Canadian Customs Charges on Wargaming products.

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**MechaEmperor7000**

I'm currently considering ordering from Maelstrom games for some Wraithguard, as they're actually cheaper than eBay prices given the exchange rates. However, one question that's been nagging me is the Customs cost. My dad is vehemtly refusing to even help me get any more info on customs, on the account that he once got a charge of 200 bucks on a box of vaccum tubes he ordered for 30 bucks, and I have not found anything on the internet to be useful on the subject, so I turn to you, fellow Dakkites, for some answers. How do they choose the packages to check and how much do they usually charge them? I plan on ordering 20 Wraithguard, in moderate sections of 5 at a time, and so I wanna know if I'm going to get charged an obscene amount of custom taxes for these. Thanks.

On a related note, how's Maelstrom's general customer service dealing with lost packages? Lost Packages is my main concern about ordering online.

**Mr. Burning**

MechaEmperor7000 wrote: Lost Packages is my main concern about ordering online.

You are either a pensioner, don't get out much, or believe too many tales about interweb shopping. Considering the amount of items sold and dispatched on line lost packages are not really that big of a problem.

Maelstrom are okay, they respond quickly to issues.

As for customs charges and information maybe these will help?

http://canadaonline.about.com/od/customs/Canada_Customs_and_Border_Services.htm

http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/menu-eng.html
http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/trade-commerce/tariff-tarif/menu-eng.html

You are allowed $60 as a gift but it depends on how Maelstrom list your goods, ask Maelsrom before ordering how their goods are listed for customs then speak to customs or your postal service about any tariffs or charges.

**Kilkrazy**

Please do try a bit of research before giving up. It took me only 30 seconds to find the Canadian government web page about personal import.

Maelstrom may refuse to label your package as a gift because it is illegal.

Normally there is an import duty free limit -- it's £18 for the UK. When the package value goes above that it may be assessed for import duties.

If it is assessed, the agency will not only pay whatever duties are owing, they will also charge a fixed fee for the service. They will then charge all these costs on to you before delivering the package.

If you are going to pay a fixed fee, it may be worthwhile ordering more stuff at one go to spread that fee over more models.

Your package won't always be assessed, but it's impossible to predict.

**Howard A Treesong**

I've only paid custom charges once and it was quite a sting. Bought £30 worth of fabric and paid £10 postage, and then gone done for almost another £30 customs. Customs only inspect a certain proportion of incoming packages, say a quarter, and they get charged, so it's a bit of a gamble.

Maelstrom likely won't post it as a "gift" because it isn't a gift, and that counts as fraud or something.

**Fafnir**

Customs pics randomly as to what they inspect, and when they do, they tend to go for larger parcels that are marked for having higher values.

I'm pretty sure that when I ordered from Maelstrom once, they either marked it down as either 'gift,' 'collectibles' or 'toy soldiers.' Forget which one (either it was them, Coolminiornot, or Reaper that marked it down as gift).

Either way, I have yet to be busted by customs.

**Scott-S6**

The charges levied by customs are generally quite small, tax and a small amount of duty. What throws it out for small orders is the fee charged by whoever's delivering it. £10-20 is common for couriers, for example.

**H.B.M.C.**

Almost every box I've got from Maelstrom has had £10 as the value. It's weird.

**MechaEmperor7000**

Mr. Burning wrote:
MechaEmperor7000 wrote: Lost Packages is my main concern about ordering online.

You are either a pensioner, don't get out much, or believe too many tales about interweb shopping. Considering the amount of items sold and dispatched on line lost packages are not really that big of a problem.

Maelstrom are okay, they respond quickly to issues.

As for customs charges and information maybe these will help?

http://canadaonline.about.com/od/customs/Canada_Customs_and_Border_Services.htm

http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/menu-eng.html
http://www.cbsa-asfc.gc.ca/trade-commerce/tariff-tarif/menu-eng.html

You are allowed $60 as a gift but it depends on how Maelstrom list your goods, ask Maelsrom before ordering how their goods are listed for customs then speak to customs or your postal service about any tariffs or charges.

I found that site not long after posting the thread. However I was unsure of what Maelstrom generally marked their merchandise as, and it didnt detail the random-check part.

Also, I ordered alot online, mostly from Amazon and Ebay, and have actually lost quite a number of packages, so I'm a little more than paranoid about it. Cant really tell if it's the fault of the Seller (while Ebay is disputable, I really dont think Amazon should fail to send out packages) or the Post Office. Another reason why I asked was because my dad once bought a set of Vaccum tubes for 30 bucks, but the Customs fee came at around 200 dollars, almost 7 times the cost of the package. I really dont wanna buy 5 Wraithguard for 60 then end up having to pay out the ass for them.

Some people mentioned that smaller packages tend to not get checked at all by customs, so would it be better for me to buy them in portions of 5's rather than as a whole order of 20?

**MrGiggles**

You may also want to take a look at Canadian vendors. Some of their pricing is reasonably attractive.

Granted, I'm not sure what you're looking for, but I checked the price of a Tactical Squad on Maelstrom and came up to $43.25 CAD. That's actually more than buying it direct from GW in Canada unless the folks t Maelstrom are offering a further discount on top of that. I've heard great things about Maelstrom as well, but right now, the conversion to Canadian Dollars just isn't being kind to them; to say nothing of the Customs charges.

If you're looking for domestic vendors, you can try the folks at www.miniwargaming.com in Welland or www.heavysupport.com in Toronto. I've not dealt with the folks in Welland previously, but I've heard good things. As to Heavy Support, it's pretty common to order from them. They've a good discount and you hit free shipping at $150 which is pretty easy to do when you're ordering minis.

**SonofGuilliman**

For Maelstrom, I've only been charged customs, at most $20, because there were books or gaming accessories in the parcel. If there are only miniatures in the parcel, I don't get charged.

SoG

**MechaEmperor7000**

Specifically I'm looking at the Wraithguards.

Given current exchange rates and taxes, buying from maelstrom comes to about 13 bucks or so. If I dont have to pay taxes (again, not so good with the import laws) then it's exactly 12 bucks

Buying from GW, it comes to roughly 20 bucks per Wraithguard

Buying from Heavy Support, it comes to 16 bucks per wraithguard. I live close enough that shipping is not an issue (I can walk to the place and pick it up).

Since I need 20 of the freaking buggers, I save 60 bucks or more over HS if I buy from Maelstrom.

**MrGiggles**

Nicely done MechaEmperor.

Strangely enough, I didn't think there was such a thing as 'cheap' Wraithguard.

**Mithrax**

I've ordered from Maelstrom a number of times, never got dinged with customs.

Ordered from Amazon US, got dinged.

Ordered from a third party bookseller in the US, got dinged.

Ordered artwork from the UK, no ding.

**JohnHwangDD**

Kilkrazy wrote:Maelstrom may refuse to label your package as a gift because it is illegal. .

Maelstrom *should* refuse to commit mail fraud - if they do, they could be in line for some serious penalties from Canadian Customs.

**MechaEmperor7000**

JohnHwangDD wrote:
Kilkrazy wrote:Maelstrom may refuse to label your package as a gift because it is illegal. .

Maelstrom *should* refuse to commit mail fraud - if they do, they could be in line for some serious penalties from Canadian Customs.

It's their main policy.

Also, at 13 bucks a pop, a single Wraithguard is about the same price as a Terminator at retail. Not exactly good on the wallet, but I'd rather pay 12 bucks for a 1.5 inch piece of metal rather than a 1.5 inch piece of plastic.

**JohnHwangDD**

Of course, what I want to know is why Canadians are so big on committing mail fraud.

It's like every single time to have stuff shipped, they're asking for it to be fraudulently marked as a "gift", when it's actually a sale.

**MechaEmperor7000**

dunno about others, but for me it's mainly the import tax and junk. After shipping and import tax, whatever you were originally trying to save is usually made up. If Customs does a check, forget about any savings, you'd be paying so much more.

**Empchild**

I honestly sell a lot to canada and have never had a customer tell me they needed to pay customs fees.

**plastictrees**

JohnHwangDD wrote:Of course, what I want to know is why Canadians are so big on committing mail fraud.

It's like every single time to have stuff shipped, they're asking for it to be fraudulently marked as a "gift", when it's actually a sale.

We are a simple people. The Postal Service confuses and baffles us so we attempt to destroy it at every opportunity.
We're not wild about the internet either but as long as it keeps bribing us with pornography we're cool.

**MechaEmperor7000**

Sometimes Beaurcracy just baffles me. Once I tried to get my passport renewed, the clerk told me I couldnt because my immigration papers couldnt expire. Not that my papers had expired, but because it COULD NOT expire. She then stormed off and another clerk told us to leave. Two months worth of shitstorm later I found out that they changed the format and I had to update my immigration papers first. Why couldnt the clerk have just told me that in the first place?

**JohnHwangDD**

plastictrees wrote:
JohnHwangDD wrote:Of course, what I want to know is why Canadians are so big on committing mail fraud.

It's like every single time to have stuff shipped, they're asking for it to be fraudulently marked as a "gift", when it's actually a sale.

We are a simple people. The Postal Service confuses and baffles us so we attempt to destroy it at every opportunity.
We're not wild about the internet either but as long as it keeps bribing us with pornography we're cool.

OK, I'm good with that answer.

BTW, whatever happened to Great Canadian Miniatures? Don't they cut you a good price?

**MechaEmperor7000**

30% discount, but shipping + Taxes again kinda ruins it. Maelstrom is better mainly because I dont pay shipping.

Also, the Site seems a tad bit shady to me. Has anyone had dealings with them before?

**theHandofGork**

My wife's last employer sold GPS units online to most countries in the world... except Canada. They found that the Canada postal system was assessing near 100% of their product.

YMMV when it comes to minis though.

**plastictrees**

MechaEmperor7000 wrote:30% discount, but shipping + Taxes again kinda ruins it. Maelstrom is better mainly because I dont pay shipping.

Also, the Site seems a tad bit shady to me. Has anyone had dealings with them before?

I used them once when I was living in Ontario, with no problems. I'm sure I would have used them again if I hadn't stopped buying GW minis entirely for a few years.

**MechaEmperor7000**

How much is GCM's Shipping costs? If it ranges up to around 20 bucks on average for an order of about 100, then it's better to buy at Heavy Support for me.

**hungryp**

Had a friend order some stuff from GCM, he had no problem with them.

**Shas'O...Crap**

I have an alternative suggestion for you Canadian 40Kers.

I run a Package Receiving Business for Canadians, i.e. you order your item to my warehouse, and then come down and pick it up. By doing it this way, you completely bypass Customs Fees. You will still have GST, and possibly Duty (depending upon Country of Manufacture). In my experience, my customers, on average, save about 35% over buying their item(s) locally or having them shipped to them directly in Canada. I am located in Sweet Grass, MT, about an hour south of Lethbridge. If I am too for away from your location in Canada for this to be practical, you may want to look online in your neck of the woods for a similar business.

Not sure if I would be violating rules by posting my website, so just PM me if you want more info.

We've been in business now for 8 years, 2+ years at our Sweet Grass location.

Let me know.