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I've been thinking for a while about how to make a Take All Comers Eldar list. The catch? I'm wanting to make one that isn't Mechdar.

I'm well aware of Mechdar and why it's so good. The two main problems that stop me from using it though are A: Not enough tanks (I only have 2 Falcons and a Wave Serpent. Model rep isn't a problem but when you need at least 5+ Wave Serpents PLUS 1-3 Falcons or Fire Prisms it starts to add up). B is I just don't like Mechdar as a concept, but that's more to do with 5th Edition making transports so necessary that everyone needs to have them (the cynical in me sees it purely as a means for GW to milk as much money as possible from it's fans, but meh).

The main issue I have when trying to make such a list is, of course, how the Eldar play. With an army of specialists mostly designed to fight one thing and one thing alone, it means most of the time you'll be using units at a disadvantage. Striking Scorpions, for example, mess up lightly armoured horde armies like Guard, Tyranids and even Orks, but against MEQ battles tend to become long, protracted slug fests with both sides taking a lot of casualties.

With all this in mind, how would one go about making a non Mechdar list? Bear in mind though that non Mechdar doesn't mean "no tanks"... but it does mean "nothing silly like 5 man squads of Dire Avengers in Wave Serpents or Fire Dragon Suicide Squads". I understand this is incredibly limiting but I'm curious to see what kind of armies could be made and I need to know if I'm just shooting myself in the foot by not using Mechdar.

Well, without using mechdar, you have basically two other choices.

Wraith units: One of two good eldar troops without transports, wraithlords and warwalkers make fine anti-tank/anti-infantry units. One time I would recommend Eldrad over a normal farseer. Strengths are its scoring units durability and its volume of low AP fire. Weaknesses... are well... you're outnumbered, no question about it!

Biker List: Council + Support. Council has enough destructors to break any squad, and enough witchblade attacks to pop half a dozen tanks in one turn. Just grab a council, scoring units, and support for the council. Strengths: Council can go toe to toe with most units in the game, and can flat out 24" with a 3+/4++/3+++ re-rollable. (Don't start the seer with the squad, move him 12" and cast fortune, have him join the unit at the end of the shooting phase, leaving a trail of warlocks behind the main group). Weaknesses: Psychic hood basically means you're screwed.

Interesting ideas. Wraithguard and Wraithlord are tough, although I'd need more of them as the Wraithguard especially would be hard to model rep.

I've tried the Jetbike Council once before against Tyranids and yes they were beastly. Killed some of the Nids biggest monsters by themselves. But then at 500+ points you expect them to be good. Why do you not start the Farseer with the Squad though? You cannot join a unit unless it's in the movement phase and the assault movement is not part of the movement phase.

zonino wrote:Why do you not start the Farseer with the Squad though? You cannot join a unit unless it's in the movement phase and the assault movement is not part of the movement phase.

So you can fortune and then turbo boost the warlocks on t1. Turbo boosting farseer=no fortune=dead.

At smaller point limits Ive run this eldar horde with mixed success

HQ:
Farseer-Doom, SS, Guide, RoWarding (135)

Troops:
10 Guardian Defenders w/ EML (100)
10 Guardian Defenders w/ EML (100)
10 Guardian Defenders w/ EML (100)

Elites:
5 Fire Dragons (80)
Wave serpent- Shuriken Cannons, SS (110)

Heavy Support:
Wraith Lord-WS, EML, Flamers(125)
Wraith Lord-WS, EML, Flamers(125)
Wraith Lord-WS, EML, Flamers(125)


Its suited me well its by no means optimized in any sense but it throws people for a loop when they hear eldar they think 5+ tanks

Avatar would be a handsome addition to this list get a big fearless guardian swarm going

Idea here was to run each Wraithlord with 10 guardian squads acting as a single unit

like I said fun yes, competitive no, with a few tweaks or variations on the concept I think footdar could be quite powerful

the weasel king wrote:

So you can fortune and then turbo boost the warlocks on t1. Turbo boosting farseer=no fortune=dead.

Hmm, you know I never even noticed that in the turbo boosting rules. No voluntary actions huh... Still you cannot join a unit in any other phase apart from the movement phase... if you fortune the Warlocks and let them blast off, the Farseer is left by himself, on a bike that makes it hard for him to get out of LoS, and he just used his save rerolling power on the Warlocks.

Sounds like a recipe for a lazcannon or missile launcher to the face if you ask me. I'm thinking I'll just put my Warlock/Farseer combos in Wave Serpents from now on.

:-) I've run the WG with the Farseer (or Eldrad) in the 10 man unit for that... With a second Farseer on a bike zipping forward, but that's getting pretty expensive (points and cash) for the 2 "Deathstar" units...

Ugh, look:

Warlocks turbo-boost, but you have two-three have whacky paths.

You move farseer 12" forward after fortuning.

Whacky warlocks are within 2" at the end of movement phase.

Get it now?

Warlocks in serpents are 110% less useful than a jetcouncil without Yriel.

Footdar lists can also be very powerful, using Eldrad/Farseer and the Avatar with Wraithlords (and sometimes a unit of warwalkers).

Harlequins function very well in a list like this as well.

Search for army list posts/battle report posts by Reecius and Blackmoor for more details.

I have a lot of success fielding a unit of scatter walkers (2-3 depending on list size) and using guide/doom to take out enemy units at range. Throw in a WL with EML, and a squad of Fire Dragons in a wave serpent with TL BL and you've got your anti tank sorted. Guardians and dire avengers to mop up and take objectives. Works well in 1k to 1.5k games i find, as long as you're careful not.to let your walkers get killed first turn.

Inquisitor_Syphonious wrote:Ugh, look:

Warlocks turbo-boost, but you have two-three have whacky paths.

You move farseer 12" forward after fortuning.

Whacky warlocks are within 2" at the end of movement phase.

Get it now?

Warlocks in serpents are 110% less useful than a jetcouncil without Yriel.

Except, the rules specifically state the Turbo Boosting bikes have to be at least 18" from their starting point to get the cover save. So you can make as many beautiful zig zags and pirouettes as you like but you're still going to have to move father than the Farseer possibly can.

Fortune has a 6" range, which means the Farseer has to be within 6" of the bikes of course. Now they have to move at least 18" from where they started while the farseer can only move 12". I think we can see where this is going.

Start the Warlocks 6" behind the Farseer.

Rube wrote:Start the Warlocks 6" behind the Farseer.

I.. ah.. umm...

Arwoooo?

I mean I think my brain must have shut down there I don't know what I was thinking. Sorry!