Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hey guys. I just started getting into 40k and I was a little disappointed with something. I have always loved Dwarfs in every fantasy game, mmo ect. So when I heard of 40k and found out that it was a technological, space, genre of a game, I thought that Dwarfs would be a part of it. I was saddened to hear that they were removed. So I was just wondering if you think that a dwarf like race will ever be added into the game ?

Well, we can squat around and discuss but the idea would likely be squashed like a bug.

Probably not. The Squats were removed because the guys at GW couldn't find a way to make them fun to play. A lot of people genuinely miss them. Though if you make the models you can use the IG codex as a stand in... not the same but still.
They won't add another race into 40k as they have too many as it is. Though there are hopes they will fold some codcii into each other so there may be space for one if they feel like creating one...

Well I hope so :/ I can just imagine the things that they could create

1081shadow wrote:Well I hope so :/ I can just imagine the things that they could create

First they have to get their act together. Re-do all the armies that don't have a 5th ed rulebook, fold away the unnecessary SM/Inq multiple codecii into a larger collection of them. Then they can release another army if they will at all.

that will not be for a long time

If they reintroduce a dwarvern race it will most likely be the Demiurg not the Squats. As it would be alot easier just adding a unit or two to the next Tau codex.

As Squats still exist in the 40K universe, just in tiny numbers, you could add them to inquisitor rentinue or use counts-as C:IG.

The problem GW has wouls be which new faction to add, their are so many great possibilities that could be done over a Squat list.

I think the idea that the guys at GW couldn’t make squats fun to play (if true) demonstrates that the guys making the decisions back then were out of touch with the gamers themselves.

Squats were by far one of the most popular races in epic, where they had unique and awesome vehicles. If they had expanded the weapons for Exo armoured infantry and given them some future takes on a few of the dwarven things from fantasy they would of been half decent, rather than just short fat IG.

I know a lot of vets were pretty disappointed with the way GW handled the whole Squat thing, now they get funny for just mentioning them in my local shop.

I think they also felt that squats was too much like just plain old fantasy, just in space.

Jervis did say this about squats " In the future we want to return to the Squats, but whatever we do will be radically different to what has gone before(and they'll be called something other than Squats to boot!)"

Page 20 of Citadel Journal # 33 from 1999.

AgeOfEgos wrote:Well, we can squat around and discuss but the idea would likely be squashed like a bug.

I see what you did there.

BluntmanDC wrote:If they reintroduce a dwarvern race it will most likely be the Demiurg not the Squats. As it would be alot easier just adding a unit or two to the next Tau codex.

As Squats still exist in the 40K universe, just in tiny numbers, you could add them to inquisitor rentinue or use counts-as C:IG.

The problem GW has wouls be which new faction to add, their are so many great possibilities that could be done over a Squat list.

Agreed. Squats are gone. The Demiurg would be a fresh new start into 40kified dwarfs. Which would be the best chance of a decent army. Of course they need to do some serious housekeeping as regards to other armies before they look at introducing a new army. Even then I feel Adeptus Mechanicus would be more deserving of a codex first.

I dunno, as an older player part of me would prefer to see the Squats return before the AdMech arrives. It's a history thing. If they can't be bothered to maintain what they have / had then there's no point in bringing in something new. Look at the Lost races and the out of date codexes before you create something new. I still know people with Squat forces that would love to have a Codex to run.

Would you consider Ratlings to be kind of like Dwarves?

Capt_Bowman wrote:I dunno, as an older player part of me would prefer to see the Squats return before the AdMech arrives. It's a history thing. If they can't be bothered to maintain what they have / had then there's no point in bringing in something new. Look at the Lost races and the out of date codexes before you create something new. I still know people with Squat forces that would love to have a Codex to run.

unfortunetly for these people they make up a very tiny fraction of people in the hobby and an even smaller fraction of GW income (as we know from dakka alot of vets either stick with their old armies or buy secondhand models and redo them). As a whole its the people who actually make up GW income that get what they want, the young with lots of loose money that spend it in the GW stores, who only hear about the squats from that creepy old guy in the corner sobbing the words 'the old days, oh the old days'.

As i said GW don't need to make a new codex, they just add the Demiurg to the next Tau.

L_Dawg wrote:Would you consider Ratlings to be kind of like Dwarves?

No, seeing as they are a direct transfer of the halflings from WHF to 40K

Ratlings are Hobbits.
Ogryns are Ogres.

I agree.

The Demiurg will probably be available through the next Tau codex whenever that is.

Demiurg work with Tau IIRC they showed them how to make Ion weapons

Well if you wanted you can make your own Dwarf army and use them as a counts as to some other codex. Ive seena couple Squat armies counting as IG and they looked really good. I hate Squats, but a good conversion is a good conversion

BluntmanDC wrote:

Capt_Bowman wrote:I dunno, as an older player part of me would prefer to see the Squats return before the AdMech arrives. It's a history thing. If they can't be bothered to maintain what they have / had then there's no point in bringing in something new. Look at the Lost races and the out of date codexes before you create something new. I still know people with Squat forces that would love to have a Codex to run.

unfortunetly for these people they make up a very tiny fraction of people in the hobby and an even smaller fraction of GW income (as we know from dakka alot of vets either stick with their old armies or buy secondhand models and redo them). As a whole its the people who actually make up GW income that get what they want, the young with lots of loose money that spend it in the GW stores, who only hear about the squats from that creepy old guy in the corner sobbing the words 'the old days, oh the old days'.

That is deffinately something people forget, yes I can see how its aggrivating that every new edition there are blood angels and SM right off the bat, however those are the armies that sell well wherein armies like the necrons and Inquisition apparently don't sell very well(which in my opinion is a bummer considering the scifi world is riddled with hordes of eat all things and humans in massive armor)

Necrons don't sell well because their codex is nearly 10 years old and crappy, and they haven't had any new models for about as long except the Forge World Tomb Stalker.

BluntmanDC wrote:

L_Dawg wrote:Would you consider Ratlings to be kind of like Dwarves?

No, seeing as they are a direct transfer of the halflings from WHF to 40K

Right. I never played Fantasy Warhammer. How much different is it?

Kilkrazy wrote:Necrons don't sell well because their codex is nearly 10 years old and crappy, and they haven't had any new models for about as long except the Forge World Tomb Stalker.

Exactly. Find some of the older threads of DE players whining about how old their codex was. Theres ALWAYS people in there saying well DE should just be phased out, no one plays them anymore. Now look at it. I think Im the only person that hasnt played against them yet

i say they should bring back the beastmen platoons in IG alongside squats & ogryns as units - afterall they were the other original abhuman in the lists - what happened to them?!?!?

I was hoping they'd bring back Squats for a long time.

Then, they released Tau.

An army focused on technology and shooting. With a complete lack of all psychic (aka magic) abilities. This is basically the exact same niche as squats would fulfill, so I don't think there's any design space for squats unless Tau are killed off.

I have to say this if you want a group that drinks alot and is tough to boot(general dwarfiness) go Space Wolves

purplefood wrote:Probably not. The Squats were removed because the guys at GW couldn't find a way to make them fun to play. A lot of people genuinely miss them. Though if you make the models you can use the IG codex as a stand in... not the same but still.
They won't add another race into 40k as they have too many as it is. Though there are hopes they will fold some codcii into each other so there may be space for one if they feel like creating one...

This is actually wrong.

Squats were already fun to play, the models were nice, and they had a background that was on par with Orks.

But the real reason, from everything I've been told/heard from people like Andy Chambers at Games Days in years past, was simply that they couldn't find a way to make Squats fit in with the background change.

Squats when they started out were pretty much the same as Orks. A silly conceptual archetype of a fantasy race in space. But as they were trying to find a way to bring Squats in...they realized the niches were already filled.

Hard-drinking, clan based race? Space Wolves.
Silly, biker styled fantasy archetype in space that specializes in weird technology? Orks.

And so on and so forth.

So, Squats weren't let go because they "couldn't find a way to make them fun to play".

It was because they "couldn't find a way to have them in the background that didn't already step on the toes of an existing faction that was already fleshed out more than the Squats were".

DB wrote:i say they should bring back the beastmen platoons in IG alongside squats & ogryns as units - afterall they were the other original abhuman in the lists - what happened to them?!?!?

They're in the current codex, under "Conscripts".

i for one am glad they got rid of them and have moved away from generic "fantasy in space" stuff. i prefer new races.

i do think they would fit with the Tau as a merc unit though.

It would be hard to bring them back since they already decided that nearly all of them have been killed by 'Nids.

Fantasy Dorfs + Catachan arms = super Squat team.