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Made in gb
Boom! Leman Russ Commander




Northampton

This is what I've been playtesting.

Please bear in mind that I didn't write this. I will pass on any comments to it's author, but don't flame the messenger, I only got asked to post this. I've played this for a few weeks and it's pretty good.

It's very elite and the armies are quite small, but it does kick plenty of face.

From what I've been instructed, you'll need your copy of Codex CSM to hand. If a rule hasn't been changed here, it's still in apparently. Any Questions, please ask.

If I've posted this in the wrong format, I apologise - I don't know how to post this as a downloadable link.

Thank you and Enjoy.

CODEX CHAOS - REDUX
A 5TH EDITION FANDEX

Special Rules

Marks of Chaos:

Mark of Khorne: +1 Attack, Furious Charge, Rage, Fearless.
Mark of Nurgle: +1 Toughness, Feel No Pain, Fearless.
Mark of Slaanesh: +1 Initiative, Acute Senses, Fearless.
Mark of Tzeentch: +1 Armour Save (Maximum of 2+), Slow and Purposeful, Fearless.
Mark of Chaos Undivided: +1 Leadership.

Only one mark may be taken per army. For Example: A Chaos Lord of Khorne may not have any units in the army that have any other Mark.

The Sacred Numbers of Chaos:

Units with Mark of Khorne: 8.
Units with Mark of Nurgle: 7.
Units with Mark of Slaanesh: 6.
Units with Mark of Tzeentch: 9.

Squads that have the exact number of models in the unit that correspond to the above list, may upgrade one of their number to an Aspiring Champion (or Aspiring Sorcerer for squads with the Mark of Tzeentch) at no extra cost.

The Legions of Chaos:

Emperor's Children - All units must have the Mark of Slaanesh.
Iron Warriors - Havocs count as Elites and Heavy Support.
Night Lords - Raptors count as Elites and Fast Attack.
World Eaters - All units must have the Mark of Khorne.
Death Guard - All units must have the Mark of Nurgle.
Thousand Sons - All units must have the Mark of Tzeentch.
Black Legion - Use the base list.
Word Bearers - May summon Daemons as if their units had all the Marks of Chaos.
Alpha Legion - All units gain Infiltrate and the army may take more than two units of Chaos Cultists.

Summoning Daemons:
Follows the same rules as the current CSM, but may only be summoned to units with the same Mark.

Changes to Weaponry:

All weapons have the same stat lines with the following exceptions:

Ranged Weaponry
Boltgun - Chaos Boltgun: Range 18" STR: 4 AP: 5 Assault 2.
Sonic Blaster: Range: 24" STR: 4 AP: 5 Assault 3.
Blastmaster: Range: 48" STR: 6 AP: 4 Assault 4.
Plague Bolts: Poisoned 4+ Chaos Boltguns/Combi Bolters/Bolt Pistols.
Inferno Bolts: STR 5 Chaos Boltguns/Combi Bolters/Bolt Pistols.

Daemon Weapons
Follow the rules from current CSM codex.
The following are in addition to the ones in the current CSM codex.

Mark of Khorne.
Axe of Khorne - Grants an extra attack for every kill.

Mark of Nurgle.
Plague Sword - Kills outright on 4+.

Mark of Slaanesh.
Sword of Ecstasy - Always Strikes First.

Mark of Tzeentch.
Lance of Change - has the following shooting attack in addition to the standard Daemon Weapon rules:

Range: Template STR: 6 AP: D6 Assault 1.
Roll a 1 for AP and the bearer takes a wound as normal with no wounds inflicted on the opponent's unit.

Mark of Undivided.
Warp cannon - Cannot be used in Close Combat.
Range: 24" STR: 10 AP: 1 Assault 1 Small Blast. 

HQ

Abaddon - 275 pts.
Stats: No change.
Gains:
Total Mastery over Drach'nyen.
Ignores any rolls of one when rolling to see how many attacks he has.
Warmaster:
All Chosen and Terminators with the Mark of Chaos Undivided may be taken as Troops Choices.
Mark of Chaos Ascendant:
Counts as having all Marks for the purposes of Army Selection and so may have units with any Mark of Chaos in the same army.

Fabius Bile - 160 pts.
Stats: No change.
Gains:
Eternal Warrior.

Huron Blackheart - 175 pts.
Stats - WS: 6 BS: 5 S: 4 T: 6 W: 3 I: 5 A: 3 Ld: 10 Sv: 3+
Gains:
Eternal Warrior.
Mark of Chaos Undivided (already included in Stat line).
Cursed Halo:
4+ Inv Save.
Loses:
Personal Icon.

Typhus - 225 pts.
Stats - WS: 5 BS: 5 S: 4 T: 5 W: 4 I: 4 A: 3 Ld: 10 Sv: 2+
Loses:
Personal Icon.

Khárn The Betrayer - 165 pts.
Stats - No change.
Gains:
Eternal Warrior.
Loses:
5+ Inv Save.
Personal Icon.

Ahriman - 250 pts.
Stats - WS: 5 BS: 5 S: 4 T: 4 W: 3 I: 5 A: 3 Ld: 10 Sv: 2+
Gains:
Master of the Rubric:
All units with a model within 6" of Ahriman lose Slow and Purposeful and gain Relentless.
Loses:
Personal Icon.

Lucius The Eternal - 175 pts.
Stats - WS: 7 BS: 5 S: 4 T: 4 W: 3 I: 6 A: 4 Ld: 10 Sv: 3+
Gains:
Lash of Torment:
If there is an opposing Independent Character in the same close combat, Lucius must challenge them. Place the IC into base to base contact. No other models may be involved in this combat as this would offend Lucius' pride. The opposing IC loses 1 attack to a minimum of one. Counts as an additional close combat weapon.
Armour of Shrieking Souls:
If Lucius dies in close combat to an IC, at the end of your opponent's turn roll a D6. On the roll of a 4+, remove the IC that killed Lucius from the game and replace him with Lucius. If the roll is failed, roll again at the end of your opponents next turn. On a roll of 3+, remove the IC that killed Lucius from the game and replace him with Lucius and so on. A roll of one always fails.
Loses:
Personal Icon.

Doomrider - 150 pts.
Stats - WS: 6 BS: 5 S: 4 T: 4(5) W: 3 I: 6 A: 4 Ld: 10 Sv: 3+
Weapons:
Power Weapon, Sonic Blaster, Doom Siren, Eternal Warrior, Mark of Slaanesh.

Special Rules:
Hellsteed:
Counts as a Jetbike, armed with Twin Linked Melta Gun. Causes D6 Strength 4 AP - hits when Turbo Boosting over a unit. Counts as being armed with Frag and Krak Grenades.
Riders of Doom:
Chaos Space Marine Bikers count as Troops choices in an army that includes Doomrider. All Bikers in an army that includes Doomrider may exchange the Twin-Linked Chaos Bolters mounted on their bikes for a single Sonic Blaster for no extra cost. The Aspiring Champions of these squads may take a Doom Siren at +15 points.
Deep Strike.

Daemon Prince - 100 pts.
Stats - No change.
Options: (All other options remain the same)
Marks of Chaos:
Tzeentch - 20 pts: (Is not Slow and Purposeful).
Undivided - 0 pts: All units within 12" may re-roll failed Morale Tests.

Daemon Weapons:
May take a Daemon Weapon for +25 pts.

Chaos Lord - 85 pts.
Stats - No Change.
Options: Comes with Mark of Chaos Undivided, you may replace this with any one of the other Marks for the same price as in the current CSM codex. No option for Personal Icon.
May take a Doom Siren if marked by Slaanesh, Inferno Bolts if marked by Tzeentch and Plague Rounds if marked by Nurgle, all at no points cost.
Gains:
Eternal Warrior.
Loses:
5+ Inv Save.

Chaos Sorcerer Lord - 100 pts.
Only Changes: Mark of Tzeentch does not make him Slow and Purposeful and there is no option for a Personal Icon.
Gains:
Eternal Warrior.
Loses:
5+ Inv Save. 

Elites

Chosen.

Chosen of Khorne - Same as Berzerkers +1 A. 8 Members for 176 pts.
May take two from the following list:
Power Fist +20, Power Weapon +10, Plasma Pistol +15.
Aspiring Champion may take one of the above.

Chosen of Nurgle - Same as Plague Marines +1 A. 7 Members for 175 pts.
May take four from the following list:
Plasma Gun +15, Melta Gun +10, Flamer +5.
Aspiring Champion may take one of the following:
Power Fist +20, Power Weapon +10, Plasma Pistol +15.

Chosen of Slaanesh - Same as Noise Marines +1 A. 6 Members for 150 pts.
May take two from the following list:
Blastmaster +20 points.
Aspiring Champion may take one of the following:
Power Fist +20, Power Weapon +10, Doom Siren +15.

Chosen - See CSM Codex.
Gains:
Mark of Chaos Undivided - can re-roll failed Morale Tests.
Loses:
Icon Options.

Kabal of Tzeentch - 150 pts.
Stats - WS: 4 BS: 4 S: 4 T: 4 W: 1 I: 4 A: 2 Ld: 10 Sv: 2+
Unit: 3 Chaos Aspiring Sorcerers of Tzeentch.
Weapons: Bolt Pistol, Frag and Krak Grenades, Force Weapon.
Special Rules:
Mark Of Tzeentch - Not Slow and Purposeful.
May each take one of the following at no points cost:
Doombolt, Bolt of Change, Warptime, Wind of Chaos, Gift of Chaos.

Chaos Terminators - See CSM Codex. 35 pts per model.
Gains:
Combat Attachments:
Chaos Terminator Combi-Weapons are frequently adorned with Chain-blades and other nasty stabby weapons. CSM Terminators have +1 A if armed with a Combi Weapon and Power Weapon and/or Power Fist/Chainfist.
Mark of Chaos Undivided - Re-roll a failed Morale Test.
Marks of Chaos to replace Undivided:
Khorne + 10 pts per model - Gains Preferred Enemy.
Nurgle + 10 pts per model - Gains Plague Rounds for Combi-Bolters.
Slaanesh + 10 pts per model - Replaces Combi-Bolter with a Twin-Linked Sonic Blaster.
Tzeentch + 10 pts per model - Gains Inferno Bolts for Combi-Bolters.
Loses:
Icon Options.

Possessed CSM - 25 pts per model.
Gains:
Rending.
Fleet.
Mark of Chaos Undivided.
Can replace Mark of Chaos Undivided with:
Khorne +10 pts per model.
Nurgle +10 pts per model.
Slaanesh +10 pts per model.
Loses:
Icon Options.

Dreadnought - See CSM Codex. 90 pts per model.
Gains:
Autocannon to replace DCCW +10 points.
Marks:
Khorne +10 pts.
Slaanesh +10 pts. May be made into a Noise Marine Dreadnought armed with a Twin Linked Blastmaster for +30 pts, a Doom Siren or Sonic Blaster to replace the Combi-Bolter +5 pts and a DCCW or two Twin-Linked Blastmasters for 40 points.
Nurgle +10 pts. +1 FA.
Tzeentch + 10 pts. Is no longer Crazed. 

Troops

Chaos Space Marines - See CSM Codex.
Gain:
Mark of Chaos Undivided.
Lose:
Icon Options.

Khorne Berzerkers - See CSM Codex. 18 pts per model.
Note change to Mark of Khorne (+1 A is still included in stats).

Nurgle Plague Marines - See CSM Codex. 23 pts per model.
Gains:
Plague Rounds.
If unit is mounted in a Rhino, it counts as Fast Attack. 0-2 units of Plague Marines may be mounted in Rhino and still count as a troops choice.

Slaanesh Noise Marines - See CSM Codex. 20 pts per model.
Note change to Mark of Slaanesh (+1 I is still included in stats).
They come with Sonic Blasters as standard.
1 Blastmaster may be taken for +20 pts.

Thousand Sons Rubric Marines - See CSM Codex. 25 pts per model.
Note change to Mark of Tzeentch (Add +1 Sv, remove the 4+ Inv Sv).
Note change to Inferno Bolts.
Aspiring Sorcerer is 50 points and may choose a Psychic Power from their list for free.

0-2 Chaos Cultists. 5 pts per model.
Stats - WS: 3 BS: 3 S: 3 T: 3 W: 1 I: 3 A: 1 Ld: 7 Sv: 6+
Squad: 10 - 30.
Weapons: Las Pistols and Close Combat Weapons.

Marks:
Khorne +30 pts per squad.
Nurgle +50 pts per squad.
Slaanesh +10 pts per squad.
Tzeentch +20 pts per squad - not Slow and Purposeful.
Undivided + 20 pts per squad.

Chaos Lesser Daemons - See Codex Daemons.
Bloodletters.
Daemonettes.
Plaguebearers.
Horrors.
Nurglings.
Furies. 

Fast Attack

Chaos Bikers - See CSM Codex. 25 pts per model.
Gains:
Marks:
Khorne +10 pts per model.
Slaanesh +10 pts per model.
Undivided +5 pts.
Loses:
Icon Options.

Chaos Raptors - See CSM Codex. 20 pts per model.
Gains:
Marks:
Khorne +10 pts per model.
Slaanesh +10 pts per model.
Undivided +5 pts.
Hit and Run.
Dive of Daemons - Counts as Heroic Intervention from Codex Space Marines.
Up to two Raptors may take a Power Weapon for +15 pts or a Power Fist for +20.
Loses:
Icon Options.

Heavy Support

Havocs - See CSM Codex.
Gains:
Marks:
Slaanesh +10 pts per model. Up to 4 models may be armed with a Blastmaster for +20 pts. Models come with Sonic Blasters as standard.
Nurgle +10 pts per model. No Heavy Weapons may be taken, only Special Weapons.
Undivided +5 pts per model.
Loses:
Icon Options.

Obliterators - See CSM Codex.
May take Mark of Tzeentch for no points cost.

Chaos Predator - See CSM Codex for base points and upgrades.
Gains:
Marks:
Khorne +10 pts. Fast.
Nurgle +20 pts. +1 FA.
Slaanesh +10 pts. May be made into a Noise Marine Predator armed with a Turret Mounted Twin-Linked Blastmaster for +25 pts or a Twin-Linked Doom Siren for +20 pts. May take Twin-Linked Sonic Blaster +15 Points or Doom Sirens for +15 points.

Chaos Vindicator - See CSM Codex for base points and upgrades.
Gains:
Marks:
Nurgle +10 pts. +1 FA.
Khorne +20 pts. Fast.

Defiler - See CSM Codex for base points and upgrades.
Gains:
Marks:
Khorne + 20 pts. +1 A, Furious Charge.
Nurgle + 10 pts. +1 FA.

Chaos Land Raider - See CSM Codex for base points and upgrades.
Gains:
Power of the Infernal Spirit - Counts as Power of the Machine Spirit.

Dedicated Transports

If a unit can have a dedicated transport in Codex CSM, they can have one of these.

Dreadclaw Assault Drop Pod - 70 pts.
Counts as a Space Marine Drop Pod with the following exceptions:
Loses:
Inertial Guidance System.

Gains:

Weapon:
Deathwind Missile Launcher.
Special Rules:
Dread Maw:
The Dreadclaw may Deep Strike directly onto any infantry units. That unit takes an Initiative test. If the test is passed nothing happens and the squad moves out of the way in time. If it is failed place a large blast template over the unit. That unit takes a Str 10 AP 1 hit.

Rhino - See Codex for base points and upgrades.
Gains:
Marks:
Khorne +10 pts. Fast.
Nurgle +10 pts. +1 FA.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/12/19 00:18:43


Mr Mystery wrote:Suffice to say, if any of this is actually true, then clearly Elvis is hiding behind my left testicle, and Lord Lucan behind the right.
 
   
Made in us
Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'





Just to point out, I'd see those with Mark of Tzeentch with +1 to BS, and giving the Slow and Purposeful USR to the Mark of Nurgle, as it seems much more fitting... Oh yes, and those with the Mark of Slaanesh to get fleet, just going by the Daemons codex...

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/12/19 00:24:23


Thunderfrog wrote:
+1 Str for like 5 points? To autocannons or assault cannons? Hell yea. Then the Reinforced Aegis upgrade for free AND the ability to ignore stunned shaken.. pretty much for free..
Other Dreadnaughts should just go somewhere and be a toaster.

Mattieu~~~~ It's not that eldar are bad, it's that they require a lot of intergration between units. Also, that doesnt prove anything other than GW has a huge hard-on for marines, and, given the option between making a xeno the best psykers or making a marine the best psyker, they will 9 times out of 10 choose the marine.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Tzeentchling9 wrote:Mephy can't be swept. He is still a marine so he has the, "And They Shall Never Get Removed From The Table After Losing Combat Like Everyone Else Because They Are The Poster Boys" special rule.


 
   
Made in us
RogueSangre






Two Points:

One, Lucius the Eternals ability is way too powerful. A 4+ means that my reward for killing your HQ character with my HQ character is a 50% chance of losing my character and you getting yours back. That is not fun or fair, especially if it happens to my 240 point model verus your 175 point model. He needs a major points boost, and/or a nerf to the ability.

Two How does one activate one of the legion bonuses? What happens if I take 4 squads of Raptors, but every unit in my army has Mark of Khorne? I think these abilities should be special rules attached to some special characters, (like, If Kharn is in your army, it must be World Eaters) or available as an upgrade to some HQ units. ( Chaos Lords may buy the Iron Warriors legion for 10 points, for example.) I also don't like how there is no advantage to some legions, while some legions do get advantages. If Nightnlords can take more raptors, then only Death Guard shoul be able to take Nurglings and Plague Marimes.

   
Made in gb
Boom! Leman Russ Commander




Northampton

In the part where the marks are noted it states that an army can take only one Mark. For example: a lord with Mark of Khorne cannot take a unit that has another different Mark.

This was done to stop people taking multi Mark armies. In fact the only way you can do this is with Abaddon. We've tried the system back to front and it is still balanced considering the advantages the Cult Units get.

I agree with the point you made about the legion rules should have a cost. I'll fwd the info.

Mr Mystery wrote:Suffice to say, if any of this is actually true, then clearly Elvis is hiding behind my left testicle, and Lord Lucan behind the right.
 
   
Made in us
Abhorrent Grotesque Aberration





Connecticut, USA

I'd say tone Lucios down. . .a lot, if your giving him stats like that, that ability is way to powerful.
   
Made in us
Homicidal Veteran Blood Angel Assault Marine





I'm kinda confused why the cult units have to be so strong, and actually at the same time, the Marks being so powerful.

4 melta/plasma guns with Plague marines that have +1T and Feel No Pain?

Khorne Berserkers each with 5 attacks on the charge?

Axe of Khorne that grants an extra attack per kill? Imagine how many attacks they'd have by the end of the game.

Why is the Chaos Lord less points than a Captain if they have the exact same stats and starting equipment?

And it seems a few of the characters have been overpowered as well. As people have said before, Lucius is a good example.


The only 2 things at all that I can see that were improved in this codex, was the Daemons that could be chosen (Although I think it would work better if these worked as allies - for example, you have a Chaos Sorceror with the Mark of Slaanesh, therefore you can have 0-2 Flamers of Tzeench etc. etc.)

and the Possessed were also improved.

 
   
Made in gb
Boom! Leman Russ Commander




Northampton

How do you work out Berzerkers with five attacks???

I see them getting 4 on a charge. Chosen with 5, yeah.

The Plague Marine Chosen need to have two special weapons and not four. This is true.

From what the author has told me, he wanted Lucius to be like he was in the fluff. I agree he is totally overpowered.

Chaos Lords don't have any invulnerable saves. At all. Thats a pretty big points drop considering an Iron Halo is like 20 points.

I will pass on feedback as normal, keep the questions coming.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
In regards to Cult Units being strong, back in Dex 3.5, they were obscenely strong. The author wanted to recapture this.

From a playtesters point of view... If you do play a Death Guard force for example, you do have more disadvantages than advantages. You cannot have a fully mechanised force. That's a big bone of contention amongst some players.
If you take a World Eaters army, you will have next to no long ranged fire power, but you will eat everything in CC.
Personally, I think these lists are quite balanced. With the exception of Lucius of course.

I should be getting some update today. I'll post it up if I do.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2010/12/19 09:17:42


Mr Mystery wrote:Suffice to say, if any of this is actually true, then clearly Elvis is hiding behind my left testicle, and Lord Lucan behind the right.
 
   
Made in us
Grey Knight Psionic Stormraven Pilot







I dont think the sacred numbers should be there an aspiring champ should just be free just have to pay for equipment for him if wanted. Love the legion things. If you pick the a legion the special unit dedicated to it should be taken as troops for example, you could get raptor troops if your playing night lords legion

 
   
Made in ca
Mutilatin' Mad Dok





Bowsers Castle

i say get rid of Lucious rule for respawning by killing the opposing hero, i know i would end up refusing to play against him with that ability, other then that im liking the codex so far

WAAAHG!!! until further notice
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Dallas Texas

Complete waste of time.

5000+ pts. Eldar 2500pts
"The only thing that match's the Eldar's firepower, is their arrogance".
8th General at Alamo GT 2011.
Tied 2nd General Alamo GT 2012
Top General Lower Bracket Railhead 2011
Top General Railhead 2012
# of Local Tournaments Won: 4
28-9-1 In Tournaments As Eldar.
Maintained a 75% Win Ratio As Eldar in 5th Edition GT's.



 
   
Made in ca
Mutilatin' Mad Dok





Bowsers Castle

Smitty0305 wrote:Complete waste of time.


How so? There is definatly a majority of things that need tweeking but how is it a waste of time?

WAAAHG!!! until further notice
 
   
Made in us
Revving Ravenwing Biker




I read up until Chaos Lords and Chaos Sorcerers had Eternal Warrior and then stopped. There is no justification for giving non-SC HQ choices Eternal Warrior, its bad enough you gave it to every special character. I mean, seriously, power creep is one thing, but that is just ridiculous.



 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Dallas Texas

Making a fandex is basically CSM players saying "We arnt competant enough to play with the current rules, so lets make our own rules".

Every army has rules, use them and stop feeling sorry for yourselves.

5000+ pts. Eldar 2500pts
"The only thing that match's the Eldar's firepower, is their arrogance".
8th General at Alamo GT 2011.
Tied 2nd General Alamo GT 2012
Top General Lower Bracket Railhead 2011
Top General Railhead 2012
# of Local Tournaments Won: 4
28-9-1 In Tournaments As Eldar.
Maintained a 75% Win Ratio As Eldar in 5th Edition GT's.



 
   
Made in us
Androgynous Daemon Prince of Slaanesh





Norwalk, Connecticut

I absolutely love the Lucius rules, but I agree he is way overpowered for his points cost. This is very appropriate, based on the fluff, but he should be at least 50 points more OR be unable to join a unit-if he is not an IC and is left on his own, that should go a long way towards balancing out. And, there are many characters who would be able to ignore his ability: The Sanguinor, Mephiston, Bjorn, any greater daemon and I know there are more. So he isn't totally broken. I liked the other things that I saw: keep up the good work, and hopefully the 5th edition codex will turn out something like this. Until then though, I'll keep on enjoying the 4th edition chaos codex because it DOES still have some nice stuff to it.

Reality is a nice place to visit, but I'd hate to live there.

Manchu wrote:I'm a Catholic. We eat our God.


Due to work, I can usually only ship any sales or trades out on Saturday morning. Please trade/purchase with this in mind.  
   
Made in au
Member of a Lodge? I Can't Say



Australia

Here’s my feedback. Please note that my feedback is primarily from a gameplay perspective. From what I can interpret so far, the ruleset is an odd mix of 3.5 and 4th edition codex mechanics. The draft is very rough and could use a lot of polish.

1. Sacred Numbers: Get rid of this mechanic. The aspiring champion discount is a legacy mechanic from the 3.5 codex and doesn’t really fit in with 5th edition considering champions/sergeants are now a lot cheaper (10 points for tac marine sergeant). The mechanic also encourages players to field “odd unit sizes”, which itself presents various issues (slaanesh get particularly shafted with this rulset). You’d be better off scrapping this ruleset and recosting aspiring champion upgrades to 10 points to put it in line with 5th edition codices.

2. Chaos Marks: This mechanic feels clunky. Limiting 1 mark per army doesn’t counteract the strong nature of the god specific marks. Limiting 1 mark per army is very clunky and essentially encourages every player to field Abaddon. I suggest a 0-1 limit mechanic on all marked units unless the army contains a marked HQ (Abaddon would essentially remove the 0-1).

3. Since marks now provide the USR rule + fearless therefore there is little incentive to take a cult marine over CSM with an IoK. Due to strong nature of the marks, certain units purchase marks at an expensive 10 points per model. I making the marks that run of the mill vanilla CSM can get slightly inferior to a full blown mark that a Cult Marine or Chaos Lord would have access too.

4. Mark of Tzeentch: Remove Slow and Purposeful as standard. Make this a Rubric marine only setback.

5. Mark of Chaos Undivided: Is essentially useless to all units that contain an aspiring champion or are Ld 10. I suggest provided the stubborn rule instead

6. Daemon Weapons: Need a bit of clarification here as it is hard to interpret whether these weapons are alternate Daemon Weapon choices to the current Daemon Weapons (i.e. player can choose either the Blood Feeder or the Axe of Khorne) or they use the same rules (i.e. Axe of Khorne gives 2d6 attacks + bonus attacks for kills). One can logically assume that the new weapons are alternate choices but this needs to be written clearly.

7. Plague Sword: Needs some redesigning as killing on a 4+ versus the Bless Giver kills outright on an unsaved wound. Nurgle players would most likely choose the original Nurgle Daemon Weapon as a result. I suggest giving this weapon a different mechanic such as granting a Nurgle’s Rot shooting attack or a chance to inflict multiple wounds.

8. Lance of Change: Not digging the randomised AP mechanic (especially the auto wound mechanic on a roll of 1). This essentially makes the weapon pretty much identical to the existing Tzeentch Daemon Weapon and thus not giving enough choice to the player. I suggest either giving this blade a fixed AP of 3 or giving the weapon a fixed AP of 2 with the Str determined by D6 (with a 1 not inflicting an auto wound as a randomised strength is a strong negative penalty already).

9. Warp Cannon: Extremely over powered. I suggest using the rules for the Kai Gun from the 3.5 codex instead.

10. Terminators: The combat attachment rule is nice but kind of odd. The rule also doesn’t allow the player to field cultist terminators. A simpler solution for terminators would be to make them 15 point upgrade on Chosen/Cult Chosen (in the same fashion as Wolf Guard). For extra balance/fluffiness, maybe limit the type of wargear Cult Terminators can have access to (for example Khornate terminators could only have access to CC weapon upgrades, combi weapons and heavy flamers).

11. Chosen – CC weapons: I noticed that the special close combat weapon upgrades are limited to the aspiring champion or a number limit in the case of Vanilla Chosen and Khornate Chosen. The current 5th edition marine codices allow all members of a veteran unit to purchase special close combat weapon upgrades and I suggest Chosen should be no different.

I also suggest you restrict Ranged weapon upgrades (such as melta guns, plasma guns etc) to Vanilla Chosen as the counter part veteran units in the 5th edition MEQ books are designed as CC muscle. The only exception to this currently is the SM command squad which is restricted to 5 members. Chosen of Nurgle should be recosted to come with Plague Bolts as standard (this would change the unit into a Sternguard type unit).

Restricting unit members is somewhat annoying and I suggest you remove this mechanic.

12. Vanilla Chosen: Still appear to come with infiltrators as standard. I suggest reworking Vanilla Chosen to allow the player to choose a USR from a list rather than come with Infiltrators as standard. Fearless should be 1 of the USR rules up for selection.

13. Possessed: Missing Tzeentch option. Marks are also too expensive to make them a useful selection. I suggest using the proposed rules for Possessed written by Nurglitch instead (http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/329511.page).

14. Dreadnaught: Make the Blastmaster single and not twin linked (as plasma cannons are not twin linked). Upgrading a combi bolter to a doomsiren is worth 10 points and not 5 points IMO. Also redesign the crazed table as it is a legacy ruleset from previous editions.

15. Plague Marines: Remove plague rounds as Plague Marines are plenty tough already. The Fast Attack rhinos is a legacy ruleset from the 3.5 codex here as doesn’t really fit here. 5th edition. You could then probably get away with costing Plague Marines at 22 points per model due to cheaper 5th edition unit price standards (this would also result in a neater total per squad).

16. Rubric Marines: Overcosted at 25 points each due to MoT changes. You can easily get away with costing these guys at 20-22 points.

17. Raptors: Needs reworking as they currently appear to be a strange hybrid between Vanguard and Assault Marines. Marks are too expensive to make them useful. Dive of daemons does not fit in with the ruleset as hit and run is plenty. Remove the extra CC weapon options and restore their usual 2 special ranged weapons + aspiring champion upgrades seen in the current CSM codex.

18. Raptors: 10 points per model is too expensive for a Mark of Chaos.

19. Havocs: 10 points per model is too expensive for a Mark of Chaos. Slaanesh Havocs should be costed at 20 points in line with Noise Marines.

20. Chaos Lord: Should not come with EW and standard as currently he is overpowered at 85 points. Raise his base cost to 100 points and make EW and optional upgrade for 35points (this puts the Lord in line with Saga of the Bear Wolf Lords). Re-add option for personal icon.

21. Sorceror: Remove EW.

22. Sorceror Lord: Delete this entirely. The Sorceror, Chaos Lord and Daemon Prince gives players enough options already.

23. Daemon Prince: Undercosted at 100 points. Raise this to 120 points. Add options for Mark of Nurgle and Mark of Khorne (as this is not written clearly). Psychic powers should be selected and not purchased (to put the ruleset in line with 5th edition mechanics).

24. Special Characters: All of these need work and are a case of “back to the drawing board”. In terms of EW, only Abaddon and Doom Rider should get this. Huron and Kharn should get something instead like a higher Inv Save, toughness or FNP to represent their ’ardness.

25. Land Raider: Raise cost to 250 points as the model now had POTMS.

26. Undivided Legion Rules: Makes these an upgrade for HQs. Add a 1 per army clause.

H.B.M.C. wrote: Goood! Goooood!

Your hate has made you powerful. Now take your Privateer Press tape measure and strike me down with all your hatred and your journey to the dark side will be complete!!!


 
   
Made in es
Morphing Obliterator




Elsewhere

Puscifer wrote:

Please bear in mind that I didn't write this. I will pass on any comments to it's author, but don't flame the messenger, I only got asked to post this. I've played this for a few weeks and it's pretty good.



You and the writer have earned my respect. In order to write this the writer must love Chaos and be willing to work. In order to post this and play with it you must be open-minded to new rules and changes, something I do like. I respect you both, so I will not flame you nor the writer. Keep this in mind while I flame the codex, and remember this is constructive criticism and just an opinion.

Game-Wise: it is heavily overpowered. I would feel like cheating if I use this codex, and I will not play against someone using it. Every single unit is far too powerful and far too cheap. Aside of this:
1) the Sword of Ecstasy is a logical nonsense ("always strike first"), I think you should change it to "I = 10".
2) the Lucius rule "No other models may be involved in this combat as this would offend Lucius' pride." should refer only to models of your own army. It may sounds harsh, but Tyranids (among others) do not care about Lucius´ pride.

Fluff-Wise: for me it is the most important thing.
1) Why Chaos Space Marines gain "Mark of Chaos Undivided"? It sounds like all Slaanesh worshippers must be Noise Marines, or like all Tzeentch followers must be 1000 Sons. They should be able to join any God, or all of them (Undivided), or none of them (renegades, Night Lords). Same goes for Chaos Bikers. Actually I do not understand at all the logic behind who can get which Mark.
Defilers: only Khorne or Nurgle. Never heard of "Glory of Slaanesh", a famous Defiler?. And Tzeentch loves automatas. The rest of the vehicles have more or less the same problem.
Havocs: no Tzeentch? Khorne I can understand why (though I think they should be able to take this Mark however)
Possessed: no Tzeeentch. OK, this is getting boring, so I will stop here. Mark options just do not make any sense to me.

2) Obliterators. They do not follow the Chaos Gods nor obey the Chaos Lords. They are not even Adeptus Astartes. I do believe they should be restricted to armies related to the Dark Mechanicum (Iron Warriors, of course) or those who respect Chaos Undivided. Mark of Tzeentch? Why? They are Undivided.
3) Spawn. ? They have an amazing model + background.
4) Furies should be Fast.
5) Only one Mark: undivided like Black Legion or Word Bearers should be able to take ANY mark or combination of Marks.
6) Night Lords: they are all about Terror. Their rules should reflect this. And they had more Assault Troops than any legion, including Blood Angels. Raptors as Troops is my opinion.
7) Rules for Word Bearers looks... too weak (fluff wise). They have lots of stuff you can use. Same go for any Legion, actually.
8) Iron Warriors got Havocs. Why? They excel in siege, they uses heavy-armoured demonically-posssessed vehicles and they have a strong link with the Dark side of the Ad Mech.
9) Alpha Legion can infiltrate any unit... including Predators or Land Raiders. CREEEEED!!
10) Why did everyone lose their Personal Icon?

Painting/Modeling wise:
No icons? They look great. They are... iconic.

It is nice to read stuff like that, however. Keep the good work.


‘Your warriors will stand down and withdraw, Curze. That is an order, not a request. (…) When this campaign is won, you and I will have words’
Rogal Dorn, just before taking the beating of his life.
from The Dark King, by Graham McNeill.
 
   
Made in it
Focused Dark Angels Land Raider Pilot





everyone gets EW... yeaaaaah....
relly... EW just for abaddon and typhus please....
   
Made in ca
Despised Traitorous Cultist



Calgary, Alberta, Canada

Love the dreadclaw drop pod. sounds fun to hit anything with it. Makes termicide worth it.

GENERATION 10: The first time you see this, copy and paste it into your sig and add 1 to the number after generation. Consider it a social experiment.

95% of teens would go into a panic attack if the jonas brothers were about to jump off the empire state building copy and paste this if you are the 5% who would pull up a lawn chair grab some popcorn and yell JUMP BITCHES!!!!!!!!!!!!! 
   
 
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