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Hey guys,

I am looking for a new game in addition to my WHFB and WH40K. I am looking at either BFG or Dystopian wars. I listed my likes and dislikes about each. Now please try to push me one way or the other on what game, just help persuade me to either game i guess, and leave your thoughts on the game, i would appreciate any information about my Cons or Pros

Pros BFG: Played a game with it today using proxy tau drones had quite a lot of fun, really cool game. I know the maker GW, and is cheap with free rules and not requiring lots of minis for big battles.

Cons BFG: Very little if any support from GW its kind of done in the OFFICIAL development which is a worry because it could get boring if there isn't new elements being added in.

Dystopian Wars pros: GREAT models, good support (looks like), lots more depth and options, more elements and i love the idea about air,sea,land all being combined into one game that would be so cool, it seems a bit more intuitive than BFG.

DW Cons: Dont know Maker, in England does United states stores carry it? and price, new game mechanic, Exploding dice? (dont quite get) which have 50/50 reviews, could be hard to learn with LOTS of rules.. (but i guess im kind of looking for that too so that so so) and resin i have never worked with it and i heard it requires alot more work than plastic

So Lets here your thoughts!

Thanks
-Cory

BFG. No question for me.

Steampunk ship battles don't appeal to me. Firestorm Armada has more chance, but I already own three space fleets for different games, why do I need to add a fourth for another game - and they are larger?

Yes, US stores carry DW. Check out the D6 Generation podcast sometimes. They LOVE the game.

More info and support can be found here http://www.sg.tacticalwargames.net/forum/index.php and http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/index.php?sid=5b83297eb10c69dbdce2408a5356cfa7 for BFG.

I've looked at Dystopia, and can't make up my mind. I do know that BFG is good, and I'm in the process of pointing and pricing up a chaos fleet. Players is the big problem for me.

Hmm Thanks for the replys guys,

Well i ahve read a few steampunk novels and actually really like the ideas in them a big part for me is they include ways to in one game to fight on air,land,sea and the models look good to me does anyone know how their resin quality is? Because if its anything like forgeworld where you have to do all kinds of crazy things and it's a given it comes bent, i dont want to deal with that, Something i also have been thinking is why start ANOTHER 40k army if already have one, that i like? why not start a whole new game and branch out? I mean BFG was a lot of fun but i feel like i would want more after a while and GW shows no signs of really supporting it... and DW has gotten some GREAT reviews. hmmm but with BFG the fluff matches with 40k so we could do linked campaigns.. Still cant decide..

I have the FSA for DW but I have yet to open the box yet. I have just finished assembling the boxed set of Imperial Navy for Uncharted Seas (similar game by the same people) and the quality of the models was better than I could have hoped for. Extremely minimal to no work on prepping the resin and the metal sails were standard for any metal model I have ever dealt with. I suspect DW resin models may have slightly more work to them as they have more detail than the typical US model.

Hope that helps for model quality.

I have observed several games of Firestorm Armada and Uncharted Seas and am excited to play them both. Unfortunately I have zero first-hand experience in either game so take my opinion as you like. I did buy into both DW and US with simply observing games.

Flaim

Hmm interesting. glad to hear the resin isnt too bad which is a definite plus.

thanks for the reply

I think the Spartan game is fugly but I'd rather play a game that is supported.

hmm what do you think is "fugly" about spartan. Explanation would be good.

Thanks

I think some of Spartan's stuff looks nice. Their Firestorm Armada line has a lot of neat ships. But the steampunk thing is not really for me and the steampunk thing delivered in chunky, caricaturesque resin is even less my thing. Gothic scifi wins hands down over Victorian manners and a bunch of brass gears -- for me, at least. YMMV. The main problem with BFG is what's out there is it. The last thing to come out for it was like two or three years ago, no? (The AdMech BB, I guess.) If you have to pick one or the other, at least Spartan will likely deliver more models and rules in this decade.

I'd go with Dystopian, even though I haven't played it yet (Have both Firestorm and Uncharted)

Reasons:

1) It will cost you less to get into Dystopian -- the Spartan price points are amazing

2) Models -- The spartan resins are really, really solid, and they are huge in comparison to other naval games. This makes for great fun IMO.

3) Balance -- GW has never really cared about balancing their games and BFG isn't perfect. Its not terrible and pretty solid if you stick to Imp vs Chaos, but I know that spartan supports the game and will do what they need to, to keep the game balanced.

Tough choice BLAST, they are both great games! Here is what I think:

If you are only going to pick one of the two games, my initial gut reaction is to tell you to go for Dystopian Wars. I think that its biggest advantage is that it is currently supported with new models and new rules, and it also has the interesting angle of combining land, sea, and air into one game. This will probably mean that you will have an easier time finding opponents to play against, although that is highly situational. To specifically address your concerns with it:

Maker: Spartan games is a relatively new company, but it looks like they are going to be sticking around for a while. From all appearances, the 3 main games they have put out (Uncharted Seas, Firestorm Armada, and now Dystopian Wars) have all been successful and are continuing to grow.

US Availabiliy: Spartan is carried widely in the independent stores here in Northern Virginia, so you should be able to get it out there in the Hoosier State. If not, there is always The War Store .

Exploding Dice: Spartan's games work on the principle of "hits." Each model has a Damage Rating (DR) and a Critical Rating (CR). You need to score a number of hits equal to that rating to damage the model. A hit is typically scored on a 4, 5, or 6, with 6's counting as 2 hits and allowing you to roll another die (this is the exploding part). If you roll enough hits to get a Critical, then you do 2 points of damage and get a roll on the critical hit table. For example, take a notional cruiser with a DR of 4 and a CR of 6. Another model makes a 5-dice attack, and rolls the following:

3, 2, 5, 5, 6

This is equal to 4 hits, as the "6" counts as 2 hits and each "5" counts as one. This equals the DR of the target, and it takes a point of damage. But that's not all! The attacker gets another die to roll because of the "6." If he rolls a 4 or 5, then he causes a total of 5 hits. If he rolls another "6", that takes the total hits to 6, and he gets yet another die to roll (explody!). The attacker keeps going like this until he stops rolling 6's.

The biggest problem people seem to have with this system is that it does make it possible for a frigate to 1-hit a battleship if a player gets an exceptionally lucky roll of 6's. To me, it just makes the game more dramatic an interesting, since there is always hope that even a weak attack can have an impact. Definitely one of those "YMMV" things. I would say a majority of people like the mechanic from what I've seen (that is, it's nowhere near a 50/50 split), but it does seem to be one of those things people either love or hate.

Price: Depending on which BFG fleet you plan on collecting, DW might be significantly cheaper. Since BFG ships, other than the Chaos an IN cruisers, are metal, they can be quite pricy. The fleet starter boxes for DW are quite the bargain in comparison. On the other hand, if you are going to scratch-build a Nid or Ork fleet out of bits, then BFG would indeed be cheaper.

Sorry that was so long, I hope it helps!

No long is good! (thats what she said!!) haha sorry about that.

Very helpful! the mechanic sounds cool because it adds a cool under dog opportunity to the game a small frigate popping a battleship against all odds! EPIC!

I think i want to try it out sounds great and im gald to here the resin is top of the line! A big factor now is if my local store carries it! If it doesn't we will have to see because i hate ordering online!

Ok, I would say no to Firestorm Armada, the ships are chunky rather crap and the rules are an older edition of the Spartan mechanic with more flaws. Firestorm Armada not Systopian Wars is the competitor to BFG.

Dystopian is better, and its not a space naval game, and its similar to BFG in quality. I still believe BFG is a better game system, and while it has fleet balance issues it actually has less balance issues than Dystopian Wars. Both cases can be overcome with a little thought, and flatly refusing the complete mismatches both systems can throw in.

My answer, buy into both.

All four Dystopian Wars starter fleets plus carriers and a couple of large BFG fleets will cost about as much as a 1500pt 40K army. This does assume a bit of smart buying to get the BFG, you will get less if you use the GW store. Consider both games and a lot for each as the equivalent to your next army build. When it comes to the time you want your next 40K army buy the ships instead. assuming you collect three factions for each game plus rules etc it will come up about even.

I dunno, I find FA to be a lot of fun, and I actually rather like the ship designs. Leaving that aside, though, there is no getting around the fact that FA falls way short of BFG in terms of scenarios, background, and number of different ships. Although, there are a number of major releases planed for FA that should go along way towards rectifying these deficiencies. So, the situation might be radically different in 6 months!

Hmmm i cant decide i really need to get a hold of the DW rule book, Fa is out of the question, i really dont like their models at all. The price of one pretty large BFG fleet should be too bad not at all near a 40k army 1500 point to set like 1000 pts. its like just around 100$ and thats buying straight from GW!

Consider this image.



then make your choice...

MeanGreenStompa wrote:Consider this image.



then make your choice...

There have been a lot of attempts to upscale BFG, however Banner pole toppers the size of star destroyers is too much, even for the Imperium of Man.

I do believe BFG has better ships, and a better rule system, but both are good both are cheap and both have nice toys. I have to admit it, the Imperium Class Sky Fortress is cooler than any of my BFG battleships, even the Eldar one.

EPIC haha i think im going to stick with BFG because i have the rules and know what it is and i really enjoyed the two games i have played already!

Orlanth wrote:

There have been a lot of attempts to upscale BFG, however Banner pole toppers the size of star destroyers is too much, even for the Imperium of Man.

I do believe BFG has better ships, and a better rule system, but both are good both are cheap and both have nice toys. I have to admit it, the Imperium Class Sky Fortress is cooler than any of my BFG battleships, even the Eldar one.

Well, if by attempts, you mean the published vision of the game's creators, than yes . IN ships were always meant to be this huge, although I agree it is a bit much!

It's fairly accurate (giant space flags notwithstanding...)

http://www.merzo.net/

IHEARTLARGEBLASTTEMPLATES wrote:EPIC haha i think im going to stick with BFG because i have the rules and know what it is and i really enjoyed the two games i have played already!

Then this may interest you:

http://www.tacticalwargames.net/archive/bfgmag/index.html

BFG is pretty well supported.... just not officially.
Check out the SG link in the post above.

Wow thanks you very much great link!!

I had no idea about this, thank you!

Anyway my mega-buindle arrived today. Its imprssive, I got a lot for my money and the quality was very high throughout. Very few miscasts and most pieces were perfect as far as they eye could tell.

Easily more reliable than Forgeworld and a tiny fraction of the price.

I will try some BFG-Dystopian Wars comparison shots later, but dont hold your breath for them, I have painting to do first.

well please post here when you get them i would love to see, even though i have decided on BFG.

I've literally just played a quick game of dystopian wars for the first time, I'm quite new to the whole gaming scene and I picked up the basics very quickly, the general feel of it is quite smooth and the models are quite nice. I would stronly recommend giving it a chance, if it wasn't for the fact I'm planning to cross over from 40k to fantasy I would definately invest in some stuff, now I'm going to have to wait a few pay days before I get some.

I think you will find players for Dystopian Wars much, much more easily.

I dunno how anyone can call BFG cheap! I went with FA over it because i can get a fleet starter for the price of 1 Imperial capital ship, plus the fact that its current and being worked on where BFG has been put out to pasture.

I'm going to support Dystopian Wars. While, at the moment, it's more or less Uncharted Seas with steampunk, in a year's time it will be so much more.

We're already seeing the release of more Flyers in the game, and we should see the release of the ground forces before summer. The ability for a game to encompass sea, land and air combat is simply to great to ignore.

Dystopian Wars even has better starter boxes than Spartan's other games. You get 3 more frigates, 10 tiny flyer tokens, and a pair of bombers!

Errr..........Full Thrust?

I know it doesn't fit into the OP but it is brilliant.