty much guarantee a pen (about a 50/50 shot of not rolling a 6 though) but even then you need a 4+ to do anything significant to it.

Are deamon hunters worth it?

Good question. I'll tell you in 6 months. I wouldn't dump money into them now with the intent of allying them though, that's for sure.

Ill look into a callidus. never considered one.

For allies to guard, I rather like Sisters. For a 120% price increase to guardsmen, you get +1 Ballistics, better LD, and Power Armor - not to mention some acts of Faith if you want to up your squad leaders to veterans. Celestians are good CC units, and have good options for wargear.

Let me be more clear - I like them for fun. Guard is good enough and Sisters actually bring them down typically. Stormtroopers (Inquisitorial) wouldn't be bad instead of Veteran Meltas, though. You can't take as many, but the squad is cheaper at minimum size.

ImpGuardPanzies wrote:I play imperial guard. If i was doing a 1500 pt match and wanted to include some deamon hunters as inquisition i would usualy put in a vindicare.

Any sugestions of what i should use if anything at all?
Any other guard players use the vindicare or are deamon hunters a waste?

gk terminators
mystics
assassins are fine.
the codex in general is junk dont use pagk.

What about deepstriking a tats squad as fast attack?

Forget about getting DH allies anymore.

Codex: DH is getting scrapped and turned into Codex: GKs.

i can assure you that the Ally rules won't be in there anymore.

okay- wait for the codex. they WILL be better. Anyway- the best things to ally with is: GK grand master (he's a captain, but 45 more pts, termie armour standard, NFW that inflicts ID, S6, no armour standard, and SB standard. A captain w/ termie armour and SB is 140. so 5 pts more for his "power weapon" to be force, S6, not S4, IDs, and is a psyker. worth it.
An inquisitor is worth it too. 70 points, for a I5 TH (so to speak), 2+/3++, plasma pistol, and has henchmen is pretty good.

GKGM comes with TDA standard

What force org spots do inquisition armies take up? dont they take up your elites spots and you have one from e.a categorie or something to use of them? or am i way off.

ImpGuardPanzies wrote:What about deepstriking a tats squad as fast attack?

theyre too expensive for what they are. deep striking them is probably better than relying on a rhino but they just dont hold their own.

Grey Templar wrote:GKGM comes with TDA standard

that's what i said

now i see it, but you do say later "No armor standard"

were you referring to the Power attacks?

ImpGuardPanzies wrote:What force org spots do inquisition armies take up? dont they take up your elites spots and you have one from e.a categorie or something to use of them? or am i way off.

If you play an IG or SM (including variants such as wolves) army you can fill some of your FO-slots with units from the Inquisitor lists. First you need to fill any mandatory slots with units from your standard army (this is usually 1xHQ and 2xTroops). After that you can buy up to 1 HQ, 1 Elite, 2 Troops and 1 FA slot from the Inq codex you have chosen as your allies. The slot you use up is the exact same as the slot the unit belongs in in it's standard codex, so a standard grey knight unit would count as a troop choice for your army as well.

Hmm, did I mange to explain that properly?

actually, Allies don't use up your FoC. they simply allow you to take that many units from those sections of the codex in addition to your own codex.

you could have 2 SM HQs and a single Inquisitor lord for 3 HQs on the board. at least that is my interpretation of the rules.

personally, i want the ally rules to be done away with. sure, they are fluffy, but they can get really annoying(Guard players buying a inquisitor with Emperors Tarot and a Psychic hood for super shannanagins)

So technicly you could have up to 4hq, 12 troop, 6 elite, 6 fa, 6 hs?

no, because you can only take up to 1 HQ, 1 Elite, 2 Troops, and 1 FA from the DH codex.

so max of 3 HQ, 4 Elite, 8 troops and 4 FA.

Grey Templar wrote:no, because you can only take up to 1 HQ, 1 Elite, 2 Troops, and 1 FA from the DH codex.

so max of 3 HQ, 4 Elite, 8 troops and 4 FA.

I think what ImpGuardPanzies is asking about is "can I take allies from both the DH and the WH books?" And the answer to that is yes, see the WH FAQ p 3. http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1490300a_FAQ_WitchHunters_2009.pdf

But, this does not mean you will get any extra FOC-slots. You have to live with a total of 2 HQ, 3 Elites, 6 troops, 3 FA and 3 HS in your army. The allies rules only gives you freedom to fill these slots from any applicable Allied list, as long as you follow all other limits given.

If you want to include more Inq units with your army, I'd reccomend using the rules for "Detatchments" where both you and your opponent agrees to use two FOCs each, effectively building two armies per side. This risks turning out rather unbalanced unless you play quite large battles. I'd suggest at least 1500-2000p per detatchment.

AFAIK, it's only Space Wolves who gets to bend the FOC in the current rules.

Vindicares are garbage.

Moving on:

An Inquisitor is a good addition, if only for the psychic hood and cheap plasma gun warriors. My first purchase for an Inquisitor is always three veteran guardsmen with plasmaguns. They cost 20 points each and get carapace and targeters. By comparison, IG veteran guardsmen with plasmaguns, carapace and NO targeters cost 25. Mystics are nice, but they are going the way of the dodo pretty soon, so I wouldn't concern myself with them.

If you're strapped for points or HQ slots, an elite Inquisitor can do alright at psychic defense if you add a Hierophant to make him Ld9. Not fantastic, but better than nothing (although at this point you're saving like 16? points over the Lord).

The WH Inquisitors will be available for some time to come, so IG won't be giving up its psychic defense any time soon. They won't get mystics anymore, but you can now spend those points elsewhere (like towards upgrading the Inquisitor to Lord status if you went with the Hierophant option before, which will also not be available any longer).




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Grey Templar wrote:actually, Allies don't use up your FoC.

You are incorrect.