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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/24 23:50:56
Subject: Dark Eldar. One shot, two vehicle damage rolls
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Regular Dakkanaut
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I was re-reading my codex once again. I do this a lot. This morning I noticed something I have missed literally a hundred times when it comes to Haywire Blasters. That is that when striking a vehicle you resolve the S4 hit first, then roll the haywire effects. I was kind of shocked that you can get two vehicle damage rolls off of one vehicle.
The tactic is scourges are fast. Move quickly towards side armour and rear armour values that can be effected. AV10. Scourges are fast, can deepstrike, so are excellent at this.
Here is the link where I was discussing it in a little more detail. I hate repeating myself.
http://natfka.blogspot.com/2011/01/secrets-of-dark-eldar-one-shot-two.html
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/01/24 23:52:06
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/25 02:07:37
Subject: Dark Eldar. One shot, two vehicle damage rolls
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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The S4 hit has such a negligible chance of actually affecting most vehicles that I wouldn't encourage it as a tactic. It's an added bonus to the Haywire Blaster, but no more.
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There's just an acre of you fellas, isn't there? |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/25 03:20:58
Subject: Dark Eldar. One shot, two vehicle damage rolls
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Sybarite Swinging an Agonizer
Alabama
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I noticed that a month or so ago and have been running Scourges since. The haywire blaster is just fun to play with.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/25 04:24:14
Subject: Re:Dark Eldar. One shot, two vehicle damage rolls
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Infiltrating Broodlord
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Haywire Blasters are soooo good.
Many times you don't need to 'maybe' blow up vehicles to win with Lances, but rather 'guarantee' they can't fire each turn with Haywire Blasters.
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Ayn Rand "We can evade reality, but we cannot evade the consequences of evading reality" |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/25 05:30:40
Subject: Re:Dark Eldar. One shot, two vehicle damage rolls
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Fixture of Dakka
Feasting on the souls of unworthy opponents
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*ponders*
This past weekend I did some messing around with both scourges and reaver jetbikes. I definitely reinforced my opinion that I don't like reaver jetbikes....
Scourges...really depends. The reason I'm playing around with them is because I'm thinking of Black Templar and the potential likelihood of seeing more blessed hull floating around - against which my lances and blasters simply won't cut it. They have a 4+ armour save, and I took away my beasts to try them - which meant that I was tossing my Baron into this unit to give them a 3+ cover save. I think that where I ultimately sit with scourges is this:
What they can do, you can do elsewhere in the codex better. Haywire hits - a squad of wyches will do the trick. And more hits than scourges, and capable of doing more than just trying to glance vehicles. This past weekend I was tooling around at a gamestore for some friendly games; I didn't get to play against Black Templar, but the new Dark Angels came out to play with Ravenwing / First Company and I put a beating on them - my nine wyches jumped into a terminator squad (+1S power, so I was wounding on 4+) after a bit of fire support; it was an assault cannons, a Lightning Claw, a TH/SS, two powerfists, and one of the special Independent Characters, whom I don't remember at the moment. Tied combat for 5 player turns (losing 5 wyches to his 5 terminators) before beating his special character down.
Anyway, if you're looking to beat down regular vehicles, scourges aren't the way to go. Lances and blasters are absolutely superior. If you're looking to keep an element in your army capable of dealing with blessed hull and living armour....wyches with haywire grenades or scourges with haywire blasters (or a combination of both) are the way to go. But not as a primary anti-tank force.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/25 14:50:32
Subject: Dark Eldar. One shot, two vehicle damage rolls
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Reavers are still good units based on the fact that their fast movement allows them to reposition themselves. In my test games, I've found they work best out of a portal. This allows them to get first strike and usually by the time they come out there are several transports that have been opened. This allows you some choices. Either use the bikes to pop more tanks, or use the bikes to rake all those MSU units that were hiding in said tanks. Last week I faced off against a mech eldar army and took his army task by getting to those MSU dire avenger units with the bikes and blade vaning them dead. They also are good for blocking movement, cutting off favorable assault routes for your opponent. I have also used them to block table edges so my opponent last limited avenues of approach with his reserved his units. All in all, I'd say that bikes are worth considering. They are good harassment units that are totally expendable. I haven't tried out scourges yet as I'm waiting for the models. I'm too lazy to convert any.
Lances and blasters are still the workhorses of the book though, but Reavers add an element of "need to deal with" that helps takes the pressure off your other units.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/01/25 14:52:26
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/25 15:05:39
Subject: Dark Eldar. One shot, two vehicle damage rolls
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Sybarite Swinging an Agonizer
Alabama
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@Dash, I agree, the scourges are definately not the be all end all of anti tank. Imo, they just make a really good multi-threat support unit that's good for harrassment. With their 12" move, and decently ranged assault weapons, they have a nice threat range. They can be used to try and glance vehicles, or they have enough shots to give troops pause. The haywire blaster can still be against troops since they made it S4 AP4. At a squad size of 5, they have 11 shots when equipped with HB. I normally use them to pick on transports and use ravagers and/or trueborn squads with blasters to kill tanks.
They beat the pants off reavers though, as far as survivability and firepower. Reavers just have to get too close to be effective and then suck when they're in that close.
offtopic: Wych squads with haywire grenades. I don't normally run them like that but I can imagine how effective they would be with that many grenades. I'm assuming that you only attack tanks with them, since you don't want to be stuck getting shot to death by any surviving units inside a transport. Also, in the event that the tank explodes, do you get the wych's close combat save, since they are in close combat, or do you take their 6+ save since it's an explosion and not an attack by a close combat weapon?
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/01/25 15:22:04
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/25 15:11:34
Subject: Dark Eldar. One shot, two vehicle damage rolls
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[DCM]
Tilter at Windmills
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I like Wyches with Haywire too.
Their 4++ only works against close combat attacks, though; not explosions.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/26 03:22:57
Subject: Dark Eldar. One shot, two vehicle damage rolls
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Mysterious Techpriest
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The real benefit to haywire grenades is you're probably going to be glancing the target to death, getting a wrecked result, or just leaving it unable to do anything meaningful. It'll only explode on a double six (six to pen, and six to explode, anything else will be a wrecked at the most), or 1/36th of the time.
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