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Every few months my FLGS holds an advertised public event these are usually tournaments, mega battles, apocalypse games, ect. they are free to play and only require a signature on a sign up sheet. At the end of the event various prizes are given out for different things, these are usually gift cards for the store. Since I have been going to this store I have been to 3 of these events and they were all great fun. However, at the conclusion of our last apocalypse event the people in charge informed us that GW is no longer funding our store and all future events will require a buy in. I was suprised at this, why did GW cut our funding? Our store stilll sells tons of GW products and I feel like these events helped move more products because of all the attention they gathered. Has anyone else had this happen to their stores?

What the hell GW?

Cutting costs = Increasing Revenue (over a sufficiently small period of time)

daedalus wrote:Cutting costs = Increasing Revenue (over a sufficiently small period of time)

Nah, revenue is the money you bring in, costs are what you pay out. The difference between revenue and costs is your profit. Cutting costs would = increasing profit (over a sufficiently short period of time). Revenue would remain unaffected in the short term, with a possiblity in the long term that the cost cutting leads to a drop in sales, possibly so much that it would offset the cost savings.


As for why, I don't know. It's possible the store wasn't selling enough. It's possible GW is sponsoring another store in the area instead. It's possible they're cutting back on local tournaments because they judge, rightly or wrongly, that the tournaments don't generate enough in sales to justify the outlay. Or maybe the store owner and the GW sales rep had a bit of a tiffy...

I don't really know any problems like that, my FLGS is good and clean.Our manager is an awesome guy and he seem to have an authority in even the allocation of funds.
Well you could just find another store and abandon this one.

What I would give for my FLGS to have such things, even once.

My FLGS has always had a fee, but it always covered food and such. So, you pay 10 buck, free food for hours. Good deal!

In my experience it's pretty rare for FLGS tournaments and the like to be free-- usually there's a ten-dollar buy-in, which gets you three games, prizes if you win, and sometimes food.

Just 10? Here it can be as much as 30 for one!!

The Night Stalker wrote:Every few months my FLGS holds an advertised public event these are usually tournaments, mega battles, apocalypse games, ect. they are free to play and only require a signature on a sign up sheet. At the end of the event various prizes are given out for different things, these are usually gift cards for the store. Since I have been going to this store I have been to 3 of these events and they were all great fun. However, at the conclusion of our last apocalypse event the people in charge informed us that GW is no longer funding our store and all future events will require a buy in. I was suprised at this, why did GW cut our funding? Our store stilll sells tons of GW products and I feel like these events helped move more products because of all the attention they gathered. Has anyone else had this happen to their stores?

What the hell GW?

Your store has been spoiling you.

Do you go to the movies for free?

Use the local golf course for free?

Hockey pro shops in rinks don't give you free ice time simply because you bought stuff from them

etc., etc.

You've had it good for a while, but the reality is that if you want your store to be around for the long haul, you need to support it, and paying an event fee is the norm and always has been.

If you've been getting a free ride, then you have been lucky, but the reality is that most stores need any money they can get to stay afloat long term. I think that your store is starting to realize this, and felt that blaming it on GW was an easy out as they expected you all to grumble...

Yea, you've been lucky. Heck I had to pay to get into card tournies back then that last maybe 1-2 hours and I never got any prizes

Events I run at the FLGS have a $10 buy in, which is then doubled and turned into store credit. I used to siphon off money from that to supply the terrain fund, but now we get credit from GW on a per month basis, and we use that for terrain instead now. Still siphon off some of the entry fees sometimes, but not nearly as much as I used to.

So yeah, $10 entry fee, which turns into $20 store credit in prize support per participant.

The Night Stalker wrote:Every few months my FLGS holds an advertised public event these are usually tournaments, mega battles, apocalypse games, ect. they are free to play and only require a signature on a sign up sheet. At the end of the event various prizes are given out for different things, these are usually gift cards for the store. Since I have been going to this store I have been to 3 of these events and they were all great fun. However, at the conclusion of our last apocalypse event the people in charge informed us that GW is no longer funding our store and all future events will require a buy in. I was suprised at this, why did GW cut our funding? Our store stilll sells tons of GW products and I feel like these events helped move more products because of all the attention they gathered. Has anyone else had this happen to their stores?

What the hell GW?

compared to everyone else, your store has been giving away stuff for free and you've had it luckily.

why is GW bad for stopping giving away free stuff to one shop's customers?

its about the same as GW deciding to not advertise on a website anyone (if they actually did that)

Only have free fantasy tournaments around here. Mainly I think because our FLGS (Boldos Armory) is trying to generate support for fantasy. The 40k tournamnets & all millenium games tournaments run between $5 & $10.

GW fund stores that aren't there own?

First I've heard of it.

Night Stalker: where in NJ do you game and what local store? Reason I ask is I game in Philadelphia and South Jersey. ALL events i've been to commonly ask for a buy in.

For example:
All Things Fun: Warmachine / Hordes steam rollers are usually $5-10.
Showcase: GT's are typically $20-50 depending on the size and number of days. Single day events can be $10-20.
GW Voorhees: likely an agreement where you agree to spend $10 for the day to play in what is considered a rogue trader.
Ye Olde Hobbies: before it closed was $5-10.

All events take time, effort, and resources to run. When you look at Showcase you might think "wow that's steep." Its not uncommon for them to offer food, soda, bathroom, and sometimes door prizes on top of typically Forgeworld Style placement prizes. Stores that offer a buy in / agreement to spend money, your still using their resources. A buy in is not uncommon, NOT having a buy in is very uncommon.

Now on one note: i've never seen a buy in for a Mega Battle or Apocolypse game, but i've never seen those actually have prizes also.

chowderhead13 wrote:My FLGS has always had a fee, but it always covered food and such. So, you pay 10 buck, free food for hours. Good deal!

same with my FLGS but GW doesnt sponsor it our manager does and he uses the money to buy more food and stuff. they happen every month or so which is great because they have a romm basically deicated to the event or just APOC games

Mr Mystery wrote:GW fund stores that aren't there own?

First I've heard of it.

They do it all the time here in the US, from my understanding.

From what I recall: If your store met a certain benchmark of product, etc then GW would give you support in the form of tournament prizes, terrain stuff, campaign support, and the like.

Mikhaila would know better though.

When I started in the hobby, you paid 5-10 bucks for a tournament, and you won a small trophy or certificate....and that was it. No prizes.

People were better sports back then. Giving out real prizes seems to have attracted a douchebag element to tournaments.

Kanluwen wrote:

Mr Mystery wrote:GW fund stores that aren't there own?

First I've heard of it.

They do it all the time here in the US, from my understanding.

From what I recall: If your store met a certain benchmark of product, etc then GW would give you support in the form of tournament prizes, terrain stuff, campaign support, and the like.

Mikhaila would know better though.

Correct as far as I know and done quarterly. We run monthly tournaments locally which is a buy in type of situation but all money goes into prizes/gift certificates. We also do the quarterly GW supported tournament and are able to add that into the prize pool along with the buy in.

Well it seems that a buy in is a norm for most of people that replied, its not bothering me that much a 10$ buy in isn't the end of the world I was just worried that it would deter more people from joining in. I game at Hobby Town USA in Newton, NJ its not a 40k store but more of an all around hobby store but they let us play on Sundays and the crowd is pretty meh but ever since Dark Tower in Denville closed there isn't much I can do.

Scuttlebutt is that some stores were using the GW prize support in a manner that was profitable to themselves, not to the winnners of the tournament.

The Night Stalker wrote:Well it seems that a buy in is a norm for most of people that replied, its not bothering me that much a 10$ buy in isn't the end of the world I was just worried that it would deter more people from joining in. I game at Hobby Town USA in Newton, NJ its not a 40k store but more of an all around hobby store but they let us play on Sundays and the crowd is pretty meh but ever since Dark Tower in Denville closed there isn't much I can do.

When I was in college, I was a regular participant at Dark Tower's many great 40K events. It sadness me to hear they closed. They were the one store that I still remember. That had incredible tables. One was a awesome construction sight with digs and craters. I loved that board. True Line of sight was in play for that event, and really was awesome!

GW Prize support for US stores:

1) Store needs to have an account with GW directly, and not through a distributor
2) If a store meets certain requirements to become a Stockist, they are given 150.00 in merchandise as event support once a quarter, and free shipping.
3) Meet a higher level and get classified as a Partnership account, and they recieve 150.00 a month in event support.
4) Requirements are, IMHO, incredibly easy to meet. For a stockist account, the store needs to keep in stock two each of the better selling plastic boxes. If you aren't doing this, you aren't trying to hard to sell GW product.
5) For a Partnership account, you need to work harder. Have gaming tables, a paint rack, stock more of the line, etc etc.
6) I don't think it's written down, but probably helps if you don't piss GW off by breaking their rules for selling with a shopping cart, selling bootleg product, taking the support and not running any events, etc.
7) Event support does not have to be a tournament. Could be paints for a class or iron painter event, a modeling class, apoc battle, etc. The store has the flexibility to run events how they want.
8) If a store doesn't keep up to their end of the agreement, GW may choose to not send them support. Pretty simple and logical. Paying your bills on time is also a part of the agreement, which sort of goes without saying, but I have known stores to complain that GW treats them unfairly, only to find out that they owe 10 grand and aren't paying it off.)

Now, in no way am I saying every store that doesn't take the GW support did something wrong, or broke a rule, or didn't pay a bill. Quite the opposite, actually. Usually it's just something simple like "You know, I don't have room for all that GW", or "I think I'll drop out of the stockist program since I only want to carry 40k." Being a GW stockist doesn't necessarily fit into every stores business plan, especially a hobby store.

For myself and my stores, we've enjoyed the support GW gives to Partnership stores for nearly two decades, and found them quite generous and easy to work with. Far more support than any other manufacturer we deal with. Interestingly, the #2 spot for store support goes to Battlefront Miniatures/GF9. Not surprisingly since a lot of the higher ups are ex-GW management, and they kept the idea of supporting LGS when they left GW. )

The only tourney I played in required a $10 enterance fee, which was fine. They gave out some pretty sweet prizes at the end to some really deserving ppeople. I even got a box of candy for being the "Best newb".

I read so many of this kind of thread and I always wonder why US players' gaming lives revolves around shops.

Aren't there any community centres or parish halls in the USA? I thought people had enormous houses with huge garages to host wargames.

UK based gaming is much more centred around people's homes or local facilities. We don't have to worry about whether GW will provide support.

Kanluwen wrote:

Mr Mystery wrote:GW fund stores that aren't there own?

First I've heard of it.

They do it all the time here in the US, from my understanding.

From what I recall: If your store met a certain benchmark of product, etc then GW would give you support in the form of tournament prizes, terrain stuff, campaign support, and the like.

Mikhaila would know better though.

$50 a month in GW product is what our store gets for being the "level" of retailer that we are. Quite handy with all the nice terrain they've been making as of late.

Kilkrazy wrote:I read so many of this kind of thread and I always wonder why US players' gaming lives revolves around shops.

Aren't there any community centres or parish halls in the USA? I thought people had enormous houses with huge garages to host wargames.

UK based gaming is much more centred around people's homes or local facilities. We don't have to worry about whether GW will provide support.

Im not entirely sure how UK tournaments go, but I do know that many US gamers live for shop and area tournaments. There are alot of people who drive hours to enter different tournies for a multitude of reasons.

Im als not sure if other countries have 'ard boyz and their equivilents, but these are always looked foward to at local shops.

Kilkrazy wrote:I read so many of this kind of thread and I always wonder why US players' gaming lives revolves around shops.
Aren't there any community centres or parish halls in the USA? I thought people had enormous houses with huge garages to host wargames.

The problem crops up when you get an area like where I'm at. We've got one 'centralized' store that pretty much everyone goes to.
Why?
Because we all live over an hour or more from each other, and gas is expensive what with no public transportation that goes near most of our homes.

It's also worth noting that these "huge garages" for most people...are rental areas where an entire housing complex parks their vehicles, so you can't just take it over as a mancave.

UK based gaming is much more centred around people's homes or local facilities. We don't have to worry about whether GW will provide support.

Good for you guys?

Kilkrazy wrote:Aren't there any community centres or parish halls in the USA? I thought people had enormous houses with huge garages to host wargames.

The problem is that we've filled up our huge garages with fleets of H3s and each one of our spare rooms in our veritable mansions are filled with the ten-or-so kids we all have.

In all seriousness though, I have a two bedroom apartment. I use the second bedroom for the most part when my good friends come over. Sometimes you're itching for a game outside of the norm though, and then it comes time to go to the store. Those people though... you don't invite most of them into your house. Better to go some place public.

Kilkrazy wrote:Aren't there any community centres or parish halls in the USA? I thought people had enormous houses with huge garages to host wargames.

Wut? We don't have parish halls because the U.S. doesn't have parishes. Is that like a church facility? 40k and Grimdark would be pretty close to the locals' interpretation of the antichrist so I'm not thinking that one's very likely. Community centers are more like recreational exercise/arcade facilities for inner city kids; or at least that's the connotation where I'm from.

As to our huge garages, those are always filled with our hundreds and hundreds of gigantic American SUVs.