Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hey y'all,

just a quick question, if I have a farseer join a unit of harlies, then send them through terrain, with the farseer walking outside the terrain but within 2in of the unit
do I take a DT test or not?

Wings of Light wrote:Hey y'all,

just a quick question, if I have a farseer join a unit of harlies, then send them through terrain, with the farseer walking outside the terrain but within 2in of the unit
do I take a DT test or not?

I would say no. As page 14 says only models that moved through, started in, or ended in the terrain needs to test.

Harlequins dont need to test though, i think its their flip belts

And I would say yes, since the above is an incorrect synopsis of what the rule says. What it actually says is that if any model in the unit moves through, into, or out of difficult terrain, the unit must test. Page 14, main rulebook.
And if the Farseer has joined them, regardless of his position on the table, then the entire unit does not have the special Harlie ability to ignore difficult terrain and therefor the entire unit has to test.

I was thinking he meant dangerous terrain. Dangerous terrain says to roll a D6 for each model that moves through, so if the seer did not move through he would be okay.

Dangerous terrain I agree, since it's done on a model by model basis.

I would say yes. Since it is treated like a unit.

Nevermind...

Homer

So in summary. If it is difficult terrain the IC will need to test, even if he stays outside, as it effects the whole unit. If it is dangerous terrain only those who move through would need to test.

Too bad the Farseer lost his Move Through Cover USR for joining a unit that doesn't have the rule. ;-)

don_mondo wrote:And if the Farseer has joined them, regardless of his position on the table, then the entire unit does not have the special Harlie ability to ignore difficult terrain and therefor the entire unit has to test.

But the ability is granted by wargear, much like Nartheciums. Command Squads don't have FNP, but they are granted FNP by the Narthecium. Just because the Farseer doesn't have a flip belt doesn't mean the Harlequins don't have a flip belt. It's not a special rule (iirc), it's a piece of wargear.

I think the OP raises a fair question. The Harlequins ignore the terrain for all intents and purposes. They do not have to test. The farseer does not have a flip belt, but is not in terrain. Now, I understand that difficult terrain tests are not taken on a model-to-model basis, but as a unit. But if the part of the unit that is moving through the cover is not forced to test (by a piece of wargear), then what is forcing the farseer to test?

He would take a test because his unit is forced to take a test. But his unit isn't forced to take a test. In fact, they ignore the trigger to take the test altogether. . .

Edit: Since I'm at work I don't have my BRB, but it could all depend on the wording of Moving Through Difficult Terrain.

Wargear that states it effects the whole unit confers special rules to the whole unit(Narthsium, Pain boy Doc's Tools, etc); also rule that themselves state that the whole unit benefits from it confers the ability to others in the unit(Stealth). Wargear that models have that grant special rules has no effect on models in the unit without such gear(Flip belts, combat drugs, termy armor, Iron Halo, etc).

The farseer does not have a flip belt and the unit entered Difficult terrain(even if the farseer himself did not enter the Terrain) there fore the unit must test as units move at the rate of the slowest model(in this case the Farseer who must make a Difficult terrain test).

Kel's got it. Even though the Harlequins ignore the effects of the Difficult Terrain the Farseer does not, and whatever rate the Farseer is moving at is the same rate everyone in the unit can move at.

Therefore they would use 3d6 since the slowest model is an IC.

Reecius wrote:Therefore they would use 3d6 since the slowest model is an IC.

Doesn't the IC loose the 3d6 when he joins a squad? I may be off here.

It doesn't say anything about that, just that all ICs have MTC and SR. Sine the unit moves at the rate of the slowest model, the IC, they would use 3d6.

Doesn't page 75 of BRB say that an IC that joins a squad looses Move through cover.

Melchiour wrote:Doesn't page 75 of BRB say that an IC that joins a squad looses Move through cover.

Yes, Move through Cover is lost when an IC with it joins a unit without it (the USR has an asterisk by it).

I stand corrected!

Stupid Farseer. Needs to borrow a flip belt from his Harlie buddies.

Let me get this clear:
In the rules it says a unit moving through difficult terrain they have to take a test, then belts ignores this effect on the harlies, but seer gotta take it, which means the whole unit takes the test?

Thanks for all your replies

If you typically attach the farseer to a squad of Harlequins then mount him on a jetbike - problem solved.

Afrikan Blonde wrote:If you typically attach the farseer to a squad of Harlequins then mount him on a jetbike - problem solved.

Solved? Now he can't run and cripples the Harlequins even further by making them unable to use run+Fleet to assault.

My question is why must your farseer be attached? The psychic powers I think you are using, or indeed all of them can be used from a nearby squad or even inside a transport.

juraigamer wrote:My question is why must your farseer be attached? The psychic powers I think you are using, or indeed all of them can be used from a nearby squad or even inside a transport.

You want the VoT to affect the seer if he is on foot.

Wings of Light wrote:Let me get this clear:
In the rules it says a unit moving through difficult terrain they have to take a test, then belts ignores this effect on the harlies, but seer gotta take it, which means the whole unit takes the test?

Thanks for all your replies

Yes, and no.

The unit is attempting to move through Difficult Terrain. Flip belts ignore Difficult terrain. The Farseer does not have a Flip Belt. Because 1 model in the unit does not get to ignore difficult terrain that model forces the unit to make the Difficult terrain test(even if that model does not actually move through the difficult terrain); this is because units move at the pace of the slowest models. Now during an assault; only the Farseer would wind up at I1 because the Harleys ignore Difficult terrain therefore are not slowed to I1.

Kommissar Kel wrote:

Wings of Light wrote:Let me get this clear:
In the rules it says a unit moving through difficult terrain they have to take a test, then belts ignores this effect on the harlies, but seer gotta take it, which means the whole unit takes the test?

Thanks for all your replies

Yes, and no.

The unit is attempting to move through Difficult Terrain. Flip belts ignore Difficult terrain. The Farseer does not have a Flip Belt. Because 1 model in the unit does not get to ignore difficult terrain that model forces the unit to make the Difficult terrain test(even if that model does not actually move through the difficult terrain); this is because units move at the pace of the slowest models. Now during an assault; only the Farseer would wind up at I1 because the Harleys ignore Difficult terrain therefore are not slowed to I1.

Page 14 "If any of the models in a unit start their move inside difficult terrain, the unit is affected by the terrain and must take a difficult terrain test. Roll two D6 and select the highest – this is the maximum distance in inches that all of the models in the unit (not just the ones in difficult terrain!) may move."
So yep for movement, but
"If, following the rules for moving assaulting models , any model in an assaulting unit will have to go through difficult or dangerous terrain as part of its assault move, the unit must take the relevant terrain test before moving. This has two disadvantages." Page 36
I thake that to mean, as a model, which doesn't ignore terrain was in the unit, the 'any model' is satisfied. He'd looking at the harlies thinking "'dar that's difficult".

yeah, no You are correct; the farseer also makes them slow down in CC.

well if you have VoT the difficult terain doesnt matter anwyay cause the unit has assault grenades.